Dish satellite signal and OTA signal on common RG-6 cable runs

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Sam Spade

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I want to put Dish Satellite TV signal and OTA Antenna signal on common RG-6 cable runs. Something like the diagram below (also attached). Is this possible to put both signals on common cable runs? If so, what are the technical constraints on the diplexor and splitters? Dish Receivers are: Joey 2.0 and Hopper with Sling

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Magic Static

Magic Static

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:welcome to the forum Sam Spade :)
I'm not the Dish expert here but I can tell you that OTA does not like sharing a cable with satellite. Only the strongest stations will get through. If it's the only option you do what you got to do but you won't like the result so much.
 
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sam_gordon

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:welcome to the forum Sam Spade :)
I'm not the Dish expert here but I can tell you that OTA does not like sharing a cable with satellite. Only the strongest stations will get through. If it's the only option you do what you got to do but you won't like the result so much.
I've combined OTA & sat for 18 years now with a diplexor with no problem. They operate on separate frequencies, so that won't cause a problem.

However, OP, I'm almost positive your drawing won't work because you can't easily split a DBS signal. I don't have time to draw it up right now, but my OTA antenna feeds an amp (to make up for splits & line loss), then hits a splitter. Each output of the splitter feeds one side of a diplexor. The other side of the diplexor is fed direct from the LNB. Single line out of the diplexor to where the TV is and hits another diplexor. That separates the sat & ota. Sat goes into the receiver, OTA goes to another splitter, which feeds both sat rx & the TV.

So I have four diplexors (two for each sat receiver, one to merge the signals and one to separate) and three splitters for OTA (one at my "head end" and one each at the TV/Sat receiver).

Hope this makes sense.
 
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JSheridan

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I've combined OTA & sat for 18 years now with a diplexor with no problem. They operate on separate frequencies, so that won't cause a problem.

However, OP, I'm almost positive your drawing won't work because you can't easily split a DBS signal. I don't have time to draw it up right now, but my OTA antenna feeds an amp (to make up for splits & line loss), then hits a splitter. Each output of the splitter feeds one side of a diplexor. The other side of the diplexor is fed direct from the LNB. Single line out of the diplexor to where the TV is and hits another diplexor. That separates the sat & ota. Sat goes into the receiver, OTA goes to another splitter, which feeds both sat rx & the TV.

So I have four diplexors (two for each sat receiver, one to merge the signals and one to separate) and three splitters for OTA (one at my "head end" and one each at the TV/Sat receiver).

Hope this makes sense.

The MoCA signals on a Hopper system are in the same frequency range as OTA so no, you can not diplex an OTA signal on a Hopper system.
 
zippyfrog

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The MoCA signals on a Hopper system are in the same frequency range as OTA so no, you can not diplex an OTA signal on a Hopper system.

Can you use this setup on a two Wally setup? Right now I have a VIP211k where I send the OTA/Satellite signal down the same cable. Could I take the VIP211k out and replace it with a Wally with no issue? Or is a second cable run necessary for OTA?
 
JSheridan

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Can you use this setup on a two Wally setup? Right now I have a VIP211k where I send the OTA/Satellite signal down the same cable. Could I take the VIP211k out and replace it with a Wally with no issue? Or is a second cable run necessary for OTA?

I haven't diplexed OTA with a Wally yet but it should work the same as it does with your 211K. The Wally's don't communicate with each other or with Joeys so it shouldn't be a problem.
 
TheKrell

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The MoCA signals on a Hopper system are in the same frequency range as OTA so no, you can not diplex an OTA signal on a Hopper system.

When the Hopper first came out, I looked at the bands and JSheridan is correct. But! There is no overlap with the sat signal, even to a hybrid LNB if my understanding is correct. So this raises the obvious question. Can you quash the MoCA signal and then diplex the OTA signal the normal way? Reputedly Joeys work just fine via GigE.
 
HipKat

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When the Hopper first came out, I looked at the bands and JSheridan is correct. But! There is no overlap with the sat signal, even to a hybrid LNB if my understanding is correct. So this raises the obvious question. Can you quash the MoCA signal and then diplex the OTA signal the normal way? Reputedly Joeys work just fine via GigE.
With all the antennas we're doing lately, a few guys have tried and it causes signal loss on the Hopper system, but I think a few have successfully diplexed Wallys. And I believe if you're using a power inserter for the OTA, you want it inline after the Diplexor
 
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DishSubLA

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With all the antennas we're doing lately, a few guys have tried and it causes signal loss on the Hopper system, but I think a few have successfully diplexed Wallys. And I believe if you're using a power inserter for the OTA, you want it inline after the Diplexor
Ah, that's what I was thinking, too: Signal Loss! AFAIK, Dish MoCA 1.1 and 2.0 do NOT operate in the same band as OTA, and all OTA broadcast channels over 39 will soon be taken away from broadcasters, anyway. Now, the DirecTV DECA does, indeed, operate within the OTA band, and it is pointless to combine OTA and DECA because it won't work due to interference.

I believe that ANY implementation of "MoCA" that operates in the OTA band can NOT legally use the MoCA name or trademark (even on menu screens or diagnostic screens) because operating in the OTA band is NOT spec for MoCA. That is why DirecTV's out of spec "MoCA" MUST not carry the MoCA name or trademark--even though DirecTV is part of the Alliance and has rights to implement MoCA, but no right to do so in the OTA band under the name MoCA--so, DirecTV has to call their hardware that operates in the OTA band DECA to avoid licensing dispute. I think there is a sanctioned/official MoCA band that operates in the Satellite IF (MoCA band E or F or something; I don't remember), but that--and hardware--can be legally called MoCA and use the trademark is allowed because it meets MoCA spec, IIRC.

Please feel free to correct me on any of this. I take your word to the bank! :).
 
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DishSubLA

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Hey, HipKat, how are you and other techs installing OTA for Dish services, and are multiple DVR's with OTA included with that install? Every OTA install is unique and can be so tricky.
 
HipKat

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Hey, HipKat, how are you and other techs installing OTA for Dish services, and are multiple DVR's with OTA included with that install? Every OTA install is unique and can be so tricky.
I'm putting them up as a permanent solution. Finding the right spot to install, running new cable to the receiver. Some guys are advising people to look at them as temporary and just either putting them on a pole (without concrete) and running into the house via flat cable - which I totally would never do - and some are just setting the OTA's in the house for temporary install. Of course, I'm anal and use addressweb.org and a compass to point in the right direction to get maximum results.

Here's the one I did at my house, to keep from mounting to the roof and getting up higher than a standard mast

20180910 192122
 
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HipKat

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Doesn't that black cable offend your eye in any way?
Bobby, It is out of sight, you kind've see there are trees back there that hide the back of the house pretty well, and the one I ran doesn't, but the Comcast feed going into the vent is aggravating
 
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DishSubLA

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Bobby, It is out of sight, you kind've see there are trees back there that hide the back of the house pretty well, and the one I ran doesn't, but the Comcast feed going into the vent is aggravating
I agree the vent access is the offending one.
 
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DishSubLA

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I'm putting them up as a permanent solution. Finding the right spot to install, running new cable to the receiver. Some guys are advising people to look at them as temporary and just either putting them on a pole (without concrete) and running into the house via flat cable - which I totally would never do - and some are just setting the OTA's in the house for temporary install. Of course, I'm anal and use addressweb.org and a compass to point in the right direction to get maximum results.

Here's the one I did at my house, to keep from mounting to the roof and getting up higher than a standard mast

View attachment 135261
Well, we need you out here in uglysville! I was aghast at some of the things you stated about how some installers were to approach an OTA install. Shocking! No wonder we get posts of OTA integrated with Dish not being satisfactory. Running new cable to the STB is a nice touch and something a really good installer would do--to make it last and the best possible customer experience. Actually, if some of the lazy installers would do all installs as a permanent solution, there would not have to return to fix things, if they ever do.

Yes, height, and placed outdoor, those are the keys to getting really reliable OTA signal. I know mine should be higher, but I just aint gonna attempt that myself, but I do have to go up and re-point if the winds--usually have to be strong winds--turn the antenna in completely the wrong direction. Sounds like you have pride in your work, which is rare these days. At least you can sleep well at night knowing you did your best.
 
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HipKat

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I agree the vent access is the offending one.
That was there when I moved in, it's the old (unused) Comcast cables. When I put up my dish, I ran all new cable to the living room and use a Wireless Joey for the Bedroom. I rent this house, so I'm leaving it for the next guy to use or deal with
 
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