Harmony 880 and VIP 622 Revisited

denisincalif

SatelliteGuys Pro
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Pub Member / Supporter
Oct 1, 2007
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Arcadia, CA
Based on mostly positive reviews of the Logitech Harmony 880 Universal Remote that I saw in a couple of threads here (there were a few negative reviews, I admit), I bought the 880 over Christmas. I can see that it has great potential, but getting it set up to my taste has been a struggle, and I still don't have everything I want.

I set up three activities, "Watch TV", "Watch DVD" and "Watch Movie", The "Watch DVD" and "Watch Movie" activities do not involve the 622, and they worked fine on my first try. The "Watch TV" activity turned on the TV and set it to the correct input (the 622). But it did not power on the 622. On my first try I did not tell the 880 I had a 622. Based on advice from another thread I told it I had a 942. When that failed completely I went back and redefined "Watch TV" using the 622. That had no effect at all. The 622 would not respond to the 880. So I called customer support. They were helpful, and walked me through teaching the Harmony a few commands (Power Toggle and two others). After the third command the Harmony web site said that it had found a better command set and switched to it. Now the "Watch TV" activity worked.

I wanted to redefine three of the hard keys to be "DVR", "Swap", and "View Live TV". "DVR" was available from the soft keys, but to use the soft keys you have to be in device mode controlling the 622, and then commands to the TV (volume control and mute) don't work without switching the device to TV---a real pain.

Setting the lower left key to be "DVR" was a breeze, because the DVR command is available on the pop up list of 622 commands on the web site. But neither "Swap" nor "View Live TV" appeared in the list. So I thought I would try to teach those commands to the 880 using my original 622 remote. Here I ran into two problems. Based on my reading of the (very sketchy) User Manual, it looks like you can only "teach" soft keys. Yet, based on some comments on older threads, and based on the fact that with Customer Support's help I had taught the Harmony 3 commands, I decided to go ahead and try to teach a hard key. I immediately received an error message saying that the Harmony cannot learn from the 622 remote!!! I was unable to get past this message.

It looks like I will have to go back to customer support. But that is very inconvenient for me because I am normally not home during the support center's hours.

I am disappointed that this device has such problems communicating with the 622. It has absolutely no trouble with my Samsung BD-UP5000 DVD player or my Sony dual DVD/VHS player.

I wonder why so many commands on the 622 remote do not show up in the Harmony web site's pop up list. "Swap" and "View Live TV" seem like basic commands to me, but they do not appear in Harmony's list. There is a command called simply "View" in the list. Is that actually "View Live TV"? I haven't had a chance to try it yet. There is nothing resembling "Swap" on the list.

I also wonder why such a basic command as "DVR" is assigned a soft key in the default set up, even though two hard keys are not assigned to anything!

Finally, I am wondering why so many people here say this device is simple to set up and does everything they want with their 622. Are there multiple 622 command sets in the Logitech database? Am I just unlucky to have stumbled on a non-optimal list? If so, how can I access a better list? And if there are multiple command sets, what did I do wrong to wind up with such a poor set?
 
I've had no problems with the 622 and my Harmony 880, in fact I have 2 of them controlling the 622, one in the bedroom with an IR extender. I changed the menu button to be the DVR button, and put the Menu button as one of the custom buttons on LCD screen.

The only thing I have to do is press the SELECT button when the 622 sleeps, other than that it's been seamless. I set it up as a ViP-622 and it worked fine.

I have Swap, PiP, and PiP Move all in the custom buttons.
 
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Finally, I am wondering why so many people here say this device is simple to set up and does everything they want with their 622. Are there multiple 622 command sets in the Logitech database? Am I just unlucky to have stumbled on a non-optimal list? If so, how can I access a better list? And if there are multiple command sets, what did I do wrong to wind up with such a poor set?
It's been a little while but I seem to remember that there were codeset listings under "Echostar" and "Dish" and under those there were several variations like "ViP622" and "622" and other ones too. I think I picked one of the ones under "Echostar" and it's worked great for me.
 
If you are finding yourself having to go into device mode to control something frequently, then you should assign that command to a soft button (next to the led screen on the remote). You have several pages of soft buttons available for each activity.

If, for example, you assigned DVR, Swap, and Live TV to soft buttons within the Watch TV activity, then you'd see those on the screen when you were watching TV. No need to go into device mode.

If you then wanted to switch to watching a DVD, you press the Activities button to put the activities back on the LCD screen and then press the Watch DVD button. Inside that activity you can have soft buttons programmed specifically for things you do when watching a DVD.

Again... you should not need to go into device mode once you have theh 880 programmed for teh way you use your equipment.
 
The only thing I have to do is press the SELECT button when the 622 sleeps, other than that it's been seamless. I set it up as a ViP-622 and it worked fine.

Sounds like in setup you selected to leave the 622 on. Set it to power off, then you won't have to wake it up.
 
In the Activities for "watch TV", you can add a command for "select" to be sent after all the other commands are sent.
 
Every once in a while there is a post like this one from the OP where someone has a hell of a time with these Harmony remotes. I just don't get it. I have three of them and have never had any trouble. These things could not be easier to set up!

The commands for Dish receivers are ALL in the profiles. I have used 942 and VIP622 profiles. I currently have two 622s and a 722 all being controlled by Harmony remotes, a 659, 880 and Harmony One. The commands mentioned by the op are in there. You sometimes have to search a bit, some of the names assigned might not be what you expect. For example, I have seen the LiveTV command listed as "View" but it is there. Also the op was looking for a swap command, try Channelprev, I believe that is the one.

As was stated above you need to assign the soft keys or even hard keys for that matter to the activity you want to use them in, no need to go to specific devices at all! I even have the Harmony controlling my PS3, had to purchase the Nyco infrared remote and teach the harmony the commands but it works!

Anyway, to the op, you are making this harder than it needs to be. Harmony remotes will control your Dish receivers with ease. You should just use the profile for Dishnetwork VIP622 and it will be fine.
 
Every once in a while there is a post like this one from the OP where someone has a hell of a time with these Harmony remotes. I just don't get it. I have three of them and have never had any trouble. These things could not be easier to set up!

Well, when I set up my 722, I did not have the DVR command as well as a couple of others. Had to call support, who restored them.
 
Every once in a while there is a post like this one from the OP where someone has a hell of a time with these Harmony remotes. I just don't get it. I have three of them and have never had any trouble. These things could not be easier to set up!

People aren't used to activities-based remotes. And to be honest, in Logitech's database there were several choices when it came time to tell the Harmony software which satellite receiver I had. AND I chose one that apparently didn't have all of the commands in it the first time I tried setting mine up.

So I wouldn't be too harsh on the OP. Every universal remote I ever used was device-based until I got my first Harmony and it took a little getting used to. My family would kill me if we ever had to go back to a device-based remote.

Humans are activities-based. Not device-based. But we all get "trained" to be device-based when we pick up a universal remote. :)
 
Not being "harsh" to anyone! I just don't get how much difficulty some have had with setting up these remotes. The commands to run Dish boxes have always been there for me although some of the names might not be what you would expect which I pointed out to the op.
 
People aren't used to activities-based remotes. And to be honest, in Logitech's database there were several choices when it came time to tell the Harmony software which satellite receiver I had. AND I chose one that apparently didn't have all of the commands in it the first time I tried setting mine up.

So I wouldn't be too harsh on the OP. Every universal remote I ever used was device-based until I got my first Harmony and it took a little getting used to. My family would kill me if we ever had to go back to a device-based remote.

Humans are activities-based. Not device-based. But we all get "trained" to be device-based when we pick up a universal remote. :)

I understand the difference between activity-based and device-based. The fact that the Harmony is activity-based is what attracted me to it in the first place. My complaints are the following:

  1. In setting up "Watch TV" I specified that I had a dish Network VIP622. The commands which got sent to my remote had absolutely no effect on the 622. I had to call customer support to get that problem fixed. People who got valid commands on their first try are lucky, or I am unlucky. I don't know.
  2. I only went into "Device" mode because that is where I found the DVR command, set up by default as a soft button. Now that I have set a hard button to be "DVR" I never go to device mode. I am still amazed that Logitech left two hard buttons undefined for the 622, and none of "DVR", "Swap", and "View Live TV" were assigned a hard button by default.
  3. I couldn't find "View Live TV" in the command list when I tried to set up a hard button. Last night I decided to try the command which is called (on the web site) just plain "View". Not a very informative name, but at least it works. That is in fact the "View Live TV" command.
  4. I still cannot find the Swap command in the list. Based on an earlier post in this thread, tonight I will try the command I see called "PiP Swap". I hope it works, because if it doesn't I am going to have to go back to customer support. But if it does work, then I have to ask Logitech why they gave the command such a confusing name. What does the "Swap" function on the 622 have to do with Picture-in-Picture?
 
Pip swap would be to swap picture in picture screens. If you want to jump back and forth between channels, not using pip then this is NOT the command you want. Look for something like ChannelPrev, i.e channel previous.
 
[*]I still cannot find the Swap command in the list. Based on an earlier post in this thread, tonight I will try the command I see called "PiP Swap". I hope it works, because if it doesn't I am going to have to go back to customer support. But if it does work, then I have to ask Logitech why they gave the command such a confusing name. What does the "Swap" function on the 622 have to do with Picture-in-Picture?
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I have a soft button that I have named 'Swap' and fingered it to 'PipSwap', it does a swap just fine...
 
I have a soft button that I have named 'Swap' and fingered it to 'PipSwap', it does a swap just fine...

He is, I think, talking about switching back and forth between channels not using picture in picture. PipSwap trades the pip image(channel) with the main channel you are watching.

Edit: Experimented a bit and PipSwap will get the same result if in single mode. It is propably just switching between the two tuners. If you are in dual mode it will not work as you have no Pip function. The command I mentioned before, ChannelPrev, would be better to use as it just recalls the last channel viewed.
 
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I understand the difference between activity-based and device-based. The fact that the Harmony is activity-based is what attracted me to it in the first place. My complaints are the following:

  1. In setting up "Watch TV" I specified that I had a dish Network VIP622. The commands which got sent to my remote had absolutely no effect on the 622. I had to call customer support to get that problem fixed. People who got valid commands on their first try are lucky, or I am unlucky. I don't know.
  2. I only went into "Device" mode because that is where I found the DVR command, set up by default as a soft button. Now that I have set a hard button to be "DVR" I never go to device mode. I am still amazed that Logitech left two hard buttons undefined for the 622, and none of "DVR", "Swap", and "View Live TV" were assigned a hard button by default.
  3. I couldn't find "View Live TV" in the command list when I tried to set up a hard button. Last night I decided to try the command which is called (on the web site) just plain "View". Not a very informative name, but at least it works. That is in fact the "View Live TV" command.
  4. I still cannot find the Swap command in the list. Based on an earlier post in this thread, tonight I will try the command I see called "PiP Swap". I hope it works, because if it doesn't I am going to have to go back to customer support. But if it does work, then I have to ask Logitech why they gave the command such a confusing name. What does the "Swap" function on the 622 have to do with Picture-in-Picture?

Try setting up the DVR as a 722.
 
He is, I think, talking about switching back and forth between channels not using picture in picture. PipSwap trades the pip image(channel) with the main channel you are watching.

Edit: Experimented a bit and PipSwap will get the same result if in single mode. It is propably just switching between the two tuners. If you are in dual mode it will not work as you have no Pip function. The command I mentioned before, ChannelPrev, would be better to use as it just recalls the last channel viewed.
The 880 already has a PREV button, there's no need to program one...
 
Actually, I knew about and used the "Prev" hard button all along when I wanted to go back to a previous channel on the same tuner. The Swap function is very different. It switches which of the two satellite tuners is sent out to the TV. Using Swap, you can switch back and forth between two channels quickly (there is no retuning time). And both tuners' buffers are left undisturbed by "Swap". So, for example, if I am watching two football games at the same time, when one hits a break I Swap to the other, and can then backtrack to see what i missed. When I have caught up there, I Swap back to the first game and do the same thing. "Swap" takes full advantage of the two tuners. The "Prev" button on the Harmony, which sends the 622 "Recall" command, which the Harmony web site calls ChanPrev or something like that, actually retunes the current tuner to its last-used channel, resetting the buffer so you cannot backtrack. For my usual TV watching style, "Swap" is by far the preferable command. I almost never have a need to use "Recall" ("Prev" on the Harmony).

At any rate, last night I tried the "PiPSwap" command. As a previous poster in this thread said, that is indeed my long-lost "Swap" command. Hallejuhah! Why on earth does Logitech refer to it as PiPSwap? It bears no relation that I am aware of to "Picture-in-Picture".

Thanks everyone for taking the time to help me. The Harmony 880 is now finally configured the way I want it.
 
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