Hoping my DirecTV guy is wrong. Says we can't get HD...

[drew68]

Hey guys. We have a 55in. Samsung LCD; however we have non-HD DirecTV programming. It's a total waste of a great TV.

The issue:
We live in the woods and are surrounded by trees. We can barely clear the trees to get a standard satellite signal. Apparently the HD satellite is slightly lower in the sky or is less accessible from our location (northwest NJ).

We really want to stick with DirecTV. We have it at another location. Our driveway is about 1200ft long. We can get a signal from there. Is that an option?

How much of a production/expense would that be? Is it even worth considering putting a dish that far from the house?

Is there anything else you guys know of that I don't. Can we use two dishes to scrape together a viable signal? Divine intervention?

Looking forward to what kind of knowledge you can lay on me.

Thanks.

Drew

 

[rocket69]

Kiss that LOS problem good bye! untill the trees grow taller. The distance for your drive way would cost a lot and to find the right people to do it right is going to be tuff. Your best bet is to find a location on your property that it wont be an issue like the peek of your roof or chimne or just line up the birds with dishpointer and top those trees. To split the satellite on 3 dishes is going to cost some coin and also requires the corect tech to do it. Dont think the normal direct guy would even think it could be done.

your curent location could be fine as the sats are 2deg apart on each side of 101 and on 101 you shuld have hi signal but without some pictures i cant tell. if you can take a pic infront of dish and one directly behind it and one more directly under the dish falowing the same angle and path of the arm that is holding the lnb

 

[drew68]

I wish we could clear the trees from the roof. We're surrounded by beastly oaks and other hardwoods. We've been told we'd have to ax some trees to get a LOS.

What's the lingo about the birds. I don't speak the language. Maybe I'll build an observation tower on my roof. Any other thoughts.

 

[kjlued]

Yes, the ka/ku slimline 3 hits 3 satelites.
The one you are currently hitting and to more.
One cones in slightly higher and the other slightly lower.

You could just cut trees.

If that is not an option, then no the normal direct tv guy no matter if he thinks it can be done or not, just won't do it.
Not worth the time or pay plus we just don't have the equipment to set towers up properly.

BTW, peaks of roof usually get you nothing.
Sure, you get the dish higher but you also usually move it closer when doing it.

As suggested, the easiest way you can locate a location for yourself would be to get the dishpointer software if you have a smart phone capable of using it.
Paying $20 could save you $100's of dollars.

 

[kjlued]

BTW, seeing this is upgrade and possibly a difficult one, expect to get blown off even if it could be done.

Techs get paid by the job and upgrades don't pay worth a damn.
There is a good chance a tech is looking at more money in materials then the job pays.

I would suggest if another tech comes by, offer him $50-$100 to make it work (depending on the difficulty level).
If the tech says he can't after being offered $100 then he can't.

Might I suggest though that if it is that close to wait til the leaves come in.

 

[jdspencer]

Any chance you could put the dish as far away from the trees to be able to see above them?
In other words, at the north east of the property pointing southwest.
Any possibility of putting the dish on the other side of the trees?
As mentioned, use dishpointer.com to see where it might be possible.
The view given on that site allows you to move the dish location to scope various possibilities.

 

[spaceghost]

Its really difficult to say how it can be done w/out being on the property. As others have said, the avg tech will not get this done. You really need someone who knows what they are doing and you will need to pay them. Running 1200' of cable is going to be expensive and it will cause you problems later...problems that the avg tech won't be able to trouble shoot. Then you'll have to pay someone top dollar to troubleshoot the problem.

You best bet sounds like topping off some trees, as it seems you are almost there as is. This way, your "average" tech can get the job done and service it later if need be.

You could build some type of tower on your roof, but as the previous poster pointed out, the roof might be a less favorable spot. An unorthodox suggestion might be to build a solid mounting post up in one of your trees. I know I will get shot for that suggestion

No matter what, you need to find someone who knows what they are doing. Otherwise, you could be spending quite a bit of money for something that won't work.

 

[kjlued]

Running 1200' of cable is going to be expensive and it will cause you problems later...problems that the avg tech won't be able to trouble shoot. Then you'll have to pay someone top dollar to troubleshoot the problem.

Not to mention even if they could trouble shoot it, they usually still won't touch it as it will take too long for $25 +/- trouble call and then the problem becomes theirs usually resulting in a back charge.

You could build some type of tower on your roof,

Again, don't expect a tech to ever come out and touch it if you do as most techs do not have the equipment to reach a tower on top of a roof.

 

[drew68]

hmmm

Just to set the scene: we don't have a few trees. We have a forest. Behind one tree is sixty more trees, and so on. The spot for our house is carved out of the forest. Kind of atypical for NJ, but that's what's we've got.

We're not looking to mow down the forest for an HD picture, but I'm not going to chain myself to a few trees to save them. You have to burn something in the wood stove/fireplace.

To summarize: tree removal will not be a small job, we're talking multiple 100ft oaks/maples. But from what I'm hearing it sounds like it's cut trees or we're out of luck.

A side note: our dish is currently mounted about 35ft up a giant red oak. We could go higher but have been warned that if we go too high the swaying in the wind could thwart our efforts.

Maybe we just need to have some logging done. Anyone want oak/birch floors in their man cave?

 

[jdspencer]

Check with some carpentry shops and see if they will take a few trees as a trade for the wood. Birch and oak can be valuable for a wood worker.

 

[Jimbo]

Is your Current set up 1200 ft away, or your best option for LOS ?
If your current location isn't very far away, I would go ahead and swap out the dish in the same location your at now ... as mentioned, if you have a good spot currently, making the change to HD would not be an issue, just equipment.

Now, if your current location is over 200-300 feet, then I would say it could be done with potential distance issues in the future.
1200 ft is WAY to far, I doubt anyone would even try.

 

[raoul5788]

First of all Drew, to Satelliteguys!

The satellites for hd flank the one for sd, so if you can get sd, you can get hd with a little work. The satellite to the east is slightly lower than the one to the west, but not much. You need to raise the existing mounting point maybe 10-20 feet. Can you give us a schematic of the area? That would be helpful in determining where the dish can go. Also, you should check Satellite Finder / Dish Pointing Calculator with Google Maps | DishPointer.com to see for yourself what options you may have. Good luck!

 

[kjlued]

A side note: our dish is currently mounted about 35ft up a giant red oak. We could go higher but have been warned that if we go too high the swaying in the wind could thwart our efforts.

Although a standard Ku dish will work fine for years attached on a giant red oak, I Ka/Ku will not (especially the higher you go).
A Ku (standard dish) can move about 5 degrees and still get decent signal where the Ka signal is much narrower and a Ka/Ku (hd dish) can only move about 1 degree before you lose your HD.

Basically trees are constantly growing and twisting, bending, swaying, being drawn by the sun, etc.
You will have constant problems with your HD making it not even remotely worth the efforts even if you could mount it at the base of the tree.

Further more, if it ever needed to be serviced, you will have a hard time ever finding a tech that will service it as their name goes on it.
Also, most of them don't carry a 35 foot ladder and only have a 40 ft available to them.

Seeing as you are already 35 feet up a tree, and your HD dish will need to be on a pole 5 ft off the gound bringing you 30 feet lower, I would suggest being happy with SD.

 

[Jimbo]

Although a standard Ku dish will work fine for years attached on a giant red oak, I Ka/Ku will not (especially the higher you go).
A Ku (standard dish) can move about 5 degrees and still get decent signal where the Ka signal is much narrower and a Ka/Ku (hd dish) can only move about 1 degree before you lose your HD.

Basically trees are constantly growing and twisting, bending, swaying, being drawn by the sun, etc.
You will have constant problems with your HD making it not even remotely worth the efforts even if you could mount it at the base of the tree. Your SO pessimistic, the tree growing will eventually cause problems, in about 5 years maybe, IF the sub decides to go ahead with it, I would think he'll get PLENTY of time to view his HD before having to position it elsewhere....

Further more, if it ever needed to be serviced, you will have a hard time ever finding a tech that will service it as their name goes on it.
Also, most of them don't carry a 35 foot ladder and only have a 40 ft available to them.

You are correct about the ladders though.

Seeing as you are already 35 feet up a tree, and your HD dish will need to be on a pole 5 ft off the gound bringing you 30 feet lower, I would suggest being happy with SD.

Your BEST option would be to find a place on the ground if possible, of course we know thats knot happening..

 

[kjlued]

I seriously doubt he will get one year with a ka/ku in a tree.
I wouldn't be surprised if it needed to be retuned every time the seasons changed.
I can't really say for sure however, there is a lot more movement in a tree then it just growing up.

Also, as the tree swayed (as the OP was advised not to go any higher for this reason with the standard dish) it would be loosing signal constantly.

It isn't pessimistic, it is just realistic.
I would really hate to see the OP get in to a situation that will not only be expensive but highly troublesome just for hd especially considering no tech will touch if it is in a tree (well, maybe one will on the side)

It would be one thing if he could service it himself, and maybe he could learn but currently that does not seem to be the case.

Yes, his best option would be the pole which we know won't happen since it will be 30 feet lower then his Ku dish and if anything, we need to go higher.

Of course, there is one other option

Erecting An Antenna Tower

Costly, but if you want HD really badly, it is an option.
Again though, do not expect your average tech to install it or ever service it, but it will less likely need servicing if properly installed.

 

[rocket69]

I have done tree mount in an oak tree for the customers pimped out tree house using tree mount for slimline. Itsr so good for 3 years now last time just peeked it to get 5 more points. And no not a damn part of my install or service calls are free for custom jobs just the free boxes for a new account

 

[JustNCase]

Cut trees man. No tech is going to go through all that just for upgrade money. Not even an lead tech. Honestly 1200ft of cable is nothing but a bunch of problems and money. I do areas like yours everyday. But I've only never got a signal 2 times in 2 years. There is a spot just got to spend alittle more time an find it. An be creative if you like.

 

[drew68]

Thanks for the feedback. I'll have to take a look for myself. Maybe there's a LOS somewhere. It would have to be from a tree. The ground is definitely not going to work.

An aside: Our trees are about as stable as they get, they're monsters. Some are upwards of 12ft in circumference. And of those some are sparse up top due to age.

One more thing. I checked the tree we're on now. It's more like 20ft off the ground, I overestimated.

And finally, is dishpointer pro the only worthwhile software for android? There is a $5 satellite LOS app with a decent rating: Satellite Finder. Is it worth the $20 for dishpointer?

 

[drew68]

Is your Current set up 1200 ft away, or your best option for LOS ?
If your current location isn't very far away, I would go ahead and swap out the dish in the same location your at now ... as mentioned, if you have a good spot currently, making the change to HD would not be an issue, just equipment.

Now, if your current location is over 200-300 feet, then I would say it could be done with potential distance issues in the future.
1200 ft is WAY to far, I doubt anyone would even try.

Jimbo, our current set up is about 20ft from the house. However the nature of our LOS precludes this spot from working with HD. There is a small dent in the tree line from our driveway. The dish to the west(?) is a few degrees outside of that dent. I think I need dishpointer to see how close we are.

 

[Jimbo]

Jimbo, our current set up is about 20ft from the house. However the nature of our LOS precludes this spot from working with HD. There is a small dent in the tree line from our driveway. The dish to the west(?) is a few degrees outside of that dent. I think I need dishpointer to see how close we are.

Dishpointer is a good app, I'm trying to get mine back as I type, had a phone die and now trying to find the correct way to get it back.
It's rather expensive for only one use, but on the other hand, if it keeps you from having to cut trees down that don't need it, your money was well spent.

I did a very similar install at a friends house, we built the home in a forest, cut down 35 trees to put the home in there ....
What we were able to do is to run the dish out to the property line, the neighbors don't have the trees on thier property, so at the edge of his property the LOS was great !
I would guess he's about 150-200 ft from dish to recvr.