Tivo hearing today?

[harshness]

Stop lying. Comcast and Australia were discussed long before Dish.

Why do you guys even bother lying about stuff so easy to disprove?

No really, Id like to know, What is the motivation?

Do you have a copy of the transcript handy? The
TiVo Q2 2008 transcript

I read featured the Echostar comment at the end of the first paragraph from Tom Rogers.

Here's the first couple paragraphs for your edification:

Thomas S. Rogers

Thanks, Derrick. Good afternoon, everyone. Let me give you an overview of our second quarter. This was yet another solid quarter for TiVo. We beat our guidance on adjusted EBITDA very significantly, coming in at $10.6 million and posted net income results that were approximately $20 million above the same period last year. We were net income positive for the second straight quarter. Our balance sheet is very strong, with over $100 million in cash and cash equivalents. We generated $10 million in cash from operating activities in the quarter and we only expect our financial profile to improve once we receive our substantial award in the EchoStar case.

These results underscore TiVo's improved financial strength. When you add it to the growing traction with customers of our advertising, audience research, and international distribution businesses, combined with our MSO relationships, we believe we have the key growth drivers in place to build on our improved financial footing.

When the mention of the "EchoStar case" preceeds mention of "international distribution businesses, combined with our MSO relationships", I'd have to call baloney on your rebuke.

[harshness]

HUH? Tivo was incorporated in August
1997

in Delaware

I meant to type four or five as opposed to four of five. I've since changed that to reflect the actual three quarters count.

[Thomas22]

Here's the first couple paragraphs for your edification:When the mention of the "EchoStar case" preceeds mention of "international distribution businesses, combined with our MSO relationships", I'd have to call baloney on your rebuke.

Yep. You've got me there. What was your overall point? That TiVo is dying? I don't think so.

[harshness]

Yep. You've got me there. What was your overall point? That TiVo is dying? I don't think so.

Two points:

1. You better be awfully sure that you're not completely wrong when you call "you guys" liars.

2. Not everything is rosy at TiVo.

Even NeXT eventually succumbed.

[DishSatUser]

Yep. You've got me there. What was your overall point? That TiVo is dying? I don't think so.

No, But their Shareholders may be ripe for a purchase offer.

[navychop]

Over ripe!

More and more, I think this will happen. The court case is just to determine a selling price. To Echostar/Dish, most likely.


NeXT, Apple III, Lisa, various other products basically abandoned in place by their manufacturers. AT&T, when it was Cingular, abandoned it's TDMA cell users, but offered them "reasonable" conversion options to GSM. And all the cell companies did it to their analog (AMPS) cell customers- sometimes without even offering a deal. There was an entire TV scheme in the UK, IIRC, that was abandoned. I wonder what kind of deal they were offered? Raw?

[jacmyoung]

Yep. You've got me there. What was your overall point? That TiVo is dying? I don't think so.

The major reason TiVo has turned a profit, even as TiVo admitted, was their "new sub acquisition cost" was way down, as TiVo no longer added any new net subs but lost a lot in over all sub count.

TiVo had 4.4 million accounts at the beginning of 2007, only 3.6 million left at the end of last quarter. The way TiVo is losing subs made DISH's 25k net loss looked like a hugh winner.

I have used this analogy, if DISH today is doing the same as TiVo, with a net loss of 800k subs last quarter (proportionally compared to TiVo), DISH would have made $540 million more profit because each new sub means almost $700 new sub acquisition cost loss.

You would be the first have said DISH would be dying because they lost 800k subs, despite the fact they would have also made $540 million additional profit.

Hiding the truth is not too different than lying.

[navychop]

From the Navychop dictionary:

Lawyering: Using the truth to deceive.

[kstuart]

No, But their Shareholders may be ripe for a purchase offer.

Since EchoStar already has the top rated DVR, they gain nothing from buying TiVo except for the following entirely abstract benefits:

- End to the lawsuit (of course)

- TiVo subscriber mailing list, in order to offer them special deals to subscribe to Dish Network instead.

- Freedom to use any of the patented TiVo features in future software updates

- the TiVo trademark and the Season Pass trademark (EchoStar could simply rename all their DVRs "TiVo-DVRs".

they might hire one of TiVo's DVR engineer to explain the details of the TiVo software, and everyone else would get a pink slip (unless there was already a corresponding vacancy at EchoStar).

[tnsprin]

The following models were named by TiVo:

Models DP-501, 508, 510, 721, 921, 522, 625, and 942

Which brings up something I hadn't heard mentioned. At one point dish started taking at least one of these models, the 921, and remanufacturing them as another model (381 I think). We know what Dish and Tivo's viewpoint about such will be, but what do you think the court will say about this model? Effected by original injunction?