HSP Pay (per install vs. per hour)

[uboatcmdr]

I work for an HSP. They are about to switch from per install pay to per hour pay. Currently we get $60 for basic single outlet install or mover's connect, $25 each additional outlet, $40 per upgrade and $25 per service call. We do not collect extra for pole mounts, phone lines or wire burial. We do charge $30 extra for each wall fish. The tech get $25 of that $30. The company presently provides the techs with all the IRD's, dishes, poles, wire & small parts needed to complete the job. The techs provide a truck or van, commercial auto insurance, tools, ladders, gas, cell phones and fax machines (to get our work orders daily).
Very soon the company is going to change over to hourly pay and provide the techs with vehicles, auto insurance and gas. What else they are or are not going to provide is unclear at this point as an official meeting on the subject has yet to be held.

Here is my question, has anyone been through a similar change? If so, what was the greatest impact it had on you? Did many of the techs quit and go elsewhere (with E*, cable or become a sub for a retailer)? Or did they stick around to see if they could survive on the new pay rate? Did the change have any impact on the quality of work being done by the techs? In addition was there a difference in the quality of work done by those techs who stayed as opposed to the quality of the by those who were hired after the change?
Now on the flip side, has anyone gone through a reverse of this, changed from per hour pay to per install pay? If so what changes did the company make? And which method do you prefer (hourly or per install)?
I appreciate any input any of you might have on this. I just need to hear from those who have been through such a change so I can get a feel for how things are going to be and that way I can decide now if I want to stick with this company or find another place to work.

 

[tjlandberg]

I went the reverse route. We went form per hour to per job. Most of the techs quit on the spot. We drive so much no one thought it would be worth it. For the techs that stayed on most of them seem to be making more or atleast the same as before. Only problems are if we drive 100 miles to do a job and the customer cancels then we dont paid and the drive was for nothing. In that case most of the gas can get paid back.

My advice is to try it out for awhile and see if it works for you.

 

[uboatcmdr]

I went the reverse route. We went form per hour to per job. Most of the techs quit on the spot. We drive so much no one thought it would be worth it. For the techs that stayed on most of them seem to be making more or atleast the same as before. Only problems are if we drive 100 miles to do a job and the customer cancels then we dont paid and the drive was for nothing. In that case most of the gas can get paid back.

My advice is to try it out for awhile and see if it works for you.

Well the problem for me is last year I made over $50,000 being paid per install. The max I can make being paid per hour (if I get a training tech's job) is about $30,000 per year. If I don't get the trainer's job and just stay on as a normal tech I will only make a max of about $25,000. Yeah it costs me to use my own vehicle, gas, cell phone, tools and fax machine. But at this time I'm not sure how much of that I will still be required to supply. As it is my vehicle expense doesn't add up to the $20,000 - $30,000 per year that my current average yearly pay would decrease. Oh it might add up close to that if you include my truck payments in the calculation, but those payments won't go away just because the company gives me a truck to drive (unless I turn my truck in to the finance company).
I can imagine a large number of our techs are going to walk, just not sure yet whether or not I will be in that group. Trying to weigh the both sides of it before making a decision.

 

[tjlandberg]

That is a big drop in money.

I really don't see anyone making $50,000 on an hourly wage of $10-$12 unless you work alot of overtime.

 

[uboatcmdr]

That is a big drop in money.

I really don't see anyone making $50,000 on an hourly wage of $10-$12 unless you work alot of overtime.

The worst week I had last year I made $295 (only worked like two days that week) and the best week was around $1900. The average weekly rate for the year was about $1100. So far this year I haven't hit that average, but the first 4 months of last year was pretty slow also.
I'm trying to keep an open mind to these changes, but by my calculations they can't come anywhere close with their hourly rates to what my pay has been over the past couple of years. It is also my understanding that they are not going to allow overtime.
I currently only put in 20-30 hours a week to do my assigned jobs. When we go to company owned vehicles I am sure they will expect the techs to work a full 8 hours a day (they don't want those trucks sitting idle, they want them out there making them money). So with the increased hours come an increased number of jobs and if you add all those jobs up at the old rate I will be losing even more money under this new plan. The new plan beats being unemployed, getting paid something beats nothing, but if that something won't pay your bills it ain't worth nothing.

 

[telecaster]

You are probably gonna loose lots of money.NO WAY is 10 bucks an hour gonna compare to 60/25 for an install.
A 3 room job is gonna go from $105 to about $25.
I would be lookin for some sub work if i was in your shoes.

 

[dalos2004]

what HSP do you work for????If you can say...

 

[uboatcmdr]

what HSP do you work for????If you can say...

Prefer not to say at this point.

 

[VOOMER]

Contractor >>> Employee

You are probably gonna loose lots of money.NO WAY is 10 bucks an hour gonna compare to 60/25 for an install.
A 3 room job is gonna go from $105 to about $25.
I would be lookin for some sub work if i was in your shoes.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------
Really there will be no comparison to the piece rate by going hourly.

You will be just a number with a job to do for your Company.
All the fun and the actual thrill of your past work will become an every day grind just like so many other average americans.
We are all facing some major changes in the Industry and it does not favor the Installer side in any way. Everything is changing for the benefit of others.
The HSP,MSP or whoever the next **P title they come up with.
It is sad to say that many have already moved on to other lines of work due to all the changes and many more will follow.
There is no way to compete against those now in control of the (master plan so to speak). What was once a Very enjoyable and rewarding means of making a living and providing for their own for so many is fading away.

 

[DTVSatman]

HSPs are wrestling with the hourly vs. per-job thing. Per-job promotes slammed jobs and shoddy work from a lot of techs who have no pride in their work. Hourly has to be balanced with a quota which, in turn, promotes slammed jobs, etc.
The HSPs are trying to find a way to get good installs/service at a minimum of expense and neither route works very well.
IMHO, DirecTV is tired of the poor customer service from the bad techs out there and is pressuring the HSPs to do something about it. Blame the bad techs who are skating along and drawing fat paychecks - like the one I followed up on this AM who had taped the connectors onto the coax! Must have left his compression tool at the last job and couldn't find the time to go back and get it.
I can see a time when there are no independants or HSPs - all the techs will be DirecTV employees. The hacks out there need to find another line of work.
I am not implying that anyone on this thread is a hack, but if you know any, thank them for ruining a decent way to make an honest living.

 

[haotinc]

Let's also thank DirecTV for cutting what they pay and pushing all the good techs out. Don't kid yourselves, this is part of the master plan of DirecTV. They screwed us over pretty hard.

I switched to Dish and will not go back. They pay quick, they pay well, and they appriciate there dealers. DirecTV can kiss my a**.

 

[haotinc]

Everyone needs a birddog. 800-525-1668.

 

[uboatcmdr]

HSPs are wrestling with the hourly vs. per-job thing. Per-job promotes slammed jobs and shoddy work from a lot of techs who have no pride in their work. Hourly has to be balanced with a quota which, in turn, promotes slammed jobs, etc.
The HSPs are trying to find a way to get good installs/service at a minimum of expense and neither route works very well.
IMHO, DirecTV is tired of the poor customer service from the bad techs out there and is pressuring the HSPs to do something about it. Blame the bad techs who are skating along and drawing fat paychecks - like the one I followed up on this AM who had taped the connectors onto the coax! Must have left his compression tool at the last job and couldn't find the time to go back and get it.
I can see a time when there are no independants or HSPs - all the techs will be DirecTV employees. The hacks out there need to find another line of work.
I am not implying that anyone on this thread is a hack, but if you know any, thank them for ruining a decent way to make an honest living.

I know exactly what you mean. Our company has had it's share of hacks. As for me I try and take pride in what I do. I will bust my butt to make a customer happy. I can't tell you how many free wall fishes I do for customers just to see the joy in their faces that someone is actually doing the job right. For me it is not just a paycheck. Don't get me wrong I enjoy the money, but I also enjoy pleasing the customer as well. All too many techs have that screw the customer attitude and that is wrong. If it weren't for those customers we wouldn't have jobs.
But the thing is I can see room for more shoddy work under the per hour pay plan as opposed to the per install one. Under the per install plan if a job takes me 4 hours to do correctly then that is how long I spend doing it. Under the new plan I will have a heavier workload and only 8 hours in which to work, I cannot devote 4 of those hours to just one job. There is no way that I am going to work past my scheduled 8 hours without compensation.
If the company expects to get the same level of dedication and hard work from the employees for $10-$12 per hour that they got paying them $600-$1200 per week they are sadly mistaken. What they fail to remember that it is those hard working techs that got them to where THEY are. I hope they realize that once they implement their plan that the quality of the work in my estimation, will go way down. Many of the employees will find new jobs elsewhere. And with reduced performance from the employees it will not look too good to D*. It might even entice D* to replace this company as the HSP or even come out with their own installation department.
Like I said previously, I am trying to keep an open mind to the upcoming changes, but so far the only benefits I can see to the plan are in favor of the company's wallet.

 

[uboatcmdr]

Update: We had our tech meeting today and they told us about the change from per install using our trucks to per hour using company trucks. They couldn't tell us exactly how much they were planning to pay but did say they would be constantly assessing the situation and adjusting the pay accordingly. They also said that D* was mandating these changes (strange I think others here have mentioned their companies went from per hour using company trucks to per install using employee owned trucks, just the reverse of what is happening at our company). Another thing they said was that the trucks would be stocked with tools (whether they would be all the tools we would need they were not sure). Techs would be required to have a cell phone (which the company is NOT going to provide or pay for) and a fax machine (again they are NOT covering any of the cost of the machine or supplies for it) and a land based telephone. Once the changes start to take place, the first wave of techs getting the company trucks will be the first to be assigned jobs each day. Those techs without company truck will get whatever jobs are left over, if there are any.
The boss said that even if all the techs quit and walk out that will not stop this change from happening. They talked about the supposed benefits of this change, but their benefits couldn't add up to the amounts that each tech will losing each week once they go to hourly rates.
I'm just not sure this is a good thing (least ways no where near as good as the company would like for me to believe). I'm going to stick around as long as I can, but I am also going to be actively searching for a new job.

 

[urnote96]

Update: We had our tech meeting today and they told us about the change from per install using our trucks to per hour using company trucks. They couldn't tell us exactly how much they were planning to pay but did say they would be constantly assessing the situation and adjusting the pay accordingly. They also said that D* was mandating these changes (strange I think others here have mentioned their companies went from per hour using company trucks to per install using employee owned trucks, just the reverse of what is happening at our company). Another thing they said was that the trucks would be stocked with tools (whether they would be all the tools we would need they were not sure). Techs would be required to have a cell phone (which the company is NOT going to provide or pay for) and a fax machine (again they are NOT covering any of the cost of the machine or supplies for it) and a land based telephone. Once the changes start to take place, the first wave of techs getting the company trucks will be the first to be assigned jobs each day. Those techs without company truck will get whatever jobs are left over, if there are any.
The boss said that even if all the techs quit and walk out that will not stop this change from happening. They talked about the supposed benefits of this change, but their benefits couldn't add up to the amounts that each tech will losing each week once they go to hourly rates.
I'm just not sure this is a good thing (least ways no where near as good as the company would like for me to believe). I'm going to stick around as long as I can, but I am also going to be actively searching for a new job.

Yeah i also went the other way...and I LOVE the pay

 

[tjlandberg]

I should of clairfied when I said my company switched. It was actually bought out and the new HSP switched us over to per job.

Alot of things will change over time with this new pay structure. My new HSP is still making changes to help us make more money and we switched back in Feb.

 

[uboatcmdr]

I should of clairfied when I said my company switched. It was actually bought out and the new HSP switched us over to per job.

Alot of things will change over time with this new pay structure. My new HSP is still making changes to help us make more money and we switched back in Feb.

The thing that is bugging me is that my company is saying that D* is forcing this change. Then I hear that your company just went to per install pay and other HSP that were hourly have switched within the past year to per install pay as well. So it appears that the statements about D* forcing the change is untrue and that my company is just lying to us so that can grab a bigger chunk of the money. The thing that really gripes my a$$ is that in the meeting we had yesterday, they talked about how good the company has been to us and how much they were going to work to adjust the pay so we won't lose too much. All I can say is if they are going to try and f*ck people like that they should atleast buy them dinner and take them to a movie first.

 

[phatnuts]

To uboatcmdr

You work for Bruister @ associates dont you???
and yeah dude we are gonna get shafted

 

[phatnuts]

Bruister @ Associates

 

[uboatcmdr]

You work for Bruister @ associates dont you???
and yeah dude we are gonna get shafted

Yep & yep. I had heard about the upcoming changes almost a week before they held a meeting to tell us about it. When the managers finally tell everyone what they will be paying (they are pretending for now that they don't know) I think the feces will impact the rotary cooling device and a bunch of techs will walk.
I'm looking into other possible jobs, but I may also stick around for awhile just to see what happens. I know I'm not walking until I've got somewhere to to go.