adding additional lnbs by combining them...

[danielle_s]

Here is probably a very stupid question that has been answered before but I was just looking for a confirmation as to whether I'm wrong or right.

I'm thinking of using this setup:
61.5 & 105 into a 21 and then exit the 21 into input 1 of a 44
110 into input 2 of a 44
119 into input 3 of a 44
121 into input 4 of a 44

Thanks

Part of the reason I'm asking is because a friend of my who owns an install business has never done this before and would like to learn how to do this just in case someone asks for a setup like this.

 

[NightRyder]

Check out this thread.


http://www.satelliteguys.us/showthread.php?t=24582&highlight=mad+scientist


NightRyder

 

[danielle_s]

the reason I'm asking for confirmation is because mike was very clear on excately how to hook the system up. He just gave snips of what he was tring to accomplish. I've read the thread before. Be honest I've even posted to it. I didn't understand much of it back then either.

 

[SimpleSimon]

You can NOT DP21 INTO the switch.

You need a DP21 for EACH receiver. IIRC, DPP44 to port #1, the fifth LNB to port #2.

 

[danielle_s]

I spent a lot of time reading the thread again and I come across this: http://www.satelliteguys.us/attachment.php?attachmentid=1823

I noticed that the dp21 is connected to the dp44 through the 2nd receiver connection & not through the "additional switch" connections. Any reason why?

Oh and one more thing, if I were to use a dishpro dual lnbf and get a second dp21 would I be able to connect the second dp21 to receiver connection 1,3 or 4 of the dp44 and to the other connection so that I can hook up a second receiver to see all 5 slots.

 

[Pepper]

Here's the setup that works for me (coincidentally, identical to the diagram).

DPP44: input1=119 input2=110 input3=61.5 input4=105
DP21: input1=receiver out 2, 3, or 4 from DPP44 input2=121
output from DP21 goes to receiver.

You can't put the DP21 on receiver out 1 of the DPP44, unless you can rig a way to put the power inserter BETWEEN the DP21 and the DPP44.

The "additional switch" connections on the DPP44 are passthru outputs of the same signal on the corresponding input, i.e. on mine, "additional switch" 1 would be only the 119 signal.

A DP Twin LNBF would still have to be connected to two inputs on the DPP44 as it will tell each half of the LNBF to deliver only one satellite.

 

[danielle_s]

Here's the setup that works for me (coincidentally, identical to the diagram).

DPP44: input1=119 input2=110 input3=61.5 input4=105
DP21: input1=receiver out 2, 3, or 4 from DPP44 input2=121
output from DP21 goes to receiver.

You can't put the DP21 on receiver out 1 of the DPP44, unless you can rig a way to put the power inserter BETWEEN the DP21 and the DPP44.

The "additional switch" connections on the DPP44 are passthru outputs of the same signal on the corresponding input, i.e. on mine, "additional switch" 1 would be only the 119 signal.

A DP Twin LNBF would still have to be connected to two inputs on the DPP44 as it will tell each half of the LNBF to deliver only one satellite.

So receiver 1 on the dp44 to hook a second dp21 is a no go. What about receiver 3 or 4? I would like to hook two receivers up to see all 5 locations instead of just one.

 

[redhawk]

You can hook "receiver 1" on the dp44 to a DP21, but you would have to install an extra cable or two to get the power inserter between the DP21 & DPP44.

I'm not much of an artist, but maybe the attached picture would help, the purple cables would potentially have to be run back to the house. Not using port 1 of DPP44 saves (potentially) running extra cable.

Either way would work if you only need two receivers.

I only ran two cables from house to dish setup, and had to run a third from a close source to power DPP44.

 

[Damian_1999]

you cant put 2 cascaded signals into another switch

 

[Damian_1999]

redhawk.. I mgiht have read your drawing wrong.. but always put your power inserters between rec and switch.. but if that is how it is drawn, then your dp21's are backwards

 

[Damian_1999]

opps nevermind... I didnt realize you had your dp21's inside haha

 

[boy921]

has anyone taken two DPP44's to a DP21 to receiver?
example:

First DPP44
1 = 119
2 = 110
3 = 121
4 = 148

Second DPP44
1 = 119
2 = 110
3 = 105
4 = 61.5

DP21 Dish Input 1 to First DPP44 receiver output 2
DP21 Dish Input 2 to First DPP44 receiver output 2
DP21 Receiver output to receiver.

I have no clue if this would work but if it did it could give you 6 satellites.

 

[Smith P.]

boy921, I think your second DPP44 doesn't required feeds from 110 and 119.

 

[boy921]

boy921, I think your second DPP44 doesn't required feeds from 110 and 119.

Not for the one DP21 to receiver but would need them for the remaining receivers using each DPP44.

 

[SimpleSimon]

Sorry, I've NOT heard of anyone geting 6 birds on a single feed.

As Damian said, you can NOT put a switch on the #2 side of a DP21 - just a single-bird feed.

And in case anyone is thinking about trying for a 4-bird rig using a DPPlus twin, I don't think it's gonna work - at least I couldn't get the 921 to recognize the DP21 #2 input when the DPP-Twin (119 & 110 only) was on #1. In fact, the DP21 never showed in the matrix at all when the DPP-Twin was online. Looks like the DPP-Twin code overrides the DP21 code. Of course, even if it would work for basic DP, the "Plus" functions would not - that would require the non-existent DPP21, and there's no real point in making such a device.

 

[boy921]

OK, I understand that the dish 2 side will not work with a switch. With the same scenario, but with a slightly different hook-up configuration, could one get five satellites off of one DPP44 switch or the other DPP44 switch?
Example: with my previous Illustration:

First DPP44
1 = 119
2 = 110
3 = 121
4 = 148

Second DPP44
1 = 119
2 = 110
3 = 105
4 = 61.5

DP21 Dish Input 1 to First DPP44 receiver output 2
DP21 Dish Input 2 to First DPP44 receiver output 2
DP21 Receiver output to receiver.

First DPP44 to DP21 to Second DPP44

LNB Port 4 (148) ~ DPP44 Switch Port 4 to Dish 2 port of DP21.

DP21 Dish 1 port to Second DPP44 Receiver port 2.

DP21 Receiver Port to receiver.

 

[redhawk]

Do not believe that you can have two DPP 44's in switch path - sorry if I am not reading your post correctly, but I have been up too darn long..

My understanding of the switch technology is that you can't have two of the same type of switches between the receivers and the LNB's. The limitation is that the hardware/code that allows the receiver to control the switches can not distinguish the between two of the same type of switches - for example, if you have two DPP44's and the receiver sends a command for the DPP to switch signal paths, which DPP will respond? (I don't know - probably neither, but could be both) Think of it as a computer address on a network - each type of switch has an address, but switches of the same type have the same address and therefore can not be identified uniquely!

Your scenario might work if you put a DP34 in place of one of the DPP44's, i.e.,

DPP44 has 119, 110, 105, 121
DP34 has 61.5, 148

DP21 port 1 to DPP44
DP21 port 2 to DP34

I have been trying to prove that this could work, but am lacking a good view of 148 - I will try again tomorrow (darned trees). (look at mad scientist post for 5 sats)

I have DPP44 to port1 of DP21 and 1 lnb to port 2. can easily swap cables on DP21 to see whether or not port two of SP21 is single bird only. Guess I could also drop lnb cable off DPP44 and put two sats on DP34 to port 2 of LNB if first check works. If either check fails, I can stop search for 148. (I know where it is, but trick is to find clear view - thanks to iceberg's post on simple sat sighter, I can probably do it with out dragging a dish, tv and receiver around the pasture.

If it's not raining tomorrow, I'll certainly be busy. of course, I could do some real work around the place.

 

[Pepper]

This has gotten way past what I was responding to, what I have actual experience in, and has now gotten deep into theory.

redhawk, don't step in any fresh theory while you're trudging through that pasture.

BTW, I'm in zip 36572 (SW Alabama), and haven't had any luck yet finding 148. It is at azimuth 253 and elevation 17 for me. Any chance of getting it with a dish500 at that elevation or do I need something bigger? Also there are some trees in that direction. I think that in order to clear the trees I need to position the dish at a distance at least 2.75 times the height of said trees, right?

 

[boy921]

redhawk,
I think your right redhawk but I was thinking that my idea of running off of the first DPP44 was just a pass through for the LNB. I'm going to experiment Monday (if it isn't raining).

Do not believe that you can have two DPP 44's in switch path - sorry if I am not reading your post correctly, but I have been up too darn long..

My understanding of the switch technology is that you can't have two of the same type of switches between the receivers and the LNB's. The limitation is that the hardware/code that allows the receiver to control the switches can not distinguish the between two of the same type of switches - for example, if you have two DPP44's and the receiver sends a command for the DPP to switch signal paths, which DPP will respond? (I don't know - probably neither, but could be both) Think of it as a computer address on a network - each type of switch has an address, but switches of the same type have the same address and therefore can not be identified uniquely!

Pepper,
Sorry for getting too far off track. I hope you can get yours to work.

This has gotten way past what I was responding to, what I have actual experience in, and has now gotten deep into theory.

Thanks,

John

 

[SimpleSimon]

Unh. redhawk's theory is maybe worth a test - but I've never heard of anybody being succesful with it. IIRC, the [thread=24582]"Mad Scientist Hooks up 5 Satellite Locations!!!!"[/thread] tried it already. It's an 8-page thread, I'm not gonna look.

A couple of us were going to setup a database of how to git-r-done with various configurations, but it's a lot of work.