HD Signals

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gcrew

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Sep 13, 2005
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HD Signal Problems

Hello all,

I have had an HR10-250 dvr for almost a year now. I have always been able to recive HD channels since Dtv originally installed, although some channels, like UHD channel, sometimes don't come in at all, or are very pixelated. However, in the last week, I can't receive any of the HD channels. They show up in the guide, but when you switch to them, nothing shows up at all, just a black screen. The best I get is ESPN HD, which shows up, but is unwatchable, as it extremely pixelated and fades in and out. Here is my setup:

The oval HD dish with built in multiswitch, with all four lines run, but only two of them are actually hooked up, both of them running into the HR10-250 DVR. Here is what I have done so far:

tested signal strength on all sats for all transponders with the following results:

Sat. 101 : Transponders 1-32, Strong signal strength (85 and above) on all transponders, both line 1 and 2.

Sat. 119:
Transponder:
22 - 0
23 - 52
24 - 0
25 - 65
26 - 0
27 - 36
28 - 0
29 - 73
30 - 0
31 - 0
32- 0

With the exception of transponder 31, all the even transponders have no signal strength.

Sat: 110
Transponder
8 - 38
10 - 37
12 - 37

I re-ran sat setup, and when the check for the satellaite signal finished, the results were as follows:

Line 1

101 (A) ok
119 (B) right side not detected
101 (c) ok

Line 2

101 (A) ok
119 (B) right side not detected
110 (C) ok

I also don't know if this makes any difference, but about a week before I lost all my HD's, I noticed that some of my normal channels were exhibiting "ghosting", which I have never had on Dtv. It almost looked like they were being pulled in by a regular tv antenna, the quality was that bad. Short of climbing up onto the roof to see if my dish has somehow moved, which looking at it from the ground it looks ok, is there anything else I can try before I call Dtv? Any help would be welcome. Thanks!
 
This could be a failing lnb or ms or the coax could have bad connectors or a cut somewhere, or a line of sight issue (trees?) maybe just need to be repeaked, those signal levels on 119/110 are horrible, 101 isn't horrible, but the 101 xponders should have 94-100s and the 119/110 should be 95-100s (maybe one 85)).

If all that mentioned above is ok, then it could be the receiver.
 
I guess the next step will be to double check the cabling, and then climb up to the roof and try to determine if the dish is aligned correctly. The signal levels on the 119/110 have always been that way, so maybe the installer never mounted the dish in its optimal position to pull in the best signal strength. Thanks for the advice!
 
No problem, good luck.

If it looks like it is a peak issue (and if those signals always have been that bad that it most likely _is_ a peak issue), it could likely be the skew (skew is the 'twist' of the dish, as opposed to up/down and left/right) thats keeping the dish from being peaked even if the right/left up/down is right on, if it's off skew it won't do. It could also be the plmb of the pole/mount isn't right on, exact plumb is the most important.
 
I'll specifically look for that, according to Dtv the correct settings for my dish are:

Azimuth 245 (skew)
Elevation 28
Tilt 55

I think I need a compass for the first one, but the other two are on the dish itself.
 
Remember, those numbers aren't exact, it's only meant as a rough guide, you must use a meter to get a good peak, if you do not have a stand-alone meter, you can use the receivers built-in meters, just remember, the receivers signal lock has a 4-8 second lag, so when you make an adjustment, wait that long before moving it to the next point in the sky.

Here is a link to a pdf containing the offical 3lnb install guide, it goes over alignment as well.

http://www.directv.com/learn/pdf/12429_00_AntennaManual_1D.pdf

NOTE: By the way Tilt is Skew, Azimuth is left-right, Elevation is up-down.
 
gcrew,

Before you move the dish, look out and see if there might be trees or something that has grown in the way since the dish was installed.
Shoert of that, I would have to agree that it lookas like a mis-aligned dish.
You could do it yourself or call D* back out and tell them to DO IT RIGHT !

Let them know that it has never been right and you are missing channels,maybe they will credit you something.....

Jimbo
 
Thanks for all the help, everyone! I went onto the roof this morning, and although I did not have a level with me to make sure the mast was even, I was able to check the elevation and tilt. I realize without an even mast, the settings for elevation and tilt will be off, but this is what happened. The elevation was fine, but the tilt of the dish was set at 30 degrees, which was incorrect, it should have been at 55 degress. When I made the adjustment, I noticed a HUGE improvement.

101 Sat: Signal strength went from mid 80's to mid 90's and higher

119 Sat: Signal strength went from 0 on the even transponders to high 90's on ALL transponders.

110 Sat: Signal strength went from mid 30's to mid 70's on all three transponders.

Re-ran setup on the receiver, what a difference. I have all my high def channels back!! If I had a compass, a level, and a sat finder, I think I could fine tune the dish even more. I have been looking online and found some stuff like this:

[Sorry, tried to post a link to merchantamerica, but wouldn't let me because I do not have enough posts on this forum]

If anyone has any experience with good installation equipment, please let me know. Everyone has been EXTREMELY helpful to this newbie, and I am very grateful. Thanks!!
 
gcrew said:
If anyone has any experience with good installation equipment, please let me know. Everyone has been EXTREMELY helpful to this newbie, and I am very grateful. Thanks!!

Glad you got it working.

All I ever use is a:
Heading Compass
Ladder
Screwdriver
Ratchet or wrench
Level
Drill (only if new holes are needed)

Too many people try to make it seem harder than necessary for newbies by having you think you need to waste your hard-earned money on a bunch of gadgets. You can already see how easy it really is by what you already accomplished with minimal tools and know how; GREAT JOB!
 
Good work gcrew, charper1 has a point regarding the tools (the proof is, you peaked the dish better than a so-called installer, it's not the tools alone, it's the persons amount of care/knowledge using those tools), but it _is_ nice to have a signal meter if you plan to do your own peaking, they aren't very expensive (unless you want all the bells and whistles), I've seen them for 17-20 bucks for meter alone and the kits for 30-35 bucks, beats trying to see the signal levels on your tv from on-top the roof ;)

A meter I have heard recommended for those who don't need/want to pay for extra bells and whistles is:
http://www.sadoun.com/Sat/Products/Accessories/Meters/SF-95-DSS-FTA-Satellite-Signal-meter.htm (for the meter only)

and:

http://www.sadoun.com/Sat/Products/Accessories/Meters/SF-95-kit-DSS-Satellite-Signal-meter.htm (for that same meter above in a kit form (cables, compass, etc)).

Another one, a step up in price and features ($119+sh), that has dual inputs (to track 2 sats at once):
http://www.sadoun.com/Sat/Products/JVI/Acutrac22Pro-Dual-Input-Satellite-signal-meter.htm

I think your Tilt could be tweaked a bit (unless you are satisfied with what you have), if you decide to mess with it more, try that adjustment first (usually it's recommended to leave this alone, but I suspect your Tilt was already 'broken' at install) also, make sure to mark it where you have it now, so you can always go back if you can't get it any better, remember Tilt is Skew(twist), Azimuth is left-right(along horizon), Elevation is up and down(from ground to top of sky).

Good luck and enjoy.
 
damaged said:
Good work gcrew, charper1 has a point regarding the tools (the proof is, you peaked the dish better than a so-called installer, it's not the tools alone, it's the persons amount of care/knowledge using those tools), but it _is_ nice to have a signal meter if you plan to do your own peaking, they aren't very expensive (unless you want all the bells and whistles), I've seen them for 17-20 bucks for meter alone and the kits for 30-35 bucks, beats trying to see the signal levels on your tv from on-top the roof ;)

A meter I have heard recommended for those who don't need/want to pay for extra bells and whistles is:
http://www.sadoun.com/Sat/Products/Accessories/Meters/SF-95-DSS-FTA-Satellite-Signal-meter.htm (for the meter only)

and:

http://www.sadoun.com/Sat/Products/Accessories/Meters/SF-95-kit-DSS-Satellite-Signal-meter.htm (for that same meter above in a kit form (cables, compass, etc)).

Another one, a step up in price and features ($119+sh), that has dual inputs (to track 2 sats at once):
http://www.sadoun.com/Sat/Products/JVI/Acutrac22Pro-Dual-Input-Satellite-signal-meter.htm

I think your Tilt could be tweaked a bit (unless you are satisfied with what you have), if you decide to mess with it more, try that adjustment first (usually it's recommended to leave this alone, but I suspect your Tilt was already 'broken' at install) also, make sure to mark it where you have it now, so you can always go back if you can't get it any better, remember Tilt is Skew(twist), Azimuth is left-right(along horizon), Elevation is up and down(from ground to top of sky).

Good luck and enjoy.

The problem with these cheapie signal finders is that they cannot distinguish which satellite you are looking at. They would also get confused by the triple LNB. Peaking with the receiver works great. You just need a set of walkie talkies and a patient spouse or friend.
 
billbillw said:
The problem with these cheapie signal finders is that they cannot distinguish which satellite you are looking at AND they won't work with the trible LNB dish. Peaking with the receiver works great. You just need a set of walkie talkies and a patient spouse or friend.

I agree, do not take my post as trying to get you to buy more crap (I prefer to have a professional peak my dish, but that's just me), I just provided information on what to look for if you saw fit to purchase a meter, obviously the cheap ones won't have the ability to track all 3 sats and distinguish from D* from E* sats, which is what I meant by the meters listed as having 'no bells and whistles'. And I am sure the original poster would not want to spend the 200-500 bucks on a meter that 'rocks the sky'. ;)

Walkie talkies (if you have none) will cost you about the same as the cheap meter (plus beer if you get a friend to help ;)), and with a meter you don't have to deal with 'human error/issues' (i.e. you don't have to deal with your moron/deaf friend or wife who's sick of you obsessing over your TV when you should be making her more money to spend and you having the nerve to have her standing in front of a TV yeling out numbers....oh sorry, you get the point :)
 
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