Ok, post your questions here and I'll try to consolidate them into an FAQ about Linux and DVB in general.

There have been a few threads on Linux and DVB, but I'm hoping we can consolidate a lot of useful information into this one.


What is the BEST card for Linux?

Asked:
http://www.satelliteguys.us/free-air-pc-dvb-discussion/166656-best-card-linux-use.html

Answered:
Best is subjective, it really depends on what you want to accomplish with the card. What kind of computer you have also plays a significant role in the question since the card needs to be hooked up somehow. PCI, PCI Express, USB are all ways to connect and your options are limited by what your computer supports.

With any hardware and Linux one of the key factors is driver support. Without any driver support, or without reliable driver support, you will not be able to use the card under Linux. Once you have narrowed your selections to those cards with good driver support you need to think about what software you'll be running on Linux to access the card and confirm that software supports your choices.

DVB-S/QPSK cards are well supported under Linux, depending on the card, but DVB-S2/8PSK support is still limited. If you want a reliable hardware & software combination you should consider using a DVB-S/QPSK card initially until you're more experienced and willing to get your hands dirty with Linux. If you're looking at using Linux just to have access to DVB-S2/8PSK feeds, you should realize from the beginning that you most likley won't be just installing a polished Linux distribution and adding DVB support. You'll be checking source code out of repositories, applying patches, compiling and installing it, debugging driver issues, etc. It is not for the person new to Linux as it can already be frustrating trying to get supported cards up and running under Linux, nevermind the bleeding edge.

My current recommendation would be to consider the Twinhan 1020a PCI card, available online (search: Twinhan 1020a) for around $55 and supported under Linux and Windows. The Twinhan 1020a is also a supported card with TSReader, a great Windows application for looking at DVB/DSS information in great detail. Make sure you get the normal size one, not the low profile model. The normal size, original Twinhan 1020a supports DVB (FTA & DishNetwork) and DSS (DirecTV) standards which can be very interesting with TSReader.

I also recommend the Geniatech Digistar (search: Geniatech DVB PCI) which is available for around $50. I'm am using this card with Linux and MythTV and it is working for me. I have used this card a lot more under Linux than the Twinhan, but since the Twinhan has DSS and TSReader support I would recommend it over the Geniatech at this point.


More questions to follow, including:
What's the best Linux distro for DVB?
What software should I use with Linux?
How many tuners can I have under Linux?
And of course YOUR questions. Post away.

Great stuff Thanks

I gave up a while ago trying to get AMC 21 to tune with MythTV, I must get around to having another go at it.

One problem I found was that most of the "How To" guides are written by hackers and go into a great detail about stuff that isn't really needed or doesn't work on our Sats.
It leaves this Linux beginner confused.

By the way I have a Twinhan 102g card it seems well supported under Linux using MythTV and Kaffiene

Good idea. Couple of suggestions:

1. I have an old box that I want to use for experiments with DVB cards. What minimum requirements do I need?
2. Manufacturers such as Skystar produce various models of DVB cards, which is best for my box? E.g. Skystar produces a II and an HD model. The II appears to handle HD just fine. The HD model is about twice the price of the II, so under what circumstances do I need to go for the more expensive model?

gillham
Thanks for starting this great topic. May be we also need Windows Sat FAQ too. Especially now, when WMC 7 reportedly now supports DVB-S2. Please give as much detail info as you know about setting up a DVB-S/S2 PCI / PCI-E card under Linux. If some newbies can't understand it on a first run, they'll come back later, when actually trying to use the card, not just considering buying it.

I also have some questions:

Will speed limitations of PCI bus create a problem with watching or recording DVB-S2 MPEG4 channels? Or with using a dual tuner DVB-S2 card?

How these cards interact with onboard H.264 Decoder Chip of graphics cards? What sat software and graphics cards models are better suited to work jointly with DVB-S2 sat cards for decoding MPEG2/4 in hardware instead of using the PC Proc?

Is it possible to record a received Mpeg4 sat signal to file? In what format or container - .ts ? Or directly from graphics card MPEG decoder - again in what format?

What are the best links & forum sites on the topic? I think that a myth of complexity using Sat Cards compare to receivers is mostly caused by lack of systemic info in simple, compact and complete format, a DIY PC user can understand. Sat cards aren't that much harder to install and setup than any other PC components - anyway one has to go through some learning curve every time adding new components to a PC. But Newegg and NCIX don't usually complain about lack of customers...

Gillham, just to update where I'm at (my earlier thread you linked to), I've got a 1020a (PCI) on the way - expect it in sometime this week.
The PC is currently running Fedora 10 plus have the bulk of the rpmfusion packages added. Was trying to get an iSCSI target machine setup for the back-end storage, but, due to circumstances beyond my control, that was tabled until further notice.
Currently just have a single 500G SATA drive and plan to add a couple of 1T drives before long.
Also, as my luck would have it, my son nailed my 10ft dish with the tractor this weekend, so there's a step back.
Now working on getting the other 10' setup in it's place... yeesh - this never ends, does it?
ANYWAY,
Kaffeine and MythTV are both loaded and waiting to be tested with the 1020 - any other software options I should look for?

Thanks for doing this! I'm running Ubuntu, and VLC is playing anything I throw at it with my Twinhan 102g -- 420, 4:2:2, HD, and I'll need to wait for a 4:2:2 HD feed to see if it can handle that.

As for Myth, it drove me nuts when I used it -- sometimes programs would work, sometimes not. Sometimes schedules would show up, sometimes I'd need to reboot and reconnect multiple times. Recording was a crapshoot, I'd usually get a random error and then other times it'd work.

What about playing H.264 encoded TS files? Can you do it using your Graphics Card H.264 Decoder Chip to unload the proc? Do you use any extra soft for this?

Haven't tried VLC. Have to give it a go once I get the TwinHan in...

What are the differences between the Twinhan 1020a and 102g? I want to buy one soon, but not sure which one to get...

I have a Viewsat Ultra Lite, but it doesn't support AC3 or HD. I already have a home theater PC (running Ubuntu 8.10) behind my TV so I figured I might as well get one of these PCI receivers.

What are the differences between the Twinhan 1020a and 102g? I want to buy one soon, but not sure which one to get...

The key difference is the 1020a supports DSS in addition to DVB-S. While you might not find DSS useful, using a tool like TSReader you can look at the unencrypted stuff on DSS as well. To me that is worth something.

You have to be careful with the 1020a and make sure you get the full height card. The low profile (similar to 102g or just a 102g mislabeled?) 1020a card does not support DSS.

Check here: ptth://www.coolstf.com/tsreader/hardware.html

Nice link...bookmarked it.

Looks like I'm going to get a 1020a. Found them on ebay for $54.99/free shipping. I may have to upgrade my processor though...after doing some reading on the card it looks like to get HD I may need some more power.

ASUS M3A78-EM Mobo (has on board ATI Radeon HD 3200 graphics and HDMI out)
AMD Sempron 64 3400+ Manila 1.8GHz single-core
2 gig DDR2 800
500 gig western digital hdd, 7200 rpm
Ubuntu 8.10

Would I need to upgrade the processor? It is socket AM2 so it wouldn't be hard. I found a 2.5GHz dual-core on newegg for 50 bucks so it wouldn't be that big of a deal if I needed to. I assume that one would be able to do the job if I need to upgrade.

ASUS M3A78-EM Mobo (has on board ATI Radeon HD 3200 graphics and HDMI out)

Under Windows you could offload decoding to this card. I don't think you can offload much on Linux with ATI chipsets yet. You could search for XvMC or XvBA. You might consider an NVidia 8xxx / 9xxx card that supports VDPAU with mythtv or mplayer if this board has a video card slot on it.


Would I need to upgrade the processor? It is socket AM2 so it wouldn't be hard. I found a 2.5GHz dual-core on newegg for 50 bucks so it wouldn't be that big of a deal if I needed to. I assume that one would be able to do the job if I need to upgrade.$50 for a processor is going to be similar to some new video cards. 2.5Ghz should be plenty fast enough for MPEG2 and MPEG4. I use a dual core 2.33ghz and only have trouble with HD quicktime playback since the decoder is single threaded. It works but has a few frame drop problems in highly complex scenes.

It depends on what software you use, but I would consider a VDPAU - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia video card first, if you have a PCIe x16 slot available. I see some 9400GT cards for < $50 and they are on the list of supported chipsets. Or both.. :)

I will buy upgrades before switching to windoze. I will probably make these purchases over the next month or 2. The reason I want this is so I can pick up the AC3 audio encoded FTA channels, but first I need to get my multple LNB's installed. Right now I am only receiving 123W and 119W (only for NASA) so I don't need it until I get an LNB aimed at the satellite with all the PBS stations.

I decided to go with these:
Newegg.com - AMD Athlon X2 7550 Kuma 2.5GHz 2 x 512KB L2 Cache 2MB L3 Cache Socket AM2+ 95W Dual-Core Processor - Processors - Desktops (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819103628)
Newegg.com - MSI N9400GT-MD1G GeForce 9400 GT 1GB 128-bit GDDR2 PCI Express 2.0 x16 HDCP Ready Video Card - Desktop Graphics / Video Cards (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814127398)
NIB FTA TWINHAN VISIONPLUS 1020A DVB-S SATELLITE CARD - eBay (item 250440021620 end time Jul-07-09 20:37:30 PDT) (http://cgi.ebay.com/NIB-FTA-TWINHAN-VISIONPLUS-1020A-DVB-S-SATELLITE-CARD_W0QQitemZ250440021620QQcmdZViewItemQQptZLH_DefaultDomain_0?hash=item3a4f637674&_trksid=p3286.c0.m14&_trkparms=65:15|66:2|39:1|240:1318|301:1|293:1|294:50)

The 1020a has 2 coax ports on it. Are these 2 inputs or a loop through or something else? I couldn't find the specs online....I would like to receive OTA through a PCI receiver as well, but I think the 1020a is FTA only and doesn't support OTA. Is this correct?

I decided to go with these:
Newegg.com - AMD Athlon X2 7550 Kuma 2.5GHz 2 x 512KB L2 Cache 2MB L3 Cache Socket AM2+ 95W Dual-Core Processor - Processors - Desktops (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819103628)
Newegg.com - MSI N9400GT-MD1G GeForce 9400 GT 1GB 128-bit GDDR2 PCI Express 2.0 x16 HDCP Ready Video Card - Desktop Graphics / Video Cards (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814127398)
NIB FTA TWINHAN VISIONPLUS 1020A DVB-S SATELLITE CARD - eBay (item 250440021620 end time Jul-07-09 20:37:30 PDT) (http://cgi.ebay.com/NIB-FTA-TWINHAN-VISIONPLUS-1020A-DVB-S-SATELLITE-CARD_W0QQitemZ250440021620QQcmdZViewItemQQptZLH_DefaultDomain_0?hash=item3a4f637674&_trksid=p3286.c0.m14&_trkparms=65:15%7C66:2%7C39:1%7C240:1318%7C301:1%7C293:1%7C294:50)

The 1020a has 2 coax ports on it. Are these 2 inputs or a loop through or something else? I couldn't find the specs online....I would like to receive OTA through a PCI receiver as well, but I think the 1020a is FTA only and doesn't support OTA. Is this correct?

Those look like good parts. I bought my Twinhan from what looks like the same seller but a different eBay id. That board is working well with my TSReader and I am debating buying a second one to have a spare in case this one dies and I can't easily locate another 1020a with DVB-S/DSS support.

The 2nd port is for loop out as you guessed. To do OTA you should look at the Hauppauge HVR-1600. Around $50 also and both the analog and digital sides are fully supported under Linux. I like the variant with the SVIDEO + RCA connectors instead of the mini breakout cable. It works with normal cables.

I just found a Pinnacle usb OTA digital receiver. I lost it over a year ago, lol. Good find. Do you know if it supported by Ubuntu? I plan on doing some more research on it tonight....gotta go add a multi switch to my FTA setup right now :)

I just found a Pinnacle usb OTA digital receiver. I lost it over a year ago, lol. Good find. Do you know if it supported by Ubuntu? I plan on doing some more research on it tonight....gotta go add a multi switch to my FTA setup right now :)

I would guess it is supported as they sold the products to Hauppauge and the Hauppauge USB stick is supported. What is the model number / part number off of it? Plug it into your Linux box and check dmesg output.

I wonder which Media Center works the best with the Twinhan 1020a?

Freevo Media Centre | Home Theatre Platform HTPC & PVR (http://freevo.sourceforge.net/)
Moovida, the free media player - play all your files - AVI, mp3, MKV, DivX, MOV, MP4 (http://www.fluendo.com/elisa/)
XBMC Media Center for Mac OS X, Windows and Linux (http://xbmc.org/)
MythTV, Open Source DVR (http://www.mythtv.org/)
LinuxMCE (http://www.linuxmce.com/)

I wonder which Media Center works the best with the Twinhan 1020a?

I use MythTV, but it has a few issues with DVB-S. For just playback you can use mplayer or kaffeine.

I tried the Pinnacle USB receiver and couldn't get it to work right away. Didn't try much as I was pretty busy over the weekend. I did try it in Windows just to make sure it worked, and found out it is a PCTV HD Pro (and somehow I have two of them. No idea how that happened). I did some Googling and found some people that got them working in older versions of Ubuntu, but never saw anyone that has a working one in 8.10 or 9.04. I forgot about dmesg an will have to look at it tonight.

What kind of problems does MythTV have with DVB-S? And have you tried the other media centers I listed above?

:EDIT:

The key difference is the 1020a supports DSS in addition to DVB-S. While you might not find DSS useful, using a tool like TSReader you can look at the unencrypted stuff on DSS as well. To me that is worth something.

DSS is what Directv uses, right? The only unencrypted channels from a subscription provider that I have interest in is the NASA channel from Dish Network at 119W, but that isn't DSS. I wasn't aware that there were unencrypted DSS channels. What all is available in DSS that's unencrypted? I have found quite a few 102g cards on ebay that are a lot cheaper than the 1020a cards and I would rather buy the cheaper one without DSS support if I am not even interested in any of the unencrypted DSS stuff.

What kind of problems does MythTV have with DVB-S? And have you tried the other media centers I listed above?

It has trouble scanning things on occasion and is sometimes slow to tune (2-5 seconds sometimes) to new channels. I have found I can manually add stuff to the database to get around some issues. The channel changing speed doesn't matter really if you're using it to record shows anyway as you're not flipping channels real-time. I recently got a DVB-S2 card so I will be experimenting with that on Linux and MythTV.

I haven't tried those other options, I already use MythTV for OTA and Dish SD.


I wasn't aware that there were unencrypted DSS channels. What all is available in DSS that's unencrypted? I have found quite a few 102g cards on ebay that are a lot cheaper than the 1020a cards and I would rather buy the cheaper one without DSS support if I am not even interested in any of the unencrypted DSS stuff.The only unencrypted channels are the typical "barker" channels talking about DirecTV and I think the movie preview channel. Basically the same channels you would get with an unsubscribed receiver. I don't see any 102g cards cheaper on eBay myself, but the 1020a is preferred if you are interested in TSReader IMHO.

Last days we discussed DSS goodies here.

Last days we discussed DSS goodies here.

Thanks, found it. I had this thread bookmarked. :) I guess the cat and the bag were separated already.

In what format PC Cards can record sat signals?
What are advantages and drawbacks of using sat cards under Linux compare to WMC?

In what format PC Cards can record sat signals?
What are advantages and drawbacks of using sat cards under Linux compare to WMC?

Usually it depends on the software. Often it is an MPEG Transport Stream, but you can also plain MPEG.

Advantages:
You can have multiple frontends and backends all in the same system. (MythTV system on Linux) So you can have one system that records OTA and another that records DVB-S and the frontends just see recordings to watch.
Hardware drivers are standardized on the Video4Linux API. You don't have to worry about BDA versus non BDA or whatever. As long as your card is supported.
DVB-S / QAM is directly supported, not via some shim layer.
Generally there are no CODECs to round up and fiddle with constantly.
Things like SD/HD/MPEG2/MPEG4/4:2:0/4:2:2 are generally software problems and are supported without needing special hardware. You just need *fast* hardware.
You're running on a no cost Linux operating system with no cost software.

Disadvantages:
A lot more configuration required and you need to be familiar with Linux and comfortable with the command line to get it all setup. You can do a lot with the prepackaged distributions like "mythbuntu" but eventually you'll need to dig into something further.
You need to pay $20/year for program guide information.
You have to round up some dedicated hardware. MythTV doesn't really work out too well when you're dual booting the PC from Windows to Linux.
You usually need a very capable system. This can get expensive.
Also, great tools like TSReader only run under Windows.

In what format PC Cards can record sat signals?

The easiest way is just to record the transport stream directly. I am using a combination of dvbstream and mplayer. I have shell scripts set up that look like this for just watching:

#!/bin/sh

dvbstream -f 12140 -p v -s 30000 -v 49 -a 52 -o | mplayer -ao alsa -vo xv -fs -vf pp=lb -

and this for watching and recording both:

#!/bin/sh

dvbstream -f 12140 -p v -s 30000 -v 49 -a 52 -o | tee /mnt/sda2/$(date +%Y%m%d%H%M%S).ts | mplayer -ao alsa -vo xv -fs -vf pp=lb -

(My example is for the PBS HD channel on AMC21. Change the disk location to the folder of your choice.)

After you have it recorded, you can convert it to MPEG2 for burning on a DVD with mencoder, thusly:

mencoder /mnt/sda2/a.ts -o /mnt/sda2/a.mpg -oac copy -ovc lavc -lavcopts vcodec=mpeg2video:keyint=10:vbitrate=4000 -mpegopts format=dvd:vaspect=16/9 -of mpeg -vf scale=640:360,pp=lb,harddup

To move the dish with diseqc 1.2 I use a program called xdipo, available here: satellite (http://panteltje.com/panteltje/satellite/index.html)

I hope this is helpful.

Thanks guys!

dhubsith

Any difference in shell scripts for MPEG4 stream, or burning MPEG4 movie from a recorded MPEG4 TS to a DVD?

Anyone has experience in MPEG4 decoding from TS with a graphics card proc? Any extra soft is needed for that? What TV package allows that on Linux and using what options & plugins?

Thanks guys!

dhubsith

Any difference in shell scripts for MPEG4 stream, or burning MPEG4 movie from a recorded MPEG4 TS to a DVD?

Anyone has experience in MPEG4 decoding from TS with a graphics card proc? Any extra soft is needed for that? What TV package allows that on Linux and using what options & plugins?

My receiver card will not receive MPEG4 so I can't say for certain, but I'm pretty sure you could record the transport stream just as if it was MPEG2. Mencoder can record MPEG4, it's just a case of specifying the right codec. I've used Xvid in the past.

The thing to watch in all cases is the vbitrate, make it too low and the picture becomes blocky, set too high and it takes too much space. I am using 4000, which seems to be a good compromise.

Also, if you are recording a 4:3 video (640x480), and you want to keep it that way, you don't need to do the crop and scale. My example was for recording a HD channel.

(My example is for the PBS HD channel on AMC21. Change the disk location to the folder of your choice.)


What size dish are you using? I am in the research/shopping phase at the moment and I want to make sure I can get this channel.

Anyone has experience in MPEG4 decoding from TS with a graphics card proc? Any extra soft is needed for that? What TV package allows that on Linux and using what options & plugins?

If you get an NVidia graphics card that supports VDPAU under Linux you can offload decoding. I'm using an NVidia ION based Atom board with MythTV (and mplayer as well) with VDPAU support and it easily plays back HD content through the GPU.

So far I am aware of mythtv and mplayer having VDPAU support, but I haven't really looked at anything else.

My receiver card will not receive MPEG4 so I can't say for certain, but I'm pretty sure you could record the transport stream just as if it was MPEG2. Mencoder can record MPEG4, it's just a case of specifying the right codec. I've used Xvid in the past.

All PC DVB cards should support receiving MPEG4. The card really just tunes the DVB-S/QPSK (or DVB-S2/8PSK or a different combination) signal and passes the transport stream to the software. It doesn't matter if the content inside the TS is MPEG2/MPEG4 or some other codec as it handled by the software.

Obviously not all cards will support DVB-S/QPSK and DVB-S2/8PSK modulation as the tuner and demodulator are hardware features, but those are distinct from video codecs.

What size dish are you using? I am in the research/shopping phase at the moment and I want to make sure I can get this channel.

I am using a 31" (80cm) Fortec Star, it's the one in my icon. My LNBF is an Invacom SNH-031. It's mounted on my (flat) roof, with an unobstructed view to the south. I wanted to use as small a dish as I could get away with because we have high winds in this area and I wanted as little load on my roof as possible. On the other hand I got the best LNBF I could.

Hope this helps.

How does the Twinhan 1020a handle 22KHz switching and Diseqc ports? Anyone have any experience with this? I will be using it with two 4x1 Diseqc switches going into one 22KHz switch.

Doing OK, but each DiSEqC is different, some of them required a mod ( adding a capacitor to cut noise ).

Can someone please help tell me what option are available in Linux to watch 4:2:2 feeds? I am presently set up for mythtv. Does mythtv support 4:2:2? Does VDR? If VLC is the only option, can it control my Sg2100 motor? Thanks.

Thanks for the info, I am trying to decide weather to purchase a Geniatech Digistar 2HD or a Technotrend DVB-S2 to test a CaptiveWorks LMC-4000HD. These are the only 2 cards that support beta testing.