Thread: Wave Frontier Toroidal T-90 Satellite Dish

yes very good work and review
i do have some questions and i know you
run to several different receivers. but from
looking at the layout is there going to be a
limitation on running all lnbs to one receiver or to
run dual lnbs and share 10 lnbs between receivers.
you would just run to 22k's and diseqc switches

i should get a few switches just to try

Great work and a nice review Iceberg!

Maybe your review will get me motivated to put my T-90 together (I'd obtained one just before Katrina, and all I need is another non-pen roof mount for it).

The instant channel switching is a big plus. Having the T-90 is like having a dish farm in one dish! Great when you're got limited roof space (my dish farm is squeezed into a 9' x 5.5' rectangle) Perfect if you also have a motorized dish to go along with it!

FWIW, I have 2 T-90s and though most don't believe it, yes, you can get as good as signal with it as you can with a single dish pointed at the one satellite.

I also managed to get 110/111 with a T90. After much experimenting, I found that 111 was more critical and set that in the sweet spot. I then took the 110 SAT C reverse lnb and essentially let it spoon the 111 transponder....with the feed slightly over the edge of the 111 feed. Then simple tie wraps, lol. It did work, though 110 wasnt as strong as when it was in the prime spot - but clearly usable. I finally dumped that when I had to install a AT9 for the 99/103 Ka lnb.

Also, you can extend past 40 degrees with a little handywork - as can be seen here in this picture of 61.5 from
labgate

I agree 100% about the instructions. Best way is to sort out the screws by count and go from there. Surprisingly after you get the concept, the second is easier. I assembled the 2nd one in less than 45 minutes.

And fwiw, the extreme Ku linear lnb seemed to work ok on the T90 when I experimented with it...just had to turn it upside down. I didn't spend a lot of time with it, just wanted to see if it would work. I assume the linears work upside down and the circulars just wont work at all unless reversed.

I would prefer to use some Dish Pro stuff, but that is an issue as they aren't reversed polarity. I am sending some DP lnbs to PSmith who is planning to see if they can be reversed for the Toroidal. If they can, that will be great news - unless Sadoun wants to custom make a few.

It would also be interesting to know if he could reverse an Invacom Quad...but the size of that would take more than 2 degrees on a Toroidal, lol.

Finally, a really important thing to realize - because it seems so strange - there is not a 1 single solution to this. You can actually change the skew/elevation/azimuth to increase or decrease the view across the bar. I have a setting where I can go for almost 50 degrees from 101W-148W by that adjustment.

When I did it, it did not match the same skew (not even close) to my other T90 and even those familar with Toroidals have looked at it and say there is no way it would work as the skews are so different - yet it does.

In Europe they apparently use it for a 50 degree arc all the time - they just don't really suggest you do that. Also, the spacing gets even tighter between the lnbs as you increase the arc (for obvious reasons).

Finally, if you live near salt water or anything that will rust - the screws are zinc plated and this thing will rust FAST. As there are a number of the bolts are carriage bolts and all of the hardware is METRIC, it is a nightmare to find stainless versions of everything in the USA. I spent 2 weeks and finally was able to order everything in stainless from 2 different sources (no one had everything) on the net to replace out the rusted hardware and it cost me about $80 for enough for the 2 T-90s....just for stainless steel versions of what is included - which as you found out - is a ton of hardware.

I contacted the USA Distributor about it and he suggested they go to stainless as it would only increase their cost probably $10, as opposed to costing me $40+ per dish to change it out in the USA. He said that $10 is major in Europe and that would make them non-competitive, so they would loose too many sales for a $10 price difference in the hardware.

Originally Posted by gabshere

yes very good work and review
i do have some questions and i know you run to several different receivers. but from
looking at the layout is there going to be a limitation on running all lnbs to one receiver or to
run dual lnbs and share 10 lnbs between receivers.
you would just run to 22k's and diseqc switches

i should get a few switches just to try

The most LNB's one receiver could run is 8 and that is a 4x1 diseqc switch and 22k switches off each one of those.

I have 6 LNB's being used for one recever. There is a way to run more but it involves a 12v switch which my box doesn't have

Originally Posted by Tron

The instant channel switching is a big plus. Having the T-90 is like having a dish farm in one dish!

thats the reason I got it. Combine 4 dishes into one

Great when you're got limited roof space (my dish farm is squeezed into a 9' x 5.5' rectangle)

I think by taking the dishes off the roof except for the motorized I can see more of the C-Band arc now

Perfect if you also have a motorized dish to go along with it!

the motorized takes care fo the spots in between (87, 91, 79, 74, 72) and allows me to have 2 or even 3 games on at once

Originally Posted by HDTVFanAtic

FWIW, I have 2 T-90s and though most don't believe it, yes, you can get as good as signal with it as you can with a single dish pointed at the one satellite.

after seeing it, it made me a believer

I also managed to get 110/111 with a T90. After much experimenting, I found that 111 was more critical and set that in the sweet spot. I then took the 110 SAT C reverse lnb and essentially let it spoon the 111 transponder....with the feed slightly over the edge of the 111 feed. Then simple tie wraps, lol. It did work, though 110 wasnt as strong as when it was in the prime spot - but clearly usable. I finally dumped that when I had to install a AT9 for the 99/103 Ka lnb.

I thought about it too but since I don't have HD through SC the only channel I lose out on is NFL Network.

Also, you can extend past 40 degrees with a little handywork - as can be seen here in this picture of 61.5 from
labgate

but I think he is using the eastern part of the arc so it is easier for him as he is already at 72 when he starts. My "far eastern" satellite is 83 I might try and get a little more than 40 degrees. Maybe get rid of 123 and move it east

I agree 100% about the instructions. Best way is to sort out the screws by count and go from there. Surprisingly after you get the concept, the second is easier. I assembled the 2nd one in less than 45 minutes.

yeah the instructions suck. My issue was getting the 2 3 pieces to line up (the top angled bracket, the main piece where the skew is and the dish. The 2 pieces didnt like to match up

And fwiw, the extreme Ku linear lnb seemed to work ok on the T90 when I experimented with it...just had to turn it upside down. I didn't spend a lot of time with it, just wanted to see if it would work. I assume the linears work upside down and the circulars just wont work at all unless reversed.

This is the Xtreme I that I use to have on a motorized. Its really gutted to get 101 pretty decent.

It would also be interesting to know if he could reverse an Invacom Quad...but the size of that would take more than 2 degrees on a Toroidal, lol.

that wouold probably take up 4 degrees for sure.

Originally Posted by Iceberg

=
that wouold probably take up 4 degrees for sure.

Well, when you pry the plastic cover off the Invacom it takes away a lot of the bulk....more than I expected...though its still much larger than the standard Toroidal LNBs.

What I was thinking was if you could get a Reverse Invacom Quad and place it at 111W, it might get Starchoice at 111W and Echostar at 110W as the circular signal is much broader.

Now if you could get Invacom to make some reverse lnbs for satelliteguys

Originally Posted by Iceberg

but I think he is using the eastern part of the arc so it is easier for him as he is already at 72 when he starts. My "far eastern" satellite is 83 I might try and get a little more than 40 degrees. Maybe get rid of 123 and move it east

Here's another homemade extension from Germany which you will note he is getting a 50 degrees arc out of as well.


http://www.multilnbdish.com/images/CPIC_Germany.gif

interesting. Might have to monkey with it more tonight