Future of C-band Radio Content Distribution

[freddylq]

Comptech,

I think most of the younger generation today, is basically too lazy to take part in our hobby.
They can get instant gratification by streaming. They don't possess the thrill of the search for feeds, like we have. They are too impatient.
Ours is a dying hobby that only we can appreciate, for what it allowed us to do.

John

Most younger people I know don't even know what an OTA antenna is. I still use two of them for recording OTA programming with my Tablos

 

[navychop]

Ham Radio.

 

[k4otl]

Ham Radio.

There are some younger people into Amateur radio that I know, as well as GMRS. OTA and FTA just don't seem to penetrate us youngsters as well (which is odd since OTA is easy)

 

[N5XZS]

You know that's interesting to see tons of young people talking about ham radio on Reddit forums.

So there's no shortage of young people nowadays getting into ham radio with the POTA craze going on nowdays!!

 

[comfortably_numb]

OTA and FTA just don't seem to penetrate us youngsters as well (which is odd since OTA is easy)

I suspect to them that tech feels a little like being analog in a digital world, and that's "old." I was born in 1979 so I've been on both sides of the coin. My daughter however, was born in 2003 and never experienced the "other" world.

And yes, I'm cognizant of the fact that both OTA and FTA are digital now.. but I hope my analogy makes sense

 

[telstar_1]

The guy in the video said that the FCC was going to auction off the rest of C-band. If that means radio is going away then so is TVRO?

C-band TVRO (been awhile since I've seen that term) has been gone for years now, hasn't it? I mean as a subscription service.

 

[EarDemon]

Comptech,

I think most of the younger generation today, is basically too lazy to take part in our hobby.
They can get instant gratification by streaming. They don't possess the thrill of the search for feeds, like we have. They are too impatient.
Ours is a dying hobby that only we can appreciate, for what it allowed us to do.

John

That is a very broad way of looking at it. But why is that a bad thing? Who wants to mess around and waste time looking for feeds? If you enjoy the thrill of the hunt, that's fine, I get it. But if you just want to sit down and watch something after a long day at work, why would you want to bother?

I'm not so young anymore, as I will be hitting the big 4-0 in a few months, been following the DTH satellite/DBS industry since a pre-teen when Primestar was still in existence and if I wanted to see my Sunday morning nicktoons on DirecTV I would have also needed a USSB subscription. At 12/13/14 years old I could tell if a house had Dish Network or DirecTV, not just by the style of the LNB but by the angle the dish was pointing, if it appeared to be pointing at 119 or 101. When we would take trips into Canada, I could point out BEV dishes that appeared to be pointed at 101 for DirecTV instead of Nimiq 1.

There were many times I toyed with the idea of getting into c-band and Ka/Ku band, but even as I was coming up, what was a niche hobby was becoming even more niche and by the time I was able to afford getting into the hobby there would have been no point.

It's all about the content, content is king. Wild feeds for sports and news would have been fun I guess, but outside of NASCAR in the '90s I hate sports. I have never been able to find enough compelling (to me) content to justify the expense, in both time and money, to get into c-band, FTA or anything similar. Most of what's out there seemed to be either, religious programming, foreign language programming or old stuff. The only old TV show I care to watch is Twilight Zone, and I have the entire series on blu ray. To my knowledge, there is almost zero content that would be exclusive to non-DBS satellite, that I would be interested in. So why would I want to bother with it?

Your hobby, is now feeding my hobby. For the past handful of years, I've become enamored with cellular technology. I enjoy comparing coverage, data speeds and overall quality of network between the three carriers. C-band, aka n77, has provided a huge boost to the cellular speeds and provided huge network capacity upgrades to Verizon and to a lesser extent AT&T. It was never going to be a reality that mmWave would be deployed in large scale outside of densely populated urban areas, but thanks to c-band I can get a 1.5 Gbps in rural areas on VZ and around a gig on AT&T. It all comes full circle, a portion of a set of frequencies that once provided rural folks with an opportunity to watch TV have been recycled for modern 21st​ century use to provide extreme high speed data and communication to those same areas.

 

[comfortably_numb]

Who wants to mess around and waste time looking for feeds? If you enjoy the thrill of the hunt, that's fine, I get it.

Me.

 

[EarDemon]

And you are just one person, one person with a hobby and interest that very few other people share. What was never really a mainstream thing, has become incredibly niche and gets more niche by the day. I'm not knocking it, I'm just stating that obvious.

In the next few hours there will be what about a dozen NFL games going on? There will be hundreds of thousands of people in and around those stadiums that will be using c-band frequencies on their phones. More than have used it for video in decades.

 

[comfortably_numb]

And you are just one person, one person with a hobby and interest that very few other people share

This whole site is built around the hobby.. so is Rick's, Legit FTA, Sat Universe, and Linuxsat. I'm not offended, you can like whatever hobby you want. And I'm not "just one person," otherwise there wouldn't be lots of FTA receivers still being sold.

 

[EarDemon]

It's still an extremely small and getting smaller subset of people.

In all likelihood, I could probably go out to Highmark Stadium right now and find more people using a C band data connection to upload and livestream drunken stupidness and table smashing then there are people active in those online communities.

 

[k4otl]

This whole site is built around the hobby.. so is Rick's, Legit FTA, Sat Universe, and Linuxsat. I'm not offended, you can like whatever hobby you want. And I'm not "just one person," otherwise there wouldn't be lots of FTA receivers still being sold.

Agreed, and an analogy: There's lots of hobbies with a smaller following as time goes on. Not necessarily a hobby of mine but I like using older equipment (chainsaws, lawnmowers, tractors, etc) that most people give away free or really cheap because it just needs a rebuilt carburetor (I like old B&S engines). I think in general people are lazy because they can be. 50-100 years ago you couldn't afford to throw things away and buy new. I think new (non-electronic) equipment is crap anyway, and I'm cheap. Just an analogy. There's still a few around that hand-forge tools or make leather for harnesses, old stuff never truly dies, it's just largely forgotten amongst the general sheep, I mean public.

 

[k4otl]

It's still an extremely small and getting smaller subset of people.

In all likelihood, I could probably go out to Highmark Stadium right now and find more people using a C band data connection to upload and livestream drunken stupidness and table smashing then there are people active in those online communities.

And that's more useful than reliable C band satellite radio/TV delivery? Ultimately this is all a debate that I would categroize as a First World Problem. I think mobile internet is a luxury (TV is also a luxury). Having 1 Gbps mobile internet? That's just overkill. I'm 26 and got into FTA within the past year or so and have loved it. I did OTA first and enjoy paying nothing. I will not pay for commercials or to be tracked.
Do I like the march of 5G stamping on C-band's face? No. Will I live w/o C band? Yes

Worst case? I'll keep reading books

 

[comfortably_numb]

It's still an extremely small and getting smaller subset of people.

Then I would suggest a large donation to Satelliteguys to see that it continues on.

 

[cpalmer2k]

One major factor in the evolution away from things like FTA and OTA is the fact that most young people can find whatever they're interested in via streaming services nowadays, and don't really have an incentive to get into FTA or even OTA if you live outside of a metro area where signals are easily received.

I'll admit being guilty of that myself. Our OTA antenna has been messed up since Hurricane Helene, and I've considered putting up a new one several times but just can't motivate myself to do it. I live in an area where we have access to two markets, both with somewhat challenging to receive signals for some stations. By the time I buy a good antenna, pre-amp, etc. I'll have several hundred dollars in it. Plus with ATSC 3.0 coming along there is no guarantee I'll be able to DVR or do anything with that programming I'm receiving in a few years.

The same is true with FTA. You need the knowledge of how to set it up, the $$ and access to the equipment, and then you have to hunt down the stuff you want to watch and hope it ultimately isn't encrypted. I understand the thrill of the hunt in finding wild feeds, and see where that could be a great hobby if you have the knowledge, equipment, etc. It's definitely a niche hobby at this point though, especially with the constant shifting of more and more feeds to IP solutions.

For younger people, the nefarious IPTV services are basically today's modern version of FTA only with a lot less work. Pretty much everyone knows someone who has a firestick loaded with a subscription that gives access to virtually every major network for a few bucks a month. It's the modern equivalent of the old hacked access card days of the late 1990's.

 

[comfortably_numb]

The same is true with FTA. You need the knowledge of how to set it up, the $$ and access to the equipment, and then you have to hunt down the stuff you want to watch and hope it ultimately isn't encrypted. I understand the thrill of the hunt in finding wild feeds, and see where that could be a great hobby if you have the knowledge, equipment, etc. It's definitely a niche hobby at this point though, especially with the constant shifting of more and more feeds to IP solutions.

For younger people, the nefarious IPTV services are basically today's modern version of FTA only with a lot less work. Pretty much everyone knows someone who has a firestick loaded with a subscription that gives access to virtually every major network for a few bucks a month. It's the modern equivalent of the old hacked access card days of the late 1990's.

All of these things are true, and I agree. I just don't appreciate those (not you) who disparage others for a hobby they enjoy, even if it is a niche or in decline. I have a friend who enjoys model railroading and refinishing brass model train cars. That's a niche hobby and I would never insult his hobby even though I don't enjoy it or care for it. And his hobby is definitely a small group of people and in decline.

 

[comfortably_numb]

I'm 26 and got into FTA within the past year or so and have loved it

And you've made valuable contributions to the site.. IIRC you discovered the V9 Prime and its low symbol rate capabilities, so thank you for that!

 

[navychop]

no guarantee I'll be able to DVR

Oh, I think there's a pretty strong guarantee that in a few years we will NOT be able to DVR like we do today.

 

[norman881]

And you are just one person, one person with a hobby and interest that very few other people share. What was never really a mainstream thing, has become incredibly niche and gets more niche by the day. I'm not knocking it, I'm just stating that obvious.

In the next few hours there will be what about a dozen NFL games going on? There will be hundreds of thousands of people in and around those stadiums that will be using c-band frequencies on their phones. More than have used it for video in decades.

You post like a troll.

 

[EarDemon]

And that's more useful than reliable C band satellite radio/TV delivery? Ultimately this is all a debate that I would categroize as a First World Problem. I think mobile internet is a luxury (TV is also a luxury). Having 1 Gbps mobile internet? That's just overkill. I'm 26 and got into FTA within the past year or so and have loved it. I did OTA first and enjoy paying nothing. I will not pay for commercials or to be tracked.
Do I like the march of 5G stamping on C-band's face? No. Will I live w/o C band? Yes

Worst case? I'll keep reading books

I never said it was more useful, I'm just stating how things are. But yes, as we move toward the end of the 2020s and into the 2030s, and the methods of content distribution continue to evolve many, many more people will be using C band via cellular than they would have (directly or indirectly) versus c-band via satellite.

And no, 1 Gbps mobile internet is not overkill. When you get 50, 60, 70,000 people in a small area, having a multi-layered mobile solution with appropriate backhaul will ensure that everyone has a consistent and good experience. It's all about capacity and c-band provides that capacity. Thanks to c-band, a friend of mine who lives less than a half a mile from Highmark Stadium can now use his cell phone again during Bills home games and concerts. And while I personally would never use cellular for my primary home internet connection, c-band is giving people choice.

A water tower right next to where I work has had Verizon n77 panels installed on it and they went live within the past 6 months. On the fringe areas of the campus of my government facility where it would be too difficult to install wireless access points, my users can now get 200 – 300 Mbps via mobile hotspots, versus the handful of Mbps they used to get on LTE band 5 or 13. We are also going to be getting Plum Cases for emergency response sometime in 2026, I do not know if these will have c-band capabilities, but if they do, that could be potentially life saving.

Many more people will feel the benefits of c-band being something used for cellular communication versus something used for satellite delivery.

As big as a fan I am of c-band being reallocated for 5G. Seeing my work phone lite up with 5G UW inspired me to get a personal Verizon line on a secondary eSIM and wow more and more n77 is coming on. It's a good thing.