In spite of the Olympics fiasco (which admittedly is not VOOM's fault) VOOM is without a doubt the premiere source for HD content, PERIOD. Most all of VOOM's original content is AWESOME, particularly the Auction Channel, Equator, Ultra, Rave, Rush (okay, I'm not crazy about all the soccer on WorldSports, and the melting popcicles are of limited interest to me). I also love the really bad Japanese science fiction movies on MonstersHD. Now, if VOOM could just do something about getting the NFL Network in HD, and maybe do a deal with the Travel Channel ...
Keep up the good work, VOOM!

yeah! what he said!

Nice to see such an all-out endorsement! I agree!

Hes new. lol. I thought 6 HD channels on D* was cool for the 1st 6 months too. LMAO

Meet vurbano, our resident Party Pooper. :)

Vurbano:
Do you have a good signal and a good TV? Anybody that does and doesn't realize how great VOOM is needs to have their head examined. Just the Michael McDonald concert that's on RAVE right now is worth the price of admission. I've seen it five times now, and I'm blown away every time I see it. Maybe you need to consider an equipment upgrade...
Thanks again VOOM. Please don't go away.

Will he be saying that the Michael McDonald concert is worth the price of admission after he has seen it 30 times!!

Voom is on its last leg with me, double charged yet again this month.

I agree that VOOM's far from perfect, but right now it's currently on its way to owning the "High Definition" position in consumers' minds (see Ries, A. and Trout,J. (1981) Positioning, The battle for your mind, Warner Books - McGraw-Hill Inc., New York, 1981, ISBN 0-446-34794-9). I also agree that VOOM does certainly tend to repeat itself, and that some of it's content reeks (like the excessive soccer coverage for instance), but it's picture and sound quality is unsurpassed. And isn't that why you (and millions of other consumers) spent exhorbitant amounts on your HDTV? Give VOOM credit for making HD content like theirs available to the marketplace. If not VOOM, who else?

Unsurpassed PQ is a bit strong for a overly compressed signal. While it is very good it does not compare to OTA HD at this time. WM9 or MPEG4. I also have a very large screen HD system and have had a pro calibration. But I still would not give up VOOM. Where else can you get as many HD channels in one place. Now if they just up the bit rate.

Get on the phone and complain, and get a freee month of service everytime they screw up. If I go to my bank smeared in Big Mac special sauce and tell the rep. there that someone erroneously charged $20 to McD's down the street they'll put the payment on hold and investigate.

As I said, VOOM's not perfect, but at this point in time they're offering the best HD content in the marketplace. Give them a little slack, they're blazing some new territory here. And at the risk of sounding like a broken record, their original content is a fantastic example of what the HD medium has to offer. Hopefully they can overcome the naysayers and maintain their corporate board's support. I would hate to go back to cable TV's very limited HD options... Hang in there VOOM.

As I said, VOOM's not perfect, but at this point in time they're offering the best HD content in the marketplace. Give them a little slack, they're blazing some new territory here. And at the risk of sounding like a broken record, their original content is a fantastic example of what the HD medium has to offer. Hopefully they can overcome the naysayers and maintain their corporate board's support. I would hate to go back to cable TV's very limited HD options... Hang in there VOOM.That's the spirit! :up

I cut VOOM a great deal of slack in the programming content. The fact is that thre really isn't a lot of HD content to satisfy so many existing and potential channels. Production costs to do HD are much higher than SD and even converting movies to HD is a costly proposition. I think VOOM has done a very good job and the repeats are going to happen just as they do on Discovery BRAVOHD+ and the others. The fact is that there is a shortage of equipment, a shortage of HD experince in shooting and production and a shortage of dollars available without the ability to quicky recoup the cost. Time will help heal these problems but right now we have no choice but to be patient with what we have.

I can't complain, my PQ on VOOM is excellent, OTA is Excellent, Diectv is fair,
cable is fair... VOOM sound quality is excellent.... on cable or D* the PQ depends on the feed I'm getting from the broadcast being recieved, GIGO does apply in PQ reception. About repeats, as has been stated, there is only so much HD programing available out there and VOOM "does" offer the most HD programming of all the existing distributors. I would not have bought an HDTV at this time if it were not for VOOM, why bother. Also, as an example, I hardly ever watch the History Channel, Discovery, TLC anymore cause I've seen most everything (usually twice) except I do love DiscoveryHD... so, I agree, VOOM is the future in HDTV delivery, its only a baby, I believe it will grow up to be the all around best... I'm watching stuff I never watched before cause it looks so good....................!!!!!!!!!

well, he is from Mayberry
enough said

I can't complain, my PQ on VOOM is excellent, OTA is Excellent, Diectv is fair,
cable is fair... VOOM sound quality is excellent.... on cable or D* the PQ depends on the feed I'm getting from the broadcast being recieved, GIGO does apply in PQ reception. About repeats, as has been stated, there is only so much HD programing available out there and VOOM "does" offer the most HD programming of all the existing distributors. I would not have bought an HDTV at this time if it were not for VOOM, why bother. Also, as an example, I hardly ever watch the History Channel, Discovery, TLC anymore cause I've seen most everything (usually twice) except I do love DiscoveryHD... so, I agree, VOOM is the future in HDTV delivery, its only a baby, I believe it will grow up to be the all around best... I'm watching stuff I never watched before cause it looks so good....................!!!!!!!!!

My sentiments exactly. I would never watch a lot of the programming that now is consuming alot of my normal "checkers time"

As I said, VOOM's not perfect, but at this point in time they're offering the best HD content in the marketplace. Give them a little slack, they're blazing some new territory here. And at the risk of sounding like a broken record, their original content is a fantastic example of what the HD medium has to offer. Hopefully they can overcome the naysayers and maintain their corporate board's support. I would hate to go back to cable TV's very limited HD options... Hang in there VOOM.
Dont worry Dish or directv will buy Voom's bandwidth if it fails.

Vurbano:
Do you have a good signal and a good TV? Anybody that does and doesn't realize how great VOOM is needs to have their head examined. Just the Michael McDonald concert that's on RAVE right now is worth the price of admission. I've seen it five times now, and I'm blown away every time I see it. Maybe you need to consider an equipment upgrade...
Thanks again VOOM. Please don't go away.
My signal and equipment are just fine thankyou.

Meet vurbano, our resident Party Pooper. :)Contrary to what you might like to believe, I am far from a Voom flamer. Infact if you went over to AVS you might see people calling me Mr Voom, etc. Ive taken more flaming than anyone else there IMO over being a voom subscriber. But on this Forum, A Forum group of Voom subscribers I believe we should all be vocal about what we see as problems or shortcomings of the service, and not follow or support blindly. Lets deal with Reality. Voom advertises "the best" PQ of any service. Thats simply not true. It may be if we move to WM9 but not now. And it frustrates me that voom has the ability to combine the cinema channels etc and fulfill that promise but doesnt do it. ANd why not? because of the success of the current business model? 35k subs? Because of the optimism of the investers in the current business model? I think not. Wake up voom. You have the ability to still provide the most and the best. DO IT. The current model isnt working. You need 1.5 million subs just to break even. Get off your A$$, the ship is taking on water.

Oh BTW, about 45 days until October leases kick in. Got that new dish on our roofs yet?

Well you are "trading" promises I think Voom was planning on promising 39 HD channels, but without HDNet and InHD right now, now way they will break 40 HD channels. While I do agree we should all be very vocal about the key improvements Voom needs to make, I have to rag on you for even being down on the Olympics!!!! Heh...

If they combine Cinema channels right now they could offer the best, but not the MOST, like you said, WM9 SHOULD change that I just want Voom to know that once they go WM9 they better up the quality of every single channel, with the October leases it shouldn't be a problem at all. They should set and decide at exactly what bitrate they want to transmissions sent at (a quality level superior not equal to, all other DBS providers) and maintain it. Don't over compress and shove a million channels into the transponders just because you have them.

If Voom doesn't then the Voom supporters will gradually die down, of that I'm sure of as well. RainbowDBS needs to get creative to lure in subs... they aren't going to do it with $10 more a month and $200 activation fee without some serious WOW and POW in their lineup and quality.

If they combine Cinema channels right now they could offer the best, but not the MOST,

O really? who else offers 39-5 = 34 channels of HD?

If Voom Doesn't currently have the best PQ on the market who does?? LOL! I have tried Adelphia, and Direct, and both looked like crap on my t.v. Even with voom having minor issues with its PQ it stills blows the competitors away. Yea i haven't tried Dish on my TV, but i am sure its not any better than direct. Can't wait till Voom goes to WM9 than they will really start their "shock and awe campaign!" hehe....

If Voom doesn't then the Voom supporters will gradually die down, of that I'm sure of as well.
You dont die down from 35k subs. You turn off the lights and lock the doors.

If Voom Doesn't currently have the best PQ on the market who does?? LOL! I have tried Adelphia, and Direct, and both looked like crap on my t.v. Even with voom having minor issues with its PQ it stills blows the competitors away. Yea i haven't tried Dish on my TV, but i am sure its not any better than direct. Can't wait till Voom goes to WM9 than they will really start their "shock and awe campaign!" hehe....Darrel????? would you like to address this? With a Nine foot screen you can see the defects the most.

Dvlos, you need to brush up on your ciphering...Does anyone else offer near as much HD content? Seriously, your points are well taken, but VOOM still offers their original content, which is really their claim to fame.

O really? who else offers 39-5 = 34 channels of HD?

Isn't it at the moment 36? WHen they originally said 39? You take 31 HD channels you still have the "most" but you are not at where you originally told people. YOu will raise a whole other group of people who will complain about their LESS HD. I just hope they can secure a deal with Cablevision and offer InHD1/2, WM9, and get these damn dishes upgraded by early next year.

On a 9 foot screen anything you watch would probably be just average... Honestly who right now offers better PQ than vooms lineup? For people that own HDTV's their is only 1 choice and that is VOOM anything else is just flat out unacceptable!

You dont die down from 35k subs. You turn off the lights and lock the doors.

Please, Vurbano, don't give them any ideas. I want my VOOMTV.

If Voom Doesn't currently have the best PQ on the market who does?? LOL! I have tried Adelphia, and Direct, and both looked like crap on my t.v. Even with voom having minor issues with its PQ it stills blows the competitors away. Yea i haven't tried Dish on my TV, but i am sure its not any better than direct. Can't wait till Voom goes to WM9 than they will really start their "shock and awe campaign!" hehe....

Look you don't need other providers to KNOW what HD should look like. Compare Voom channels with OTA stations that transmit at 19.xx mbps like CBS, my ABC local is split now but even at 15mbps it looks freaking amazing. I don't care what the exact mbps it takes in WM9 or whatever but I do not want:

- Mosquito Noise

- Macroblocking/Pixelation during action sequences or fast cuts


Those are my problem priorities in their exact order of importance I want eliminated. Mosquito noise has improved across the board but it's still there. Macroblocking/Pixelation occurs (forget the Olympics that's NBC's problem) most often during movies on the Premium channel but that's mainly because other HD channels like Gallery, Auction, DiscoveryHD don't usually feature fast paced moving images.

If you've had access to channels like HDNet you have to admit their PQ is better. While everyone else is trying to trim down b/w of HD, Voom needs to pick it up and maintain it at a high standard. Networks also need to find a better way to recoup HDTV production costs instead of taking away pieces of quality from the transmission and calling it even.

Dvlos what kind of TV do you have? Mosquito Noise? What channels are you getting this noise on lol... My sound is fine other than some sound drops once and a while on a random movie channel. And after the new update my pixelation is almost completely eliminated on SD channels and none on HD channels.. Maybe its your setup or wiring? To me its night and day.. Knock Voom all you want, they are the best HDTV provider on the market period! And yes i have watched InHd1-2 when i had adelphia's hdtv pack, it was nice but just as nice as Hd News, and Rave in Concert or any of Vooms HD channels...

Actually maybe you should post up your equipment as well?

I am watching VaVaVoom via DVI (for sharpness) although I also use the component connection, on a Phillips 65" RPTV. I've had all my coax cables reset, I occassionally get a frame drop but overall this last firmware is pretty solid. So that I am understood here on this forum "mosquito noise" refers to the twinkling, shimmering, or sparkling effect that takes place on background objects, sometimes in rare instances solid deep colored foreground objects. This is more noticeable via the uncompressed DVI connection... Component looks good but it's a softer image, has less sharpness IMO than DVI so I stick with DVI. Voom's SD is great right now, if you want exampls of pixelation watch:

Bad Boys II or League of Extraordinary Gentlemen, there are several fights that take place in dark night time areas and the pixelation is exceptionally bad in those cuts. PBS is the worst HD around, I was watching "Secrets of the Dead: Fire in Rome" and their bandwidth is so low, any scene with fire in it was so heavily pixelated it was unwatchable!

I love Voom don't get me wrong, I just want them to bring alll the channels to the quality of the Tyson fight, or CBS OTA eventually.

Check out Shiriikami Mountains on Equator for a good example of mosquito noise.

I have a 57" Hitachi "F500a" and i use monster cable components "$100 ones", I also have a DVI-D cable but it does not look as good as the component cable by far. Weird because thought DVI is supposed to be better.. And run Monster cables for my audio, 1 set into TV and 1 set into surround receiver. Your Component cables are the only thing bringing a picture to your TV right? There is no Coax cable running from your box to TV right? I only have 1 coax coming from wall to box... Probably normal setup but just wanna make sure you are hooked up like me...And i don't really know alot about philps tv's but i know my Hitachi gets kick ass reviews from other owners.. Possibly your tv could be the issue...

Can we just close this thread now since we are going nowhere we haven't been 1000's of times before with this PQ issue! ;)

Vurbano:
Do you have a good signal and a good TV? Anybody that does and doesn't realize how great VOOM is needs to have their head examined. Just the Michael McDonald concert that's on RAVE right now is worth the price of admission. I've seen it five times now, and I'm blown away every time I see it. Maybe you need to consider an equipment upgrade...
Thanks again VOOM. Please don't go away.
This cracks me up! Who needs the equipment upgrade? :rolleyes:

Look there's nothing wrong with my TV.. did you read my post?

Compare CBS-OTA to Equator/Discovery. CBS has a clear advantage. I get some nice black areas in my RPTV, I don't buy Monster cables I think the advantage they give is very minimal, however I do use heavily shielded gold plated component cables (not supplied by Voom)... if my DVD can look flawless and noise-free then it's not the cables.

I've already done all the service adjustments I know how to, multipoint convergence, geometry, and color balancing corrections.

I have BOTH DVI and component connected.

Component - Softer images you notice less noise.

DVI - Sharper image - brighter color - unfortunately it highlights imperfections in transmission more.

Coax from STB to the TV, I'm a novice but COME ON!!! I'm not stupid.

DarrellP and Vurbano are you guys going to chime in on the PQ? Are you guys getting pristine quality and my TV is just screwed up?

Actually maybe you should post up your equipment as well?

I am watching VaVaVoom via DVI (for sharpness) although I also use the component connection, on a Phillips 65" RPTV. I've had all my coax cables reset, I occassionally get a frame drop but overall this last firmware is pretty solid. So that I am understood here on this forum "mosquito noise" refers to the twinkling, shimmering, or sparkling effect that takes place on background objects, sometimes in rare instances solid deep colored foreground objects. This is more noticeable via the uncompressed DVI connection... Component looks good but it's a softer image, has less sharpness IMO than DVI so I stick with DVI. Voom's SD is great right now, if you want exampls of pixelation watch:

Bad Boys II or League of Extraordinary Gentlemen, there are several fights that take place in dark night time areas and the pixelation is exceptionally bad in those cuts. PBS is the worst HD around, I was watching "Secrets of the Dead: Fire in Rome" and their bandwidth is so low, any scene with fire in it was so heavily pixelated it was unwatchable!

I love Voom don't get me wrong, I just want them to bring alll the channels to the quality of the Tyson fight, or CBS OTA eventually.

Check out Shiriikami Mountains on Equator for a good example of mosquito noise.

Excellent post, Dvlos, you took the words right out of my mouth. ;)

You know where I stand on PQ and my stance is unaltered in regards to Voom. Rave is the only channel that is close to pristine.

I feel the same way. I have used both Monster DVI and component cables with VOOM. I have decided on the component cables as the DVI does show too many imperfections of the VOOM PQ. Also on my Samsung DLP with DVI, the SD channels on Satellite only are cut off on all 4 sides. HD is ok. yes, I tried all other picture modes. LOCAL SD fills the screen but not Satellite. Only on component do I have no problem. I hope VOOM fixes that as well.

So you can't stop the critisism of the PQ until VOOM delivers on their promise of the best quality. So closing this thread will not end it, but it will continue. you got to deliver what you promise. Don't get me wrong VOOM PQ is good...even very good but not the best. Not what I bought a HD for and see on OTA HD.

Ha! I can't stand soft image I like to see good detail, I actually rearranged the room to put the TV farther away and mainly watch it with the DVI cable. I posted this like last month but I toned down Picture/Brightness/Color in my Phillips TV's service menu, for the DVI port. They were consistently 20-25 points higher than what was set for component. After playing with it for like 2 hours I was able to get comprable PQ from my DVI port and retain the sharpness. I still see the mosquito noise though. But the color balance, at least to my eyes was almost as good as the visual adjustments you can do via DVD (which for me only adjusts the Component Video ports on my TV for 480p.)

I feel the same way. I have used both Monster DVI and component cables with VOOM. I have decided on the component cables as the DVI does show too many imperfections of the VOOM PQ. Also on my Samsung DLP with DVI, the SD channels on Satellite only are cut off on all 4 sides. HD is ok. yes, I tried all other picture modes. LOCAL SD fills the screen but not Satellite. Only on component do I have no problem. I hope VOOM fixes that as well.

So you can't stop the critisism of the PQ until VOOM delivers on their promise of the best quality. So closing this thread will not end it, but it will continue. you got to deliver what you promise. Don't get me wrong VOOM PQ is good...even very good but not the best. Not what I bought a HD for and see on OTA HD.Voom PQ is steadily improving relative to Dish, which is doing 3 HD channels per transponder I think and my OTA signal, CBS is the only one giving me 18-19 mbps. The rest are prostituting their bandwidth with SD multicasting. I think my NBC HD is 14 mbps and ABC is at 14mbps. Voom may find themselves looking even better if this keeps up.

Vurbano, what's your take on ABC & 720p @ 14 mbps? Our ABC just added a crappy news channel but the HD still looks as good as ever, I rarely see any macro blocking or pixelating on ABC.

While I don't have 720p running on my TV, I can say that upconverted to 1080i, I got no macroblocking or pixelation. I received an e-mail for the engineer of the local ABC station that said ABC HD was getting no less then 14.5 mbps for HD at 720p, that the bitrate was variable and adjusted to the content. THe ABCNEWS station looks very bad here though, and during the last MNF game (which looked crisp) I couldn't even tune to 10-2 for some reason (it would come in and out).

Please, Vurbano, don't give them any ideas. I want my VOOMTV.
You WANT 2 movies per channel on 10 channels for 24 hours a day? Youve got to be kidding

Vurbano, what's your take on ABC & 720p @ 14 mbps? Our ABC just added a crappy news channel but the HD still looks as good as ever, I rarely see any macro blocking or pixelating on ABC.
lmao
dont ask me how, but my abc is 1080i..lol we have news now and a weather radar. SO MNF is about 14 mbps now. during the hall of fame game, I saw horizontal bars in the picture when athletes were running back to the huddle. I saw champ Bailey's head do that when he walked at the end of his interview. I saw a couple field goals that looked like I was looking at the picture through the heated air of a barbeque grill. And I saw the horizontal strips form when watching a bronze bust of "bobby" someone turn on the screen. Generally pixels were moving during close ups of fast action. I think the station needs to be 720p badly and im not sure why it isnt.

My sentiments exactly. I would never watch a lot of the programming that now is consuming alot of my normal "checkers time"In Mayberry ease, HD is to SD as Helen Crump is to Aunt Bee. :haha

Hey Verbano, did you happen to catch "DRUMS" on a premium channel last night? I wasn't particularly interested in the movie, but the PQ knocked me out! -- probably the best I have ever seen on VOOM. Just wondering if you caught that, and if you think it might have been a higher bit-rate than usual. Amazingly sharp IMHO. Could have been shown on HBO or CineMax. I don't remember.

I am still trying to get a sense for the high PQ you are so insistent about. I don't have OTA to compare, just VaVaVum.

...dont ask me how, but my abc is 1080i...I think the station needs to be 720p badly and im not sure why it isnt. Our ABC local station is also converting the network 720p to 1080i:


Converts ABC network feed 720P signal to 1080i. Owner Belo also does this undesirable conversion in Dallas (WFAA). Using sub-channel to broadcast news. Does Belo own your local station?

RAVEHD is the closest thing to WOW PQ that Voom currently has, it's close, but no cigar. Just about 2 mbps more bandwidth is all that's needed to make this channel literally "rock" (pun intended). I don't have the VaVa package so I can't see the movie channels. Too bad about your OTA, any chance you'll ever get them?

DarrellP I prefer the HD movie packages over DVDs, but then again you said you had DVHS and I'm sure you'll hop on HD-DVD (as will I) when it hits the market, but the PQ in those channels are pretty good, could also benefit from some bandwidth though, especially the action movies where it becomes painfully obvious. Or even if it was 14mbps but fixed bitrate not variable would make a difference.

I think RAVE is one of the best looking channels, I don't know if it's all the dark areas on screen that require less digital information than other more visually active channels or not, but it does look great. I think WorldSport/Rush/DiscoveryHD/HDNews/Rave/Gallery are the best looking channels Voom currently has, but IMO still hasn't reached the pristine clarity of a true CBS or even ABC HD telecast. Voom's airing of the Tyson fight was cool to attract new customers and bad for me, now I know what Voom can do over the satellite and eagerly anticipate the day it all looks that way.

I have noticed the Equator has improved a great deal in PQ. The same shows I saw before now have no sparkles or mosquito noise. And I looked for it. Seems much sharper and clear. I think they are making improvements, but at least they are really working on it. Wish Wilt or VOOM would directly address what they are doing technically more.

I have a feeling that we may see an announcement from VOOM about more channels with the new bird. But that an additional $10 a month will get you the new channels plus the bigger dish. I have no knowledge...just a marketing guess at this point.

Equator was really bad before, check out Eye Over Italy and Shiriikami Mountains and you will still notice mosquito noise. I'd say they are 85% there ... I want 100% though. It was worse before, I know that either the firmware or something on there end has improved quality of SD/HD across the board. There's just some more work that could be done.