622 OTA signal loss (1 Viewer)

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cebbigh

Supporting Founder
Supporting Founder
May 24, 2005
1,601
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Frostbite Falls
Chuck: thanks for the details on the DC blocker. My signal on KCPQ, too, has dropped into the 68-70 range (formerly 72-75) and that's getting just a little bit close to where I start to lose it. The drops-to-zero are still happening, though less frequently. I appreciate the info and for a few bucks, it can't hurt and maybe will help...

I read the DC voltage problem was corrected on the 622 after looking at some old posts. Sorry if it was a wasted exercise. On the other hand, like you said it doesn't hurt anything and just costs a few bucks. Plus sometimes reported fixes get missed on specific hardware batches.
 
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cebbigh

Supporting Founder
Supporting Founder
May 24, 2005
1,601
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Frostbite Falls
Tried it for a week- DC Blocker not working for me. Still having problems with two OTA locals on my 211 dropping to zero frequently.

I give up! Since Dish wont fix this, I have decided to buy yet another (makes 4 in this house) OTA HD tuner for my main viewing Tv. Using others for recording and other rooms. Have to just abandon the 211 OTA tuner for FOX & ABC- UNWATCHABLE.

Hammer

See reply to kstile above. The problem on DC Voltage was limited to the 942. Dish apparently abandoned a project where they had intended to include a powered OTA antenna and power it straight from the 942. Sorry it didn't work. Reading the replies it sounds like you've checked into the usual suspects: attenuator, moving/adjusting antenna. I went through lots of antennas (various indoors, rat shack 15-20. cm4221, cm4224) with various tweaks like attenuators (fixed and adjustable) and even trying 2 antennas either a simple a/b switch and then a jointenna:

http://www.warrenelectronics.com/antennas/Jointennas.htm

As you can see I've fought the OTA battles more than any reasonable person should have. But, for me, it's one of those things where I just don't like giving up on something once I've started. I think I finally found a magic location and height and directional aim (with the cm4248 moving the nose of the antenna an inch one way or the other side to side can make a difference). I must have found a hole through the evergreens. Oddly, I think the windstorms we've had here in the Puget Sound area might have knocked down enough branches/trees to improve my overall reception. Hope you get yours solved with less work than I've put into it.
 

sallgdon64

Active SatelliteGuys Member
Supporting Founder
Apr 27, 2005
23
0
I'm in Va Beach and have the same problem with WAVY. I'm using the Radio Shack variable attenuator to resolve the WAVY problem, but I can't find a sweat spot of attenuation where I don't lose WHRO. I corresponded with their engineer, and got the same "not my problem" answer.
 

dclboro

SatelliteGuys Family
Feb 11, 2007
55
0
Which attenuator did you get? I'm in VA Beach (near Rosemont and VA Beach Blvd) and having the same problem.
 

barrysb

SatelliteGuys Family
Sep 11, 2003
76
0
I'm in Va Beach and have the same problem with WAVY. I'm using the Radio Shack variable attenuator to resolve the WAVY problem, but I can't find a sweat spot of attenuation where I don't lose WHRO. I corresponded with their engineer, and got the same "not my problem" answer.

From what the DOE at WAVY is writing over on the AVS Forum, the manufacturer of WAVY-DT's transmitter is now talking with Dish engineers to work out a solution to this problem.

Since I came up with this work-around, I've been switching the attenuation in when I want to watch WAVY and out when watching weaker channels. It's a burden, particularly for preset timers, but hopefully just a short time aggravation. Maybe you could dial out the attenuation when watching WHRO.
 

MRUSS

Pub Member / Supporter
Pub Member / Supporter
Sep 9, 2003
211
0
Crane Mo
Having the same problem here in Springfield Mo. on KSFX 27 FOX channel. Seems like if I can keep my signal strength from 65 to 70% I don't have much trouble. I did use the attenuator that came with my 622, but I think all that done is lower my signal under 70%. My 921 works ok with a signal around 100%, seems like they could learn from it and fix the 622vip.
 

dclboro

SatelliteGuys Family
Feb 11, 2007
55
0
barrysb,
I used the attenuator that came with my 622. It lowered all of the signals from mid to upper 90's to 72-74 (except FOX is now between 56-60). WAVY 10 NBC finally works, but I still get some pixelation and freezing ocassionally. Do you think that getting an attenuator with less db loss would help? Maybe raise my signals slightly. Do you think that maybe an adjustable attenuator would be the key? I've also heard of using a DC blocker to avoid signal drops. Have you tried this?
 

barrysb

SatelliteGuys Family
Sep 11, 2003
76
0
barrysb,
I used the attenuator that came with my 622. It lowered all of the signals from mid to upper 90's to 72-74 (except FOX is now between 56-60). WAVY 10 NBC finally works, but I still get some pixelation and freezing ocassionally. Do you think that getting an attenuator with less db loss would help? Maybe raise my signals slightly. Do you think that maybe an adjustable attenuator would be the key? I've also heard of using a DC blocker to avoid signal drops. Have you tried this?

It's hard to say, without having an adjustable attenuator, whether you are too low or too high in signal strength. In my case, I'm finding a sweet spot where there are very few or almost no picture breakups on WAVY-DT. As I've written, this is between 68-72 on my 622 signal strength indicator. The pixellation above and below this range is almost identical.

I can't see where a DC blocker would help unless you are using a 2-piece preamp that isn't removing the DC before it gets to the 622. AFAIK, most such preamps have this blocker built-in.
 

smileys

Member
Jan 3, 2007
10
0
Savannah, GA
Wind Effects?

I have a 622 with an attic mount Radio Shack UHF antenna. One of the local channels normally comes in with 85-88% signal. One gusty day, the signal kept dropping out. Does anyone know what causes this? Is it the tower/transmitter, atmospheric effects, or what? The other local channel stayed strong at 100%.
 
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barrysb

SatelliteGuys Family
Sep 11, 2003
76
0
I have a 622 with an attic mount Radio Shack UHF antenna. One of the local channels normally comes in with 85-88% signal. One gusty day, the signal kept dropping out. Does anyone know what causes this? Is it the tower/transmitter, atmospheric effects, or what? The other local channel stayed strong at 100%.

First, remember that the signal strength reported by the 622 is based on detected errors in the digital stream and not carrier strength. Sometimes wind-blown tree branches can cause an increase in errors particularly on weaker channels. Is your antenna receiving signals through nearby trees?
 

dclboro

SatelliteGuys Family
Feb 11, 2007
55
0
barrysb,
Instead of getting a different attenuator, I just adjusted my OTA antenna slightly. WAVY-DT is steady at 73 (622 signal strength indicator) with no picture or audio breakups. I'm even having success with FOX which is holding steady at 65 with no breakups. Hopefully this holds up until WAVY and Dish Network come up with a solution to their problem. Please post if you get any updates on the situation. I will do the same. Thank you.
 

barrysb

SatelliteGuys Family
Sep 11, 2003
76
0
barrysb,
Instead of getting a different attenuator, I just adjusted my OTA antenna slightly. WAVY-DT is steady at 73 (622 signal strength indicator) with no picture or audio breakups. I'm even having success with FOX which is holding steady at 65 with no breakups. Hopefully this holds up until WAVY and Dish Network come up with a solution to their problem. Please post if you get any updates on the situation. I will do the same. Thank you.

Good news! I'm hoping this whole situation will be resolved without too much delay. Beware that atmospheric conditions may change and your picture might become unstable. I've had that happen to me a few times. But overall I've been able to hide the problem pretty well.
 

wayne231

SatelliteGuys Pro
Feb 9, 2006
215
0
Memphis, TN
As of today it appears that Axcera has produced a firmware update that resolves the problem. We have been able to run for about 6 hours with-out any problems and an even stronger signal (98).
 

boy921

SatelliteGuys Pro
Apr 24, 2004
391
0
N. California
As of today it appears that Axcera has produced a firmware update that resolves the problem...(98).

Today, the engineers did something with the exciters here. The end result is the same. No improvement. Hopefully the engineer, who was posting at AVSForum for Memphis HDTV, will give an update soon.
 

wayne231

SatelliteGuys Pro
Feb 9, 2006
215
0
Memphis, TN
Today, the engineers did something with the exciters here. The end result is the same. No improvement. Hopefully the engineer, who was posting at AVSForum for Memphis HDTV, will give an update soon.

That is the Memphis update. Switched over about 1:00 PM today and have ran all day with no problems.
 

hammerdown

SatelliteGuys Pro
Dec 14, 2005
324
0
Northern California
Put a Radio Shack attenuator on my Vip211 a few days ago, and have to say things seem to have improved. Amazingly like other people are saying, if I turn the knob to where the signal meter says about 70-75% the constant pixellation goes away and only get one or two lost signal popups per hour now.

Hammer

Something bad happened after the Vip211 software update a few days ago. All three of my problem channels are way worse. They are now UNWATCHABLE. All I get now is constant "Signal Lost" message on screen, with occasional spurts of audio/video coincidentally on every channel that contains a 720p stream. I am still leaning towards this theory, since all of these local stations have confirmed they do NOT use Axera exciters.

I am back on the search for a real OTA tuner that works. The Vip211 OTA is officially BROKEN. Now I'm wishing I would have kept my 6000 for OTA usage... It was reliable.

Hammer
 

boy921

SatelliteGuys Pro
Apr 24, 2004
391
0
N. California
I received L366 on two of my ViP 622 receivers. This software version has no affect in correcting the problem with exciter/modulator problems with KCVU FOX 30 digital channels which is caused by the Axcera exciter/modulator. Final changes made at the transmitter yesterday has made no improvement, but people using the D* HR models are now having problems.
 

wayne231

SatelliteGuys Pro
Feb 9, 2006
215
0
Memphis, TN
I received L366 on two of my ViP 622 receivers. This software version has no affect in correcting the problem with exciter/modulator problems with KCVU FOX 30 digital channels which is caused by the Axcera exciter/modulator. Final changes made at the transmitter yesterday has made no improvement, but people using the D* HR models are now having problems.

921: Are you by any chance using amplification on your OTA antenna? This can cause the same problem. Right now we are still going strong on the new firmware with a 100 signal (non-amplified). The software is 4.25. The original firmware was 4.18 then 4.25A caused the big problem for dish receivers. 4.25 appears to be very stable.
 

barrysb

SatelliteGuys Family
Sep 11, 2003
76
0
921: Are you by any chance using amplification on your OTA antenna? This can cause the same problem. Right now we are still going strong on the new firmware with a 100 signal (non-amplified). The software is 4.25. The original firmware was 4.18 then 4.25A caused the big problem for dish receivers. 4.25 appears to be very stable.

Has anyone identified what condition of the transmitted signal is causing this compatibility problem with Dish receivers? Some details might provide some insight to those experiencing the same problem with other manufacturer's exciters.
 

boy921

SatelliteGuys Pro
Apr 24, 2004
391
0
N. California
921: Are you by any chance using amplification on your OTA antenna? This can cause the same problem. Right now we are still going strong on the new firmware with a 100 signal (non-amplified). The software is 4.25. The original firmware was 4.18 then 4.25A caused the big problem for dish receivers. 4.25 appears to be very stable.
No amplification here. I have one receiver attenuated down to 68 and it works fine. I can swing the antenna to get the same results by lowering the signal, but It causes reception problems for other stations that don't have any problems. I've tired many different set-ups with/without amplification, just doesn't matter. Others with ViP receivers, that live in my area have the same problem with KCVU. As of yesterday, whatever exciter/modulator version they used is now also affecting HR and other models. The station here doesn't upgrade or change the exciter/modulators firmware. They send it to the manufacturer on a swap process so there is little to no downtime. When I talk to the Chief Engineer, I'll try and determine which version they are currently using.
 
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