Hey guys,

I was wondering whats the best OTA HDTV compatible PVR with an electronic programing guide. DVB and multimedia playback would also be a plus? Does the Pansat 9200 or azbox have an epg for OTA channels?

DTVPal DVR: HD, dual tuners, 7 day guide & 30 hours of HD space. Great OTA HD PVR receiver! :up

DTVPAL.COM (http://www.dtvpal.com/)

DTVPAL DVR (http://www.sears.com/shc/s/p_10153_12605_05757709000P)

Downside: Acts more like a VCR than a current-gen DVR, in that you have to manually program time and channel for each event (you can't just create a timer for any event called "name"). This means that if ABC or Fox or whomever decides to re-slot your favorite TV show, or cancel it, the DTVPal will not correct the timer, and record whatever comes on in the old slot.

CowboyDren, please let us know what better HD OTA PVR is available.

That's easy: TiVo HD. Two onboard ATSC tuners, very good search and timer systems. Downside to it is that you have either a monthly, yearly, or lifetime (of the box, not your account) subscription fee. Something like $13/mo or $130/yr or $400/lifetime (of the box, not your account). The other downside is that it requires access to a phone line or broadband internet. If there's a broadband connection, it also enables Netflix Watch Instantly and Amazon VOD streaming services, with more to come. The TiVo HD also has the excellent Recommendations system, which the DTVPal does not.

Thanks CoyboyDren, great info.

You have two really good options fats.

Of note, each unit MSRP's for about $300, but can be had for about $260. Walmart.com will sell you a TiVo HD for $258, and DigitalStar.com has the DTVPal DVR for $259.95. Should be a bunch on eBay, too...

I have to agree with Cowboy...the TivoHD is your best bet for fully functional DVR with all the bells and whistles. However, I would also suggest getting your mits on an old Sony DHG-HDD250/500 with free TVGuide On Screen (TVGOS) if the price is right. Pros: one time purchase price and the TVGOS digital guide data is freely supplied by the local CBS/PBS affiliate. Cons: TVGuide can try your patience, little support for the old Sony boxes, and the Sony while also digital cable ready (i.e, supports cable card) is only a single-tuner box. Although I've never used a DTV Pal, I can tell by the general comments that I would place it behind the TivoHD and Sony HD DVR.

It really is between the DTVPal DVR ($250) and the TiVo HD (about $700 with lifetime service). Each is worth just about what they cost -- you get what you pay for. $700 is a lot of money. But you may not be happy with a device that is worth only a little more than a third.

Personally, I'm hesitant to spend $400 on a subscription for a $300 device, nor would I pay $700 for a Moxi (even if it had OTA capability). I'm usually bored with a given toy or appliance in three years, and I expect that in three years, TiVo will have a better device than the one that's on the market now. If you can handle $130 at a whack, a TiVo with annual subscription is the way to go. Then again, how long has the Series 2 been on the market? It doesn't do ATSC, let alone HD, so it doesn't matter, but TiVo is pretty good about getting their mileage (development costs) out of a given platform. What could be better than a TiVo HD? A TiVo HD with four tuners and DLNA/UPnP media server. Wish in one hand, want in the other, see which fills up first. ;)

The Pal DVR has TVGOS as well. It works like a charm. For $250 you really cannot beat it IMO. I'm not sure what bad "general comments" have been posted recently. They did have issues in the past, but the updates have fixed all of the problems that I have had.

Personally, I'm hesitant to spend $400 on a subscription for a $300 device, nor would I pay $700 for a Moxi (even if it had OTA capability).The Moxi is $800.


I'm usually bored with a given toy or appliance in three years, and I expect that in three years, TiVo will have a better device than the one that's on the market now.That is always the case.

I think the key issue here is that if you want the "best" PVR, it is going to cost big bucks. Of course, the specifics will depend on what you mean by "best".

Good Point Bicker, and thanks for all the feed back guys. I guess I was really hoping there was a good fta box that would do hd ota, becuase I may decide to get into the fta hoppy one day. But a good EPG would be important. I may just bite the bullet and subscribe to a sat company. Comcast HD is a little less than stable. I watch shows in HD on CBS and NBC and I see video and audio loss. I wish the Dish vs Tivo verdict would be finalized!

I really like my Dish 722, but I'd prefer a 722k because it has dual OTA tuners and dual Sat tuners. Unfortunately, Dish SD picture quality sucks (even on the all-MPEG4 Eastern Arc), and you have to subscribe to locals from Dish to get the OTA EPG to do anything useful. If you don't subscribe to locals from Dish, all the EPG says is "Digital Service."

Packages and prices are here:

DISH Network - Ways To Save - 1.888.825.2557 (http://dishnetwork.com/packages/dda/default.aspx)

In Kansas City, Comcast's Digital Starter service costs as much as DDA Silver, and has about half the total channels with a quarter the HD content that Dish has. You lose Comcast's pretty good OnDemand service, but if you keep broadband from Comcast, you can make that up in other ways.

Cowboy Dren,

Do you need an antenna for Dishnet hd locals?

fats, it depends on your market. In Kansas City, Dish carries ABC, CBS, CW, Fox, My Network, and NBC in high-def via satellite, so I don't need an antenna, but having one frees up the satellite tuners to do other things. Using an antenna also produces higher picture quality than satellite HD, and it's often more reliable than the dish, especially in foul weather.

Thanks for the info :)

Downside: Acts more like a VCR than a current-gen DVR, in that you have to manually program time and channel for each event (you can't just create a timer for any event called "name").That's really not a fair assessment. First, it discounts the DTV Pal's ability to record two programs at once while watching a pre-recorded program and its ability to rewind live TV.

How often do shows get "re-slotted" and you don't know about it? $10+ a month seems a steep price to pay to make this automatic for as often as it happens.

I agree with you harshness. It has a very similar feel to the Dish Network receivers. Dual tuners, features like skip 30 seconds ahead or 10 seconds back, TVGOS and ethernet updates. Hard to beat it for $250 + tax and no fees after this.

Apparently, it's $299, everywhere, now.

AVS Forum - View Single Post - DTV Pal Plus DVR (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showpost.php?p=17325078&postcount=41)

If you can find it for $250, please post to that thread and let them know. (Or post here, and I'll post there...)

How often do shows get "re-slotted" and you don't know about it? $10+ a month seems a steep price to pay to make this automatic for as often as it happens.

Since I don't watch live TV, I don't watch commercials, and I don't usually watch the teasers at the end of the show (or they get clipped by the timer), nor do I subscribe to a dead-tree TV guide...It happens pretty frequently, actually...


I agree with you harshness. It has a very similar feel to the Dish Network receivers. Dual tuners, features like skip 30 seconds ahead or 10 seconds back, TVGOS and ethernet updates. Hard to beat it for $250 + tax and no fees after this.

Other than being crippled by lack of name-based recording (which doesn't make sense, because you can do name-based search), you are right, the DTVPal is mostly functional. Don't forget that the $13 per month for TiVo service also pays for access to a lot of digital content that the DTVPal can't get at this time (nor is it likely to get). It also pays for the TiVo Recommendations system, which I hear is pretty good.

[edit] You know what, it does make sense. By setting timers like a VCR, the box doesn't have to be in standby 24/7 like other DVRs do. Requires a lot less powerful processor, too.

I'm just making sure that the most pertinent facts are on the table. If I could get away with having only two OTA tuners in a DVR, and name-based timers weren't absolutely critical, I'd probably buy the DTVPal.


Apparently, it's $299, everywhere, now.

AVS Forum - View Single Post - DTV Pal Plus DVR (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showpost.php?p=17325078&postcount=41)

If you can find it for $250, please post to that thread and let them know. (Or post here, and I'll post there...)

Dish Network DTVPal DVR (http://digitalstar.com/product/DTVPal-DVR.aspx), $259.95, via Google Product Search (http://shopping.google.com). I don't think I have an AVS Forum account.

I am about ready to cancel by dish service and get an antenna and would like to know if this will work. I have a pvr 508 collecting dust in the closet and a tv without a digital tuner and want to know if I buy a HDTV antenna can I use the pvr 508 to act as the convert box? I'm not concerned about getting HD for right now I just want to be able to get the single to play on my TV.

I am about ready to cancel by dish service and get an antenna and would like to know if this will work. I have a pvr 508 collecting dust in the closet and a tv without a digital tuner and want to know if I buy a HDTV antenna can I use the pvr 508 to act as the convert box?

No.

Dish Network DTVPal DVR (http://digitalstar.com/product/DTVPal-DVR.aspx), $259.95, via Google Product Search (http://shopping.google.com). "This item is on back order" And as a result, it won't let you order it at that price.

Roger that.

I loved the DTV Pal Plus DVR (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showpost.php?p=17325078&postcount=41) while it worked. (We ordered it in April I think) For what it cost it wasn't worth what it cost with the short life. My sister also bought one, her's last a couple of months longer than mine.
We have decided not to replace it. Hopefully someone else will come out with something soon that works better/longer without a fee or phone line.

I have the TiVOHD, and as much as I hate paying the $13 a month I wouldn't be without it. The user interface is the best out there. A two year old could uses it. I dropped my cable so it's nice to have an abundance of good programming saved up for the end of the TV season, that is when I used to lean on my cable networks the heaviest.

We have decided not to replace it. Hopefully someone else will come out with something soon that works better/longer without a fee or phone line.

Patti, if it's less than a year old, it should be their burdon to fix it. What stopped working?

Read the warranty DISH does not stand behind it for a year like they do with other products.

Read the warranty DISH does not stand behind it for a year like they do with other products.

Yea, I think the warranty is only 90 days. That is the one thing I really don't like about the unit.

True, they pretty much told me they wouldn't do anything about it.
I have a feeling it's not built to last since my sisters lasted only 6 months and ours quit after 4 months.
We don't have a landline so this was perfect for us. Basically we just wanted it to record because of my husband's work he misses the shows he likes.