Thread: Channel Mapping on W5 at this time

Originally Posted by tvropro

Mike Kohl said Friday that there are about 25 satellites in when you do a MR and maps. He did not mention generics. The 4D does not load those out of the box. Now I wonder this... lets say you could upgrade before Dec 31 to CC data, did your MR on W5 got your programming then went to G1 you should have everything, right?

Ok I confused generics with the ones that are already in the receiver, just thought those where generic because they had no real information as they sit, my bad!!!!
Terry

Originally Posted by TMair

Ok I confused generics with the ones that are already in the receiver, just thought those where generic because they had no real information as they sit, my bad!!!!
Terry

I understand that many are hopeful their 4d receiver will not become a boat anchor. I have known Mike Kohl back from the days with Gary Bourgois and if there is a discrepancy he would be quick to help clear things up as so would I. The main reason I took a receiver and did the master reset on W5 was to see exactly what would happen and to help someone unaware avoid a hassle down the line.

Again; if one only wants to view the programming on W5 this is great news, however for the one who wants to see if there is any FTA DCII signal out there that is mapped into the generics well sadly this is not a good thing.

All the satellites are not listed after a master reset! This makes the receiver (as a dish mover) a pile of junk.

I hope everyone will grasp the meaning of what I just typed in above in bold. If Gary Bourgois were still alive today he would be shouting on his radio show the ramifications of what is about to happen.

If anyone is using their 4d receiver as a dish mover to view FTA DVB signals with a slaved dvb receiver they would not want to have programming from W5 with the info the way it is at this time.

Is is good to have hope? Sure, but I have to be realistic and rely on what has happened in the past to see that people will be misled by Motorola right up till the end and the consumer, you and me, will be left in the dark at the end.

Originally Posted by stargaze;2276880[FONT=Verdana

All the satellites are not listed after a master reset! This makes the receiver (as a dish mover) a pile of junk. [/FONT]

This is 100% true. Your receiver will become an old ANALOG ONLY receiver with a minimum amount of satellites to use for even positioning to use with DVB. AND NO WAY TO ADD MORE SATELLITES. This would be bogus and needs to be addressed now. I can do more with my old Monterey 50 or HTS 10 plus I have here.

Like I said already if it comes down to no extra satellites and generic maps, I will not subscribe to W5/AI for anything. I was thinking of getting some movie channels after Jan 1. I will use my DirecTv for my cable viewing exclusively and the 4D for DC-2 ITC, dish mover and DVB mover only. I didn't pay Skyvision almost $600.00 about 4.5 years ago for a cheap analog receiver with a minimum amount of satellites available to store and no DC-access except W5 that I have to pay for. This was not the original concept of the 4DTV. If they could offer me long term use of the W5 programming with more channels that I now got back on Direct I would consider a 410 or newer unit before trashing my 4D.

I know Mike was talking about getting a restock of 410's. What I would do is get something else that can get combo from the other HITS bird. Now that I would buy.

Originally Posted by tvropro

This is 100% true. Your receiver will become an old ANALOG ONLY receiver with a minimum amount of satellites to use for even positioning to use with DVB. AND NO WAY TO ADD MORE SATELLITES. This would be bogus and needs to be addressed now. I can do more with my old Monterey 50 or HTS 10 plus I have here.

I have a feeling thats the way its going to be.

Anyone have any contact info for the right people at Motorola?
(We can be nice to them and get our point across)

1- Perhaps having two receivers one for W5 other unit with old maps
2- Back up old maps with 4play (pain and don't think many could do it)

Originally Posted by wallyhts

I have a feeling thats the way its going to be.

Anyone have any contact info for the right people at Motorola?
(We can be nice to them and get our point across)

1- Perhaps having two receivers one for W5 other unit with old maps
2- Back up old maps with 4play (pain and don't think many could do it)

I don't have any Motorola contact info. Possibly Skyvision could give us some. Then we could ask them nicely to consider a fix for this. Mike was praising Motorola on Sat talk last Fri so they can't be all bad. We have to hope that they will listen to us and do a bit more testing to make it work. Once again I will say, technically I think it can be done it's a matter of removing W5 and replace it with AI. Since I did download AI right now my receiver will show my W5 subbed channels also on AI. So ditch W5 and replace it with AI, then there shouldn't be a conflict. Mike said they don't want to coexist maybe he can be more specific here so we can give our input. I understand the DC pretty good and could make some suggestions that Motorola could consider.

Maybe I'll try getting in touch with Mike when I get the time. Right now my time is very limited since I'm recovering from a flood disaster in my home from bad storms last weekend.

First, let me thank everyone for their suggestions. I will make it a habit to check in and take notes, and periodically make a progress report in these forums during coming months.

There is a broken link on our website that will be fixed...in the meantime, if you would like to be added to Skyvision's Email list for bulletins, go to the main website at
Skyvision Satellite Equipment

Click on CONTACT US.
This will take you to a link go to the 5th paragraph down, which asks
"Would you like to receive Preferred Client exclusive Email offers?"
Click there and add your information.

Remember common sense rules about not contacting uplinkers directly about FTA signals on technical matters? Many a feed has scrambled or otherwise become unavailable because a hobbyist has inquired about access to a signal that is technically a private transmission. Common sense dictates that you can watch that signal, but should not start a conversation with the source of the signal.

This same analogy should be remembered by those that want to contact Motorola directly. There are technical and other reasons that we (hobbyists) should realize, and consider very carefully before bombarding them with questions and demands. Delicate negotiations are in process, and outside distractions could very well upset them, and ruin things for the entire community. Contracts have to be signed, and agreements accomplished on a number of levels. The same goes for Comcast....we are but a few thousand people in their universe of millions of subscribers. I would advise everyone NOT to bother Motorola or Comcast with suggestions on how to run their business. If you have constructive suggestions, Email them to me at Skyvision mkohl@skyvision.com

On technical issues...a few facts. The W5 (AI) channel maps cannot co-exist with the mapping that you get from G1. This is not a financial issue, but a technical one that will be solved once the 4DTV datastream is turned off. Without the maps currently supplied on G1, there will be no interference. Until the datastream for 4DTV is removed, the time and place have not arrived to make any changes.
After December 31, there will be a great flexibility that we do not have right now.
We will be able to provide input to the proper engineering people, but please realize that every change requested will have a direct financial cost to us. Any addition will have to be weighed on its benefit to the entire subscriber community versus its cost. Send me any constructive suggestions, and they will be added for consideration.

Mike Kohl
Skyvision - Fergus Falls, Minnesota

Skyvision Satellite Equipment

EMail mkohl@skyvision.com

The problem is there are so few of us, I read aproxamatly 18K, but then I read that SRL lost several (more then 1K but can't remember what the number was) so are those deducted from the 18K? Doesn't matter we are few, as it stands right now the offering on W5 is greatly limited, it works as a supliment to other broadcasting although it does have most of the movie channels if you can afford them, if they could add other channels and do some creative packages making it similar to al a cart like the pick 10 pack from SRL, I believe what I am going to miss the most are the distant networks from the east coast, and I don't think those are going to show up on W5, and I understand why, but that doesn't mean I have to be happy about it, I personily am not sure it would be worth it to me to make my 4Dtv a glorified 410 for limited programming, I think right now it is in Motorola's best interest to get us all out of the ITC programming that is and might become available in DCII that the 4Dtv can receive, ( reguardless of how long it might be available) which would answer the question as to what is in it for Moto to be so kind as to assist in the switch over considering there are no monitary gains to be had by Moto!!
I wonder how many 410 subs there are out there, and are they considered part of the 18K? I don't think they are included, so if we all converted how many of us would there be, including the 410 subscribers, and would that be enough incentive for Comcast to add more channels to the line up?
Terry

I totally agree with mike's last post. We should NOT be contacting Comcast or Motorola. I deal with business people everyday and contracts involving large companies. They can get uneasy when people start asking too many questions before a deal is finalized. Remember-W5 may seem a little limited -yes compared to our previous multiple satellite capabilities we had before.

But at least W5 is probably going to be available and our other options are doorstops. 4DTV was such a proprietory platform from the start always relying on remote support from motorola. It was never a true fta receiver. The old guys back in the day put the generic sats in so we consumers could get the most out of our receivers. They were people who cared about the customer.
4DTV receivers are honestly nothing more than a cable converter box with a dish mover. With modern HD programming and the fact that powervu is now a real alternative for programmers motorola dcII is no longer the north American standard. we have hung on many years to a great high quality reliable technology that the rest of the world has left behind for pizza dishes and fiber optic cable services.

I will sub to w5 if it is available. If it is not I will be fta and ota.
We have craploads of fta and local channels. I am just happy comcast is even considering this deal. W5 has a good line up. No there's not 250 channels there but at least the video is not overcompressed to death like pizza dish looks. A dsr-410 is only 129.00. Just get one of those and leave your 4D's alone without doing an MR.

Thank you Mike for staying on top of this and keeping us in mind.

Cheers,
Dale