Court Order issued in TiVo vs. Echostar scheduling contempt hearing

**JAG72** · 06-06-2008 06:11 PM

Originally Posted by Stargazer

Directv paid the price because they knew that their boxes were infringing on the patents so that should have some type of merit in itself. I wonder if that would be brought up in court.

Are you sure they didn't pay just to keep their current Tivo systems active? Does anybody know if they pay for every DVR or just the Tivo systems.

**flyingsquirrel** · 06-06-2008 06:15 PM

Every DVR. Every month. So do a couple of Cable companies.

**JAG72** · 06-06-2008 06:27 PM

Originally Posted by flyingsquirrel

Every DVR. Every month. So do a couple of Cable companies.

You sure? Everything I have read makes it sound like they are only receiving the fee for the Tivo units. If you have a link to this information please post it.

**Hall** · 06-06-2008 09:22 PM

Originally Posted by Stargazer

Directv paid the price because they knew that their boxes were infringing on the patents so that should have some type of merit in itself. I wonder if that would be brought up in court.

Bring what up ? The fact that (for the sake of argument) their software "infringes" ? As long as they pay TiVo a licensing fee, or whatever you want to call it, it's "okay" and allowed.

**Tyralak** · 06-06-2008 10:58 PM

Originally Posted by philhu

Nope, DirecTV bought a license when this all started. They are clear. And Motorola had Tivo write the CableBox Tivo firmware, so I think they are ok also since Tivo would not sue someone they are working with to modify their boxes to be tivos.

They also own Replay now, so they're doubly in the clear.

**pabeader** · 06-06-2008 11:05 PM

didn't Echostar help in the development of the DVR technology? Why would they need to pay for it? in the end, all i care is that my DVRs will still work when I get them out of storage. as long as dish does whatever it needs to to make sure of that i'm a happy consumer.

**jacmyoung** · 06-07-2008 04:22 AM

Originally Posted by Thomas22

...2. At the September 4 hearing, the Court will also consider the damages that TiVo incurred2
during the period that the injunction was stayed.

I don't know how you got that idea, the court order of the day for the 9/4 meeting mentioned no such thing.

I personally would like to see DISH and Tivo both cross license their patents and work together, only because they are two like minded companies both cater to the end users more so than caving into the demands of the networks and the studios, unlike cablecos and DirecTV.

But unfortunately the train has left the station a long time ago, and it is less likely today than ever DISH will talk to Tivo.

The latest court order clearly put the case on the path for a customary contempt proceeding, during which the colorable difference issue will be discussed (because all new DISH DVRs are mentioned in the order), and I have little doubt in my mind the DISH new software is more than colorably different compared to the old, infringing software, meaning DISH will not be in contempt.

Tivo will have a long way to go (another full trial) to try again to find DISH's new software still infringes, and the next trial of course will be much more difficult to prove, even if Tivo can survive the time and cost required to last through this new trial.

Because this time, unlike the last time, DISH did commit large resources for over a year to develope the new software and to ensure it no longer infringed on Tivo's patent. The new software could still infringe, but the likelihood of such will be much less than the last time, especially consider that DISH had patent lawyers seriously looked at the new software to make sure it no longer infringed before it was downloaded on the DVRs.

**Thomas22** · 06-07-2008 08:31 AM

Originally Posted by Thomas22

2. At the September 4 hearing, the Court will also consider the damages that TiVo incurred during the period that the injunction was stayed.

Originally Posted by jacmyoung

I don't know how you got that idea, the court order of the day for the 9/4 meeting mentioned no such thing.

It says it on the first page of the court order for the 9/4 hearing. You might want to read it.

**jacmyoung** · 06-07-2008 11:06 AM

Originally Posted by Thomas22

It says it on the first page of the court order for the 9/4 hearing. You might want to read it.

Why don't you post that "page" or provide a link, most of us don't have the know how to get that "page."

**Thomas22** · 06-07-2008 11:27 AM

Originally Posted by jacmyoung

Why don't you post that "page" or provide a link, most of us don't have the know how to get that "page."

Here is a cut and paste from that page:

1. EchoStar asserts it has complied with the Court’s Permanent Injunction by replacing its existing infringing software with redesigned software based on a novel approach.
2. At the September 4 hearing, the Court will also consider the damages that TiVo incurred during the period that the injunction was stayed.