C Band Dish Registration

radio · May 8, 2018

There is a charge by the FCC for filing separate from the pro's doing the form. They have a fee for everything. We pay for license "regulatory fees" every year, fees to apply for FM translators, fees for special temporary authority if something goes wrong with our broadcast systems for longer than "X" amount of time, ...and the list goes on.

Please read the letter and the form Munn provided carefully. The reason they (Munn) offer this service is there are many technical questions asked, and the form has to be done exactly correct. Many (radio) station owners need help with this and to be honest, finding documentation for my older dishes and generic dishes to properly GIVE information is going to prove quite a job for us. My personal Birdview dishes we may be able to find info on for technical, but who knows about the others which are either not branded, or very old (but in use.) Even as a somewhat advanced hobbyist with satellite, I can tell you from doing other FCC forms that sometimes it's easier for me, as a business, to hire it professionally done. (I am not suggesting you pay big bucks to register, I'm clarifying the need existing for those at whom this action is aimed.)

Yes, I'd be happy to put my letter up here once it's complete, but please don't wait to begin one, folks if you want to send one. As Ive' said, keep it polite, to the point, and concentrate on the importance of the content you receive and why you receive it in this manner vs. other means. Keep to the facts, not the emotion, and make it an outstanding letter.

I'm happy to read anyone's draft, if you beat me to the writing. Send it via e-mail to our office address at i1430.com and I'll happily work with anyone on the letter in available time.

There is a link regarding the public comment in the Munn-Reese newsletter. Read it carefully. https://apps.fcc.gov/edocs_public/attachmatch/DA-18-446A1.pdf It outlines how to make public comment and the deadline. It's standard procedure for the FCC to take public comment. I hope that you will not only comment on this, but try to be more "in tune" going forward with FCC procedures and policy-making. It affects us all. You may even want to watch one of their meetings online. It really can get interesting.

-At your service as another Satguys member.

Magic Static · May 9, 2018

I started the application process but soon realized there was no way I could answer all the technical questions. Our dishes were not made for professionals. They were for a residential market. People that had no need or understanding of the mathematics and materials used in making the dish. The information they want was never available on these dishes. It looked like a "Catch-22" to me. Frustrating for anyone I'm sure.
I do agree that there is a need for our voices to be heard, but the FCC isn't going to make it easy for us. This is one of those chores that nobody likes but it has to be done.

Martyn · May 9, 2018

What are the technical questions? I found the form very simple, except was unclear if a cost was involved.

Note the FCC has waived the frequency coordination requirement because it realizes home dish owners cannot afford the expense.

Here's why this is important: "For example, a joint proposal submitted recently to the FCC by Intel and Intelsat seeks to allow satellite and wireless-broadband services to share C-Band frequencies in designated geographic areas. If the proposal is approved, stations using unregistered/unlicensed dishes in these areas risk losing frequency protection, and their dishes could begin to experience interference from wireless-broadband services."

So registering will establish you as an existing user and put the onus on new users, like wireless broadband companies, from causing you interference.

Martyn · May 9, 2018

Here's the FCC Public Notice: https://transition.fcc.gov/Daily_Releases/Daily_Business/2018/db0419/DA-18-398A1.pdf

And the waiver I mentioned: "Thus, to obtain the best information possible on existing earth stations in this band in furtherance of the Commission’s ongoing inquiry without imposing a potentially unnecessary economic burden on eligible FSS earth station applicants in the 3.7-4.2 GHz band filing within the 90-day window, the International Bureau hereby grants a temporary waiver of the frequency coordination requirement."

There is a sample form online: https://transition.fcc.gov/ib/sd/se/s312reg.pdf

Although the better and easier was to file is through IBFS online, you'll need a Federal Reporting Number, which at least all ham license holders already have. If not you can register for free.

Looking at the form and questions, I believe the responses required are:

1: Name
2: Phone
3: Business name (if applicable)
5-8: Address
17: a1, b1
20: a
21: b
22: a (and b)
24: a
25: a
26: c
43: Domestic C-band antenna for reception of digital and analog video and audio services from ALSAT (this means all satellites designated by the FCC for domestic use. If you also receive signals from other satellites, you need to list them here too. ALSAT covers: Permitted Space Station List )

Schedule B:
Details of where the antenna is. You can find your lat/long through Google Maps or other services.
B2: Satellite name and orbital location is ALSAT for the satellites listed above, then list others you receive.
Antenna details follow.

Maybe someone else can comment and tell me if I have these correct.

Magic Static · May 9, 2018

As far as I can figure, we are required to use the online registration system to register our dishes. Form 312EZ would be the one. SO you have to get a FCC number. Register thru the CORES system to get that number. Now you can login to the online registration system. But when you select begin the registration, form 312 EZ it tells you registrations have been suspended and refers back to the notice about that. The notice says there is a 90 day window and sends you in a circle back to the online registration process.

The only form I had access to was the full Form 312

Martyn · May 9, 2018

Magic Static said:
As far as I can figure, we are required to use the online registration system to register our dishes. Form 312EZ would be the one. SO you have to get a FCC number. Register thru the CORES system to get that number. Now you can login to the online registration system. But when you select begin the registration, form 312 EZ it tells you registrations have been suspended and refers back to the notice about that. The notice says there is a 90 day window and sends you in a circle back to the online registration process. The only form I had access to was the full Form 312

Hmm, you're right.

I just emailed the FCC to ask them what's up, and clarify the cost question. Stay tuned.

Martyn · May 9, 2018

So, the FCC says: "The 312 EZ has been disabled during the 90 day freeze to file the 3700-4200 Registrations, you have to file the normal way through IBFS, u will need to fill out the Form 312 and Schedule B in its entirety, even though no frequency coordination report is required, the frequency coordination section of Schedule B still needs to be filled out. You will pay through IBFS as well."

I've asked for clarification on the fee.

It looks like $360 on one fee schedule, which is entirely reasonable for a business like a TV station but completely outrageous for a private individual. If the FCC wants to really know frequency users, they've not thought this through. I think that's the prompt for towerdude's original post here.

So yes, Towerdude, I am impacted by the fee and a legitimate spectrum user.

comfortably_numb · May 9, 2018

Martyn said:
It looks like $360 on one fee schedule, which is entirely reasonable for a business like a TV station but completely outrageous for a private individual.

My thoughts exactly.

Martyn · May 9, 2018

Oops. My bad. It's $435.

danristheman · May 9, 2018

I just thought about this maybe we need need to move next to registered sites like near radio so we can be covered. It be like having a bubble around us so if the registered sites are having trouble, the FCC would listen to them more than us. Sounds crazy but in a way makes sense.

radio · May 9, 2018

You'll do more for the issue commenting to the FCC than not, folks...and...probably make a bigger impact as members of this site "in large numbers" than by worrying so much about registrations. There's no guarantee of any backing in disputes even if registered, and still the chance that registrants may have to eventually do the "path study" too. For those deriving their income from using a dish, yes...register. For those in the hobby....write that letter, folks. It's probably as effective for the hobbyist.

Martyn · May 10, 2018

The FCC is accepting comments on use of the 3.7-4.2GHz spectrum by 5G wireless operators.

I believe docket 18-122 is the correct one.

You can read existing comments received here: ECFS

Anyone can submit a comment. It can be a single sentence, a letter, an entire presentation. Whatever you want. It's your government. These people are paid by you.

You can submit a comment using the "new comment" link on the left of that page. The comments are read and collated by the bureau staff and presented in a report to FCC commissioners.

**You can also email FCC commissioners directly and tell them why they shouldn't allow 5G services access to C-band**

Contact

radio · May 11, 2018

Letters are trickling in to the FCC on this topic, but not in huge amounts, given the time there is for (first round) of comments on this topic. The latest from radio engineers, the majority from networks and cable-related operators.

comfortably_numb · May 11, 2018

radio said:
Letters are trickling in to the FCC on this topic, but not in huge amounts, given the time there is for (first round) of comments on this topic. The latest from radio engineers, the majority from networks and cable-related operators.

Good to see comments coming in.

Jackonearth · May 12, 2018

Cham said:
Should only have to pay for licensing when transmitting on a restricted frequency or band; at least here in Canada and USA. Other countries might be different though. Think GB used to require a license and fee for installing a TV set and antenna, but this may no longer be in affect there.

This is off topic but has there's next to no chance that the FCC will prioritize C-Band use over the big mobile and broadband providers, I figured there's no harm.
The TV license fee in the UK was to fund the BBC which is sort of like our PBS but unlike PBS are the most watched channels over there. Anyone with a TV can watch BBC channels so the idea was if you can watch it, you have to pay for it. It's like a cable subscription you can never cancel. If you had a TV you had to pay the annual fee. Some people tried to claim they didn't have a TV so they could avoid paying the fee. So the government sent out inspectors in vans with equipment to detect if people had a TV in their home (I'm not making this up).

comfortably_numb · May 12, 2018

Can’t some of the affected broadcasters and receiving stations switch to Ku band if this legislation goes through?

danristheman · May 12, 2018

Their is a weather problem with ku when it rains. C band has no weather issue. WFWA 39 the 4 sub channel gets knocked out do to rain. The main channel keeps going because of the c band feed.

comfortably_numb · May 12, 2018

danristheman said:
Their is a weather problem with ku when it rains. C band has no weather issue. WFWA 39 the 4 sub channel gets knocked out do to rain. The main channel keeps going because of the c band feed.

I only have trouble with rain fade on DVB-S2 feeds. Most other video and audio channels hold up for me during even the heaviest rains. Just my experience, though..

Ricardino_bp · May 12, 2018

radio said:
You'll do more for the issue commenting to the FCC than not, folks...and...probably make a bigger impact as members of this site "in large numbers" than by worrying so much about registrations. There's no guarantee of any backing in disputes even if registered, and still the chance that registrants may have to eventually do the "path study" too. For those deriving their income from using a dish, yes...register. For those in the hobby....write that letter, folks. It's probably as effective for the hobbyist.

Do you know until when is the FCC accepting public comments?

Sent from my SM-G900P using the SatelliteGuys app!

radio · May 12, 2018

C Band Dish Registration

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