Fine Tuning A Mesh Dish - Would it be Worth It?

[jsattv]

I have recently purchased a new Sat Receiver and reception previously has been okay on a number of C and Ku Band Satellites from 55.0W over to 121.0W. Actually most Satellites to the West Side are very well set up. BUT I have never been able to get 125.0W on KU Band unless I do a major change to the Dish's Declination Settings. Unfortunately, I have found in the past after many hours of adjusting, if I do that when I drive the Dish back to my South Sat - 97.0W it is almost completely out of Calibration.

Yesterday I put my Digital Level on the Dish. The upper Bar or Elevation = 57.6, the Lower Bar or Declination = 50.8. For my Location the ideal is 57.18 - 50.57 = 6.61. So right now I'm at 57.6 - 50.8 = 6.8 which is close to the objective. My level will not go to 2 decimal places so ideally I'm looking for 57.2 - 50.6 = 6.60 degrees. I have spent hours where when I had 97.0W at ideal setup the rest of the Sats in the Arc were not as good as they are coming in now, ie adjust for Best overall reception for East to West Satellites.

My question: Should I slightly tweak my Elevation Setting (Small Upper Bar) from it's 57.6 position back to the Ideal of 57.2. See attached Pics. Then adjust the Big Bar or Main Axis to as close as possible to its ideal of 50.6 for best Satellite Reception? Any comments would be greatly appreciated.

 

[Phoxx]

Just a though: If you rotate the dish on your pole to the west maybe the east sats will come in better. A very slight adjustment east/west may be the answer. Don't mess with the declination it is most likely at the optimum.

 

[bill42]

Am curious how do you set the angles to a decimal point? I must use the wrong type of equipment because I'm happy just getting down within a degree.

 

[Lak7]

Am curious how do you set the angles to a decimal point?

Digital Angle Finder, something like....
harborfreight.com/digital-angle-gauge-95998.html

 

[Lak7]

BUT I have never been able to get 125.0W on KU Band unless I do a major change to the Dish's Declination Settings.

What adjustment are you making? Raising or Lowering.

 

[jsattv]

What adjustment are you making? Raising or Lowering.

Lak 7 thanks for the reply, not sure what you mean, ie adjustment for tweaking my current Elevation Setting, or when I am trying to adjust to pull in 125.0W. I last tried for 125.0W over a year ago - I think I lowered the Declination Setting on the Big Bar and got it with a good signal, but when I tried to return to my True South Sat 97.0W I could Barely get a signal on it. And I had to readjust all over again - it took hours to get things reasonably back again.

 

[jsattv]

Am curious how do you set the angles to a decimal point? I must use the wrong type of equipment because I'm happy just getting down within a degree.

Bill42 go to Sears in the tool section look for: Craftsman Multi-function Digital Level / its a 10 inch level approx $50.00.

 

[FaT Air]

Do you have a button hook feed (single support pipe emanating from center of the dish) ? If so, It may not be centered well, and may actually move it's position as you move the dish. This will present nothing but headaches trying to get the arc. Guy wires installed to hold the feed centered are necessary if this is the case.
BTW, are you near 47 north, where the declination is 6.6 degrees?

 

[Lak7]

or when I am trying to adjust to pull in 125.0W.

Yes, when trying to get 125.
Before making any adjustments, I always double check for any loose bolts, on the Arm and the Mount. A floppy Dish makes for a long day.

Double check the signal on 2 Sats, about the same distance from your True South Sat, see if Raising or Lowering the Elevation makes any improvement - make notes of moves / improvements
Then you rotate the mount so that the same adjustment (up or down) is needed for both sides.
A little bit goes a long way when rotating the mount!!!!!
Be sure to make a reference point so you can return if need be.
Then make a declination adjustment if needed.

Scroll to the bottom for a Pic of Tracking errors.....
Footprints by Dish Size - Adjusting the Polar Mount for Prime Focus Antenna - C/Ku-Band Satellite Systems - Tuning, Tracking, Azimuth, Elevation, Declination Angles, F/D Ratio, Focal Distance, Inclinometer, LNB/Feedhorn Assembly, Actuator Assembly, C

 

[jsattv]

Yes, when trying to get 125.
Before making any adjustments, I always double check for any loose bolts, on the Arm and the Mount. A floppy Dish makes for a long day.

Double check the signal on 2 Sats, about the same distance from your True South Sat, see if Raising or Lowering the Elevation makes any improvement - make notes of moves / improvements
Then you rotate the mount so that the same adjustment (up or down) is needed for both sides.
A little bit goes a long way when rotating the mount!!!!!
Be sure to make a reference point so you can return if need be.
Then make a declination adjustment if needed.

Scroll to the bottom for a Pic of Tracking errors.....
Footprints by Dish Size - Adjusting the Polar Mount for Prime Focus Antenna - C/Ku-Band Satellite Systems - Tuning, Tracking, Azimuth, Elevation, Declination Angles, F/D Ratio, Focal Distance, Inclinometer, LNB/Feedhorn Assembly, Actuator Assembly, C

Thanks for the advice Lak7. I have seen that Geo orbit writeup and read it extensively maybe I need to Review it, thanks. As we speak I am about to finish Scanning in the 2nd of the 2 Adjacent Satellites to 97.0W, ie 99.0W was done 2 days ago and 95.0W will be done next. I've never had any problems with scanning these 2 Sats in, as well as ALL the Sats to the East as far as 50.0W, but I am a little leary about loosening the Bolts and moving the Dish and Mount, I can chalk the current location but when using a hand held compass and looking at my South direction on 97.0W,- it looks dead on. I have a Trimax Sat Meter to measure the S and Q of each Sat and was going to slightly move Declination from 57.8 to 57.2 and then adjust Elevation from 50.8 down to 50.7 and check for Best Signal Quality while adjusting the Elevation - Big Bar adjustments. I know these adjustments have to be very small - no more than 1/2 a thread or the Dish can really get out of Alignment. However if moving the Positioning of the Dish on the Pole East or West is best way to start then I will try it.

 

[jsattv]

Do you have a button hook feed (single support pipe emanating from center of the dish) ? If so, It may not be centered well, and may actually move it's position as you move the dish. This will present nothing but headaches trying to get the arc. Guy wires installed to hold the feed centered are necessary if this is the case.
BTW, are you near 47 north, where the declination is 6.6 degrees?

Thanks FaT Air, my Latitude = +49.92, Longitude = -97.05 (Winnipeg in Canada). Not using a Buttonhook I have 2 Norsats for C and KU Band, see pics

 

[jsattv]

Just a though: If you rotate the dish on your pole to the west maybe the east sats will come in better. A very slight adjustment east/west may be the answer. Don't mess with the declination it is most likely at the optimum.

Thanks for the info Phoxx.

 

[FaT Air]

you are north of me so your declination should be greater than mine, according to my chart you should have 7.3 degrees.(49.92 is close enough to 50 lat) I'm at 48 n and have mine at 7.1 degrees.
Think this may be your problem. BUD Manual Take a look at the declination chart ( i've used this chart since "The Day"

 

[jsattv]

you are north of me so your declination should be greater than mine, according to my chart you should have 7.3 degrees.(49.92 is close enough to 50 lat) I'm at 48 n and have mine at 7.1 degrees.
Think this may be your problem. BUD Manual Take a look at the declination chart ( i've used this chart since "The Day"

Fat Air not sure of your location but according to the chart on the Geo orbit page, another set of Sat Charts I need to look up, as well as info I saw on Shaun Kenny's Video my ideal Declination for Winnipeg, Manitoba, Canada is: 57.18 - 50.57 = 6.61 degrees. So 57.2 - 50.6 = 6.6 is what I'm aiming for.

Finally found it, if you look on the Satellite finder with magnet north, azimuth & elevation calculator - http://www.satsig.net/ssazelm.htm that I got from Linuxman you can calculate your correct "Polar mount dish offset tilt" in degrees. You can also check your exact Lat & Long re the Map on that site.

 

[Lak7]

As we speak I am about to finish Scanning in the 2nd of the 2 Adjacent Satellites to 97.0W, ie 99.0W was done 2 days ago and 95.0W will be done next.

I should have been more specific....
Try using Sats the are about 10 degrees from your Center.

 

[FaT Air]

What can I say? learned something new. May have to try it myself, see if there's any marked improvement. Both C on the BUD and Ku on the .7m attached to the lip of the BUD. Works well as is-S2 included, 61 to 127 Ku and 53 to 137 on C (139W is in the neighbors treetops) My thinking, at this time, is the most noticeable improvement may be on a BUD operating in Ku as the beam-width can be quite narrow.

 

[trinity13]

I'm late to the party, but here is what I would try.
First adjust the declination for best signal/quality at one end, say 55W.
Then move to 121W and repeat for it.
Then, split the difference (adjust the declination halfway between the two).
Then go to your southern satellite and adjust the dish on the pole for the best signal.
That should get you close to being spot on.
May need to make minor adjustments to peak.

 

[jsattv]

Thanks for the comments guys. Have dialed in 97.0W (my true South Sat) as well as 99.0W on C Band, and 95.0W on KU Band. The Quality Numbers are 80% for 95.0W and on 99.0W up to 100% for 2 Tp's. I did have to move the Dish 10 ticks to the East when I Reset the V Box III for zero. This is a mystery as it seems that 95.0W and 99.0W are coming in stronger than 99.0W?? Going to check a few Sats farther to the East & West Before doing anything major. Wonder if could be that the AZbox is that much better than the Viewsat Rx? Trying 125.0W on KU Band will definately tell me what is happening!

 

[Lak7]

I did have to move the Dish 10 ticks to the East when I Reset the V Box III for zero.

Yes, anytime you make any adjustment, you will have to adjust the VBox too, and possibly for each Sat position, that's normal.

 

[jsattv]

Adjusted Declination again today from 57.7 to 57.3 with snow on the Mesh Dish. Also Adjusted Inclination down to 51.1 using the Sears Digital Level. Had a bit of trouble in that it the bottom Declination Nut was almost welded in place and took some effort to finally move it down and move the upper Nut as well.

So now I have 57.3 - 51.1 = 6.2 degrees Declination. (Objective is 57.2 - 50.6 = 6.6 degrees). It's still not at optminum but 5 Satellites are now dialed in: 97.0W, 95.0W, 99.0W, 101.0W. and 103.0W. Reception on 97.0W is about 10 points better, but it had really gotten worse in the last week or so with the heavy rain & now the colder weather setting in. I think I still need to keep adjusting Inclination more to get it from its current 51.1 to approx 50.6 or 50.7 but have some concerns about making sure everything doesn't get out of whack. At least the Inclination Nuts are a lot easier to adjust than those 2 Declination Nuts. Could also add more Satellites East and West to see how things are lining up on the Satellite Arc. Any suggestions would be helpful.