Extra charge if not connected to phone line?

KKlare

SatelliteGuys Pro
Nov 18, 2003
2,397
13
Los Alamos, NM
They certainly do 1080i, always have. No service does 1080p, if that is what you mean. They convert all signals to your choce of 1080i 720p 480p or 480i, it does not track the channel's choice. The SD (TV2, RF, and composite TV1) outputs are always 480i, even while component and HDMI is set by choice.
-Ken
 

vegassatellite

SatelliteGuys Pro
Pub Member / Supporter
Nov 5, 2007
3,319
174
Phoenix, AZ
I don't cover programming or recurring fees with customers. I do the install in accordance with the terms arranged between myself and the retailer. I don't install phone lines as part of a standard install, that is custom labor. When I call to activate, it's done through the IVR and I always press 2 for no phone line connected, whether it is or not. Once it is activated, I do a call out to verify if the phone jack is working. That call out will get the fee waived and it saves me from having to call back for a phone line bypass. If you ask me about your monthly fee or programming, you are getting referred to the salesmen. I am an installation subcontractor, I put in the system on the work order in a manner mutually acceptable to all parties involved. Running free phone jacks is not acceptable to me so if that is a condition of the order, you can call some HSP hack and hope you don't have fifty holes in your roof by the time he's done.

If you had two separate receivers, your price would be no different than a dual tuner without a phone line connection. Hooking up a phone line is a courtesy to you to get you a discount off the second outlet fee. Does the cable company offer you a way to get digital in a second room with no charge?

I take good care of my customers and go out of my way for them all the time. Someone like you would be the kind of person that gets sent straight to voice mail. I've had customers who loved my work and wanted to hire me back for another project, but I just don't want to deal with that particular person so I'm always busy.
 

Pete Ratowski

SatelliteGuys Family
Lifetime Supporter
Aug 15, 2007
48
6
Tallahassee
PeteRatowski

I currently have 2 receivers. I plan to add a 622 when I get my HDTV. From what I am reading on this thread, I have to either pay Dish $5 per month for not hooking the 622 up to a phone line or hook it up to a phone line and save myself $5 per month. What is the reason for this? I don't really want to participate in "the anybody knowing what I watch program". I don't order pay per view. So what is the purpose of the phone line? If I was a person who is stealing from Dish and sharing with another person, then I would gladly pay the $5 fee per month and save myself or friend the rest of the $100 monthly charge for the service that I receive on my two receivers. This just does not make any sense to me. I would gladly pay $5 if I was going to save the rest of the bill each month. When I signed up for Dish back in July of !997, Charley was telling people on his Chat that you could buy an extra dish and take it to your beach house or mountain cabin and then just take your receiver with you when you left town. We all did this and also took them in the motor homes etc. That is the reason people bought Dish instead of 'Direct TV' whicht always had to be hooked to a phone line all the time. Will somebody please tell me what is so important about the phone line? Thanks.
 

dishcomm

SatelliteGuys Master
Nov 29, 2005
10,381
544
suburbia
I don't cover programming or recurring fees with customers. I do the install in accordance with the terms arranged between myself and the retailer. I don't install phone lines as part of a standard install, that is custom labor. When I call to activate, it's done through the IVR and I always press 2 for no phone line connected, whether it is or not. Once it is activated, I do a call out to verify if the phone jack is working. That call out will get the fee waived and it saves me from having to call back for a phone line bypass. If you ask me about your monthly fee or programming, you are getting referred to the salesmen. I am an installation subcontractor, I put in the system on the work order in a manner mutually acceptable to all parties involved. Running free phone jacks is not acceptable to me so if that is a condition of the order, you can call some HSP hack and hope you don't have fifty holes in your roof by the time he's done.

If you had two separate receivers, your price would be no different than a dual tuner without a phone line connection. Hooking up a phone line is a courtesy to you to get you a discount off the second outlet fee. Does the cable company offer you a way to get digital in a second room with no charge?

I take good care of my customers and go out of my way for them all the time. Someone like you would be the kind of person that gets sent straight to voice mail. I've had customers who loved my work and wanted to hire me back for another project, but I just don't want to deal with that particular person so I'm always busy.
You are singing my tune. These days it seems customers believe their responsibilty is zero. Sales people are doing 50% of their job.
On too many occasions I enter a customer's home only to find that they know next to nothing about their purchase.
IMO, it is incumbent upon the customer to know on what they are spending their money. Also, it is the salesperson's resonsibilty to inform the customers of all details.
The above is not our job. We are not sales people and it is not our job to educate the customers beyond the basic operation of the EQ.
Our fucntion is to cover the deatils of the install ,ensuring the customer approves all aspects of the job before work begins. Install the EQ as stated on the work order.
Our respnsibility is to do a basic install. That is Dish terminology. Anything outside the scope of the work order is deemed "custom' work and is chargable to the customer.
Phone lines are never free. If Dish tries to mandate free hardwire phone lines , they are going to have one helluva time getting contractors like myself to dig even deeper into our pockets. Cat5 is about 133% the cost of single coax. If Dish wants this , they can pay us more for the effort.
Programming fee and availabilty questions I ask the customer to call Dish. . I don't know the monthly rates anyway. I am not paid to be a Dish CSR.
I do neat clean complete work on every job. I do every job to Dish specs and use the proper materials and tools. If the customer has questions about the install I answer them. After all ,it is their home.
That is what I get paid for.
 

vegassatellite

SatelliteGuys Pro
Pub Member / Supporter
Nov 5, 2007
3,319
174
Phoenix, AZ
AMEN!

I had a retailer once in the past that wanted me to explain the promotion to the sub because the salesman wasn't available. I told him he ought to take the commission away from the salesman because I will be including a sales charge on the invoice for performing that service. He said hang on and after about a minute the salesman was calling the customer on their phone. :D
 

Walker1

Supporting Founder
Supporting Founder
Jun 17, 2005
462
0
I called the other day about what it would take to switch out my 625 DVR for another Vip622. The quoted $149 is a bit steep, but I'm still considering it. There were two things that the rep said that caught me off guard and I didn't really understand.

1) He said something about there being a $5 programming access fee if the DVR not connected to a phone line? Huh? Is that true? I don't have either my 625 or Vip622 connected to a phone line at the moment. If I connect them will I suddenly save $10/month?

2) He said that the DVR is not mine... So, I spend $149 for what? The right to use it? Don't they also charge a monthly fee?

Not sure if I just misunderstood the rep, but some of it didn't sound quite right to me.

Thanks for any insights,
Craig

They told me the same thing. The reason I was given was they want to know WHERE the unit is @ all times. I don't care either way so I just plugged it into a phone jack. Why would anybody pay $5/mo. for that??:cool:
 

skottey

SatelliteGuys Pro
Feb 10, 2007
1,826
0
Denver Metro, CO
I don't cover programming or recurring fees with customers. I do the install in accordance with the terms arranged between myself and the retailer. I don't install phone lines as part of a standard install, that is custom labor. When I call to activate, it's done through the IVR and I always press 2 for no phone line connected, whether it is or not. Once it is activated, I do a call out to verify if the phone jack is working. That call out will get the fee waived and it saves me from having to call back for a phone line bypass. If you ask me about your monthly fee or programming, you are getting referred to the salesmen. I am an installation subcontractor, I put in the system on the work order in a manner mutually acceptable to all parties involved. Running free phone jacks is not acceptable to me so if that is a condition of the order, you can call some HSP hack and hope you don't have fifty holes in your roof by the time he's done.

If you had two separate receivers, your price would be no different than a dual tuner without a phone line connection. Hooking up a phone line is a courtesy to you to get you a discount off the second outlet fee. Does the cable company offer you a way to get digital in a second room with no charge?

I take good care of my customers and go out of my way for them all the time. Someone like you would be the kind of person that gets sent straight to voice mail. I've had customers who loved my work and wanted to hire me back for another project, but I just don't want to deal with that particular person so I'm always busy.

I understand your point and agree with a lot of what you are saying. I am in the service business too, fixing computers is my business. I get a lot of bizarre requests for non computer/network related things, and I will help in any way I can depending on whether I know something about it and how much time I have. I bill by the hour, so if they want to play checkers with me it is on them.

Anyway, having that said. There is a huge difference between installing a new jack and putting in a two way splitter to an existing phone line and connecting up the 622 or 722. My biggest complaint wasn't the installer, it was the fact that nobody along the way (sales, installer,etc) explained that I would need a phone line hooked up to avoid $5. I feel that they should make it a point to stress that at all levels. Because really, you may not care but a billing cycle or two later the customer is going to think, "what a jerk, why didn't that installer tell me this."

Now, I have just recently inquired about consolidating my 211 and old standard boxes, and getting a second 622. They advised me that it would be $149, and explained the monthly fees as I would be losing the $5 and $6 for the boxes I have now, and would only be hit with a $5.98 fee for the second 622, as long as it is hooked up to the phone line (or Ethernet) That is right. Customer service is finally on the ball with the $5 fee if you aren't hooked up via phone or Ethernet. He must have told me three times. When I had my initial install last spring there was no mention of the $5. I was never billed for it but after plugging in Ethernet and removing it to change my room around, I started getting popups threatening to charge me the fee if I didn't hook it up to something.

Hey guys... as long as the Dish sales people mention this fee like they should, it is all good. Think about it. I know how to hook up my own phone lines but if I didn't, and if I needed a phone jack in the room with the 622, I could plan on having it installed prior to the Dish install, if I knew it was required to waive the fee. Right? So it is all good as long as sales stays on top of their responsibility and speaks up about this issue. They must have had a big push in a sales meeting to mention this to the customer. because at least that one guy was better about it.

Thanks.
 

skottey

SatelliteGuys Pro
Feb 10, 2007
1,826
0
Denver Metro, CO
I currently have 2 receivers. I plan to add a 622 when I get my HDTV. From what I am reading on this thread, I have to either pay Dish $5 per month for not hooking the 622 up to a phone line or hook it up to a phone line and save myself $5 per month. What is the reason for this? I don't really want to participate in "the anybody knowing what I watch program". I don't order pay per view. So what is the purpose of the phone line? If I was a person who is stealing from Dish and sharing with another person, then I would gladly pay the $5 fee per month and save myself or friend the rest of the $100 monthly charge for the service that I receive on my two receivers. This just does not make any sense to me. I would gladly pay $5 if I was going to save the rest of the bill each month. When I signed up for Dish back in July of !997, Charley was telling people on his Chat that you could buy an extra dish and take it to your beach house or mountain cabin and then just take your receiver with you when you left town. We all did this and also took them in the motor homes etc. That is the reason people bought Dish instead of 'Direct TV' whicht always had to be hooked to a phone line all the time. Will somebody please tell me what is so important about the phone line? Thanks.

I don't fully understand it either, even though I am always on these threads and there are a lot of threads about this topic. I don't order PPV either. I have heard a lot of answers but none of which make a lot of sense. They basically see it as, "hey man, you don't have two boxes, you have one, so you are only paying for one," which is where the logic stops, "but you want this configuration you have to have the box phone home to waive the fee of $5 for the second TV." Doesn't make sense. My biggest beef with them on this wasn't the rule itself, but the lack of salespeople telling us about it. I had no idea in my situation.

If you have high speed Internet (cable, DSL, wimax or whatever) in your home, get a router (which is something you should get anyway) and hook it up to the Ethernet port on the 622. Then you can avoid the phone line. Otherwise, just put in a phone splitter ($2 Big Lots or Dollar General, $100+ Radioshack) on your nearest phone and connect it to that line. You don't need a special phone jack.

I don't even have a phone in the wing of my house that has the 622. The nearest phone line (we have 4) is in the office near the front of the house. I have VoIP and use a cordless phone. It really is not that uncommon this day in age to not have your whole house wired for RJ11, now is it guys? I have Ethernet and Internet all over the house for all the devices (phones, video games, cable boxes, sat boxes, computers, servers, dog food dish, etc).
 

skottey

SatelliteGuys Pro
Feb 10, 2007
1,826
0
Denver Metro, CO
They told me the same thing. The reason I was given was they want to know WHERE the unit is @ all times. I don't care either way so I just plugged it into a phone jack. Why would anybody pay $5/mo. for that??:cool:

They want to know where the unit is at all times? How stupid. There are so many ways around this. Stupid reasoning. Anybody that was going to put it in a relatives home would just eat the $5 and have it never call out, giving an entire household the same programming package for $5/month. On the flip side, the honest people are stuck paying the fee too. Makes zero sense.
 

vegassatellite

SatelliteGuys Pro
Pub Member / Supporter
Nov 5, 2007
3,319
174
Phoenix, AZ
I don't see the problem with keeping the price of a two-room box the same as two rooms each with separate boxes. The customer pays no more than they would have if they had two separate boxes. The PL Fee is not a "fee" its a discount you get off the normal two-room price. Problem is when salesmen don't explain it and quote the system as a one room price. Those types of salesmen are pigs and couldn't ever sell a system on its merits anyway.

Fortunately, I work for retailers that quote it with a two room price. That allows me to upsell phone lines and other items by being able to offer to cut their bill for them. Its always a pleasant surprise when I tell them that the phone hookup will save them some money.
 

Tampa8

Supporting Founder - I'll stand up and say so
Pub Member / Supporter
Lifetime Supporter
Sep 8, 2003
18,065
7,604
Tampa/Eastern Ct
I have followed this thread as I do most threads on Dish for awhile. My question is, it seems Dish is in effect allowing you not to have certain recievers hooked up to a phone as the contract appears to requier, at a cost of $5 per month. Does that mean their security department has no bussiness contacting you and making you give info on each of these certain recievers while on the phone and if you don't turn off your recievers?
 

Tyralak

SatelliteGuys Master
Oct 21, 2003
5,702
167
Secure, Undisclosed Location
I don't see the problem with keeping the price of a two-room box the same as two rooms each with separate boxes. The customer pays no more than they would have if they had two separate boxes. The PL Fee is not a "fee" its a discount you get off the normal two-room price. Problem is when salesmen don't explain it and quote the system as a one room price. Those types of salesmen are pigs and couldn't ever sell a system on its merits anyway.

No, you're wrong. It's only a "discount" if the customer was quoted and sold on the full price as if phone lines were NOT connected, THEN told by the sales rep they could save $5 by connecting it. It is by definition an ADDED fee if they're quoted the discounted price and not told this price is only valid if the phone line is connected. It's very simple logic.
 

vegassatellite

SatelliteGuys Pro
Pub Member / Supporter
Nov 5, 2007
3,319
174
Phoenix, AZ
No, you're wrong. It's only a "discount" if the customer was quoted and sold on the full price as if phone lines were NOT connected, THEN told by the sales rep they could save $5 by connecting it. It is by definition an ADDED fee if they're quoted the discounted price and not told this price is only valid if the phone line is connected. It's very simple logic.

The cost of a dual-tuner is no greater than the cost of two separate receivers. With a phone line connected, the customer gets the benefit of two rooms of service without having to pay a fee for service in the second room. That in itself is a discount over the normal price of two rooms of service.

Salesmen should always be explaining the full costs of a product and not assuming anything. It is much easier to quote the higher price and then explain how to get that price reduced than to tell someone a lower price and then say they will have to pay more because of condition not being met. That's how the retailers I sub for explain it to the customer. They always state the full price and not some conditional lower price. I stopped working for sleight-of-hand retailers because it makes my customers think I am somehow involved in their bill being $10 bucks higher. This also makes it that much harder to get these customers to be repeats of mine.
 

Tyralak

SatelliteGuys Master
Oct 21, 2003
5,702
167
Secure, Undisclosed Location
The cost of a dual-tuner is no greater than the cost of two separate receivers. With a phone line connected, the customer gets the benefit of two rooms of service without having to pay a fee for service in the second room. That in itself is a discount over the normal price of two rooms of service.

Indeed it is. And a good discount, but it's all in the sale. It's only a discount if the customer is aware of the full cost, and know the price they're quoted is the discounted rate. If the customer is told their bill will be $49.99 a month, and was never told there needed to be a phone line connected to get that price, then their first bill comes and it's $59.99. Then they're told when they call to find out what the additional $10 is for that they have to connect to a phone line to get that rate, that constitutes an added fee. That's at best. At worst it constitutes a bait and switch.

Salesmen should always be explaining the full costs of a product and not assuming anything. It is much easier to quote the higher price and then explain how to get that price reduced than to tell someone a lower price and then say they will have to pay more because of condition not being met. That's how the retailers I sub for explain it to the customer. They always state the full price and not some conditional lower price. I stopped working for sleight-of-hand retailers because it makes my customers think I am somehow involved in their bill being $10 bucks higher. This also makes it that much harder to get these customers to be repeats of mine.

I agree fully. At least 80% of the customers I install for every day have not had the phone line mentioned to them. I shouldn't be the first person they hear about it from. I'm sick of cleaning up the salesperson's mess because they didn't want to jeperodize the sale by telling the truth about all the fees. Most of the ommissions come from sales partners.
 

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