Considering TurboHD Bronze - Too many questions!

[RegGuheert]

I live near Winchester, VA in a location where cable will likely NEVER be available to me. I am considering subscribing to Dish TurboHD Bronze. My last satellite TV experience was with DirecTV about 20 years ago. However, I am a radio engineer and currently use HughesNet for internet access. As such, I have no issues with radio terminology, antenna installation, etc. I have a very nice OTA HDTV setup which includes only one HDTV, Blu-ray, HD-DVD and the recent addition of a DTVPal DVR, which is what got me thinking about Dish. The Bronze package with a DVR would be a nice addition to my current line-up. (Please note, I do not want ANY other programming, including locals.) However, I don't seem to find answers to many obvious questions either here or on Dish's website. Answers to any of my questions will be greatly appreciated! (Please don't feel compelled to answer them all!):

Pricing questions:

P1) Is there some way that I can lock in the $24.99/mo. price and avoid the $5.00 increase in February (for at least two years)? Perhaps prepay?
P2) Is Dish going to charge me a fee for NOT including locals?
P3) Is there any way to avoid the additional fee for the DVR, such as owning it myself?
P4) Am I *really* required to connect to a phone line to avoid some fee? Will an ethernet connection suffice? (I don't have a land line anymore, though I do have a phone jack at my entertainment center that will allow calling out through one of three cell phones.)
P5) What other taxes/fees will I see every month? I'm guessing it will be more than just $24.99 + DVR fee...
P6) Am I better off purchasing now or is there some incentive for purchasing in February after the rate increase and promotions come into play? Please keep in mind that I don't WANT more programming than TurboHD Bronze.
P7) Is there a preferred path to obtain the BEST deal with Dish as a new subscriber? Should I call Dish? Should I call a local installer? Someone else?
P8) Would I be better off waiting until the Greater Depression is in full force before looking for a good deal with Dish?

Antenna questions:

A1) Can I get all of the TurboHD Bronze programming from my location using only the Eastern Arc Antenna?
A2) Are all 1000.4 antennas Eastern Arc Antennas? If not, how can I tell the difference?
A3) Do I need to point at any satellite farther west than 77W to get TurboHD Bronze? (My strong preference is to install in a location where I cannot point much further west than that.)

Other questions:

O1) If I purchase the 1000.4 antenna and 722 Receiver on eBay (~$400) and perform all the installation myself, (mounting, cabling, etc.), will Dish allow me to commision this system? If not, why not? (It IS receive only, is it not?)
O2) If I am not allowed to perform the installation myself, how can I evaluate my installer *before* the installation? I care about things like technical skill, code compliance, neatness of installation, dependability and trustworthiness.
O3) How much power does the Easten Arc Antenna draw?
O4) How much power does the ViP722 Receiver draw?
O5) Should I be holding out for the ViP922 with the level of service that I am considering, or is there nothing in that box that I would care about?
O6) What other obvious questions am I not asking? I'm sure there are gotcha's that I don't yet know about...

TIA!

Reg

 

[HDRoberts]

See my attempted answers in bold. Caveat: I'm not a Dish employee or retailer, so I can't speak directly for them.

P1) Is there some way that I can lock in the $24.99/mo. price and avoid the $5.00 increase in February (for at least two years)? Perhaps prepay?
Unfortunately, no. The current theory is the big increase will be due to new HD programming, though.
P2) Is Dish going to charge me a fee for NOT including locals?
No. However, you won't get OTA guide data for the ATSC tuner on the HD receiver.
P3) Is there any way to avoid the additional fee for the DVR, such as owning it myself?
No, Dish charges the DVR fee no matter what. It's supposed to be for the 9-day guide data. Also, the first leased receiver if free to lease (on a monthly basis, may cost something to get a 722, and I'm only talking lease fee, not DVR fee), so there is very little benefit to owning your receiver.
P4) Am I *really* required to connect to a phone line to avoid some fee? Will an ethernet connection suffice? (I don't have a land line anymore, though I do have a phone jack at my entertainment center that will allow calling out through one of three cell phones.)
Ethernet will enable you to avoid this fee.
P5) What other taxes/fees will I see every month? I'm guessing it will be more than just $24.99 + DVR fee...
Depends on your state and local laws. No national satellite tax, of course.
P6) Am I better off purchasing now or is there some incentive for purchasing in February after the rate increase and promotions come into play? Please keep in mind that I don't WANT more programming than TurboHD Bronze.
At CES, Dish announced something about a programming pack being $9.99 for 6 months for the DTV transition, but I do not know for what package
P7) Is there a preferred path to obtain the BEST deal with Dish as a new subscriber? Should I call Dish? Should I call a local installer? Someone else?
See the link to Dishstore at the top of the page. Talk to Claude, a member on this site and a Dish retailer.
P8) Would I be better off waiting until the Greater Depression is in full force before looking for a good deal with Dish?
I don't think anyone will have a good answer.

Antenna questions:

A1) Can I get all of the TurboHD Bronze programming from my location using only the Eastern Arc Antenna?
Yes
A2) Are all 1000.4 antennas Eastern Arc Antennas? If not, how can I tell the difference?
Yes, all 1000.4's receive 61.5, 72.7, and 77. 1000.2's are for the traditional Western arc.
A3) Do I need to point at any satellite farther west than 77W to get TurboHD Bronze? (My strong preference is to install in a location where I cannot point much further west than that.)
No, provided there are no issues getting you Eastern Arc service to begin with (right now it is technically for only specific DMAs, not sure if there are problems outside of those areas). There are futute plans for a sat at 86.5, but we don't know if it is for future EA service or not.

Other questions:

O1) If I purchase the 1000.4 antenna and 722 Receiver on eBay (~$400) and perform all the installation myself, (mounting, cabling, etc.), will Dish allow me to commision this system? If not, why not? (It IS receive only, is it not?)
You should be able to. Others on this site have done so and are more qualified to answer. Be careful with Ebay receivers, though. Make sure they don't a balance on them from Dish, not to mention are actually owned and not leased. I'd buy from Dishstore if I was going to buy.

Not really sure how to answer the below questions
O2) If I am not allowed to perform the installation myself, how can I evaluate my installer *before* the installation? I care about things like technical skill, code compliance, neatness of installation, dependability and trustworthiness.
O3) How much power does the Easten Arc Antenna draw?
O4) How much power does the ViP722 Receiver draw?
O5) Should I be holding out for the ViP922 with the level of service that I am considering, or is there nothing in that box that I would care about?
O6) What other obvious questions am I not asking? I'm sure there are gotcha's that I don't yet know about...

 

[garys]

P1. Not any longer. Dish used to charge yearly rates but the phased them out several years ago.
P2. The package has two prices, one without locals, one with locals included. There is no fee for not having locals.
P3. DVR advantage waives one dvr fee. All Everything Package waives all dvr fees. No other way to waive the fee short of not having a dvr.
P4. Phone line fee (additional receiver fees) are only charged on specific dual tuner receivers. The sd receivers require the phone line as they do not have eithernet connections. HD receivers can use DSL connections to waive the fee.
P5. Sales Tax and maybe the digital home plan protection (usually waived at beginning and maybe added. Just don't remember at what point they try to add it. You can cancel this at any time). Premiums they give you free at the beginning of service (they can also be cancelled at any time), plus any other service purchased
P6. New customers are given leased receivers free. Owning does not give you any savings, except being able to sell the receiver once you cancel. Leasing may require an activation fee (I think it is either $50 or $100) but their is no cancelation fee, or if you sign up with a two year committment, there is no activation fee, but a cancellation fee of about $10 a month for each month left on the committment.
P7. Calling Dish gives the company wide rate, sometimes local installers may be able to give you something extra, but not much.
P8. Dish seems to be giving less and less each year. You shouldn't wait.
A1. EA is available in VA, you need 61.5, 72 and 77 orbital locations, other option would be for 110, 119 and 61.5 using two dishes, but you should be aware of where your HD locals are if you are going to be getting them. VA may be on 77.
A2. Yes, on the Dish 1000.4, the lnb's are not evenly spaced where on the Dish 1000.2 and Dish 1000+, they are spaced very evenly.
A3. Most HD channels are on 61.5 and 72. 77 is currently mostly HD locals.
O1. Commission is paid to recognized installers only. You must be take a test to become an installer for Dish.
O2. Talk to others in your surrounding area that has Dish.
O3 & O4. Don't know for sure, but you will not see that much increase on your power bill if that is what you are concerned with.
O5. Only thing on the 922 (which may not be available until July) would be the built in sling box.
O6. Seems like you put a lot of thought into your questions. Only thing I would add would be channel transmission contracts cause you to loose channels from time to time, but you cannot quit due to a channel being taken down or being changed to a different package if you are still under contract.

 

[RegGuheert]

Thanks, RobertsHD and garys! You guys went way beyond the call of duty to answer my questions, and I really appreciate it! :up

Also, thanks to SatelliteGuys and everyone posting here, as I wouldn't even be able to formulate these questions without all the great information found here!

Here are just a couple of follow-up comments:

P2) Is Dish going to charge me a fee for NOT including locals?
No. However, you won't get OTA guide data for the ATSC tuner on the HD receiver.
P3) Is there any way to avoid the additional fee for the DVR, such as owning it myself?
No, Dish charges the DVR fee no matter what. It's supposed to be for the 9-day guide data. Also, the first leased receiver if free to lease (on a monthly basis, may cost something to get a 722, and I'm only talking lease fee, not DVR fee), so there is very little benefit to owning your receiver.

P2. The package has two prices, one without locals, one with locals included. There is no fee for not having locals.
P3. DVR advantage waives one dvr fee. All Everything Package waives all dvr fees. No other way to waive the fee short of not having a dvr.

My current thinking is to use the DVTPal DVR for the OTAs and use the ViP DVR for the Dish programming. That gives me two OTA tuners (with an option for a third) and two satellite tuners. The only thing that might make me change my thinking would be if I liked the ViP722 SO much better than the DTVPal DVR. According to the excellent information found at DishStore it looks like a 722 is an additional $50 up front, but no other fees.

O3 & O4. Don't know for sure, but you will not see that much increase on your power bill if that is what you are concerned with.

I use solar electric for *some* of my electricity and any constantly-running loads like this are significant. (I have grid power for any overages.) I've read somewhere the ViP722 uses something like 50W and figuring 20W for the receiver would be a constant 70W, or another $4.00/mo. at todays rates for grid electricity.

Including electricity, it looks like I'm at ~$41.00/mo. without locals and perhaps ~$45.00/mo. with locals, assuming $10.00/mo. for DVR advantage. It's certainly not free, or even $25.00 as Dish's website implies! I will need to think this over a little more. I may hold out to see if Dish offers any decent VOD services for the DTVPal DVR, but there seems to have been no mention of that at CES.

If I decide to move ahead, I'll definitely contact Claude at DishStore. Thanks again for all your time and the great information! It's a big help to someone like me trying to make this kind of decision!

Reg

 

[garys]

You should see about the 722k (not sure if this one is out yet). Getting the k module with it will give you OTA with tv1 and a second ota to use with tv2.