Is Dish to be connected here with their ku band holdings?

[Lue]

Dish Network competition or possibly partners?

http://www.dumb-out.net/spacex-part...t-satellite-network-smallest-satellites/11479

http://www.spacenews.com/article/sa...adband-venture-secures-spectrum-for-satellite

http://online.wsj.com/articles/elon-musks-next-mission-internet-satellites-1415390062

http://www.usatoday.com/story/tech/2014/11/10/google-nasa-lease/18829369/

 

[primestar31]

Do a search on "Outernet" here on the site, and even just Google it.

It's already being done as of a couple months ago.

 

[Lue]

What are the current speeds/cost /latency for Dish Internet?

http://science.slashdot.org/story/14/11/08/143248/elon-musks-next-mission-internet-satellites

http://www.satellitemarkets.com/pdf2014/sept14.pdf

low cost? how low?
http://www.theverge.com/2014/11/11/7192173/satellite-elon-musk-spacex

• We're going to need this to get around Hollywood's increasingly weird hash of restrictions on streamed content. Let's see now: one network we can stream TV episodes from the day after air, another network that makes us wait a week, another network with certain shows mysteriously missing, another network whose commercial always freeze and require an app restart, and all those networks that let you stream so long as your cable company is one of their three Verify Your Provider choices.
  
  If Musk doesn't build this network, Pirate Bay will.
  
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    Re:
    High latency is right. Back around 1999 I got sick of waiting for Charter to flip the switch on broadband and got Echostar/Dish 2-way. My ping times were around 800ms for the trip to satellites 22,000 miles out. Luckily, I only had to deal with it for a year.
    
    Cranking up a multiplayer game of Serious Sam with my son on our LAN was funny though... the games would appear on the internet, and people would try and join. Satellite wasn't conducive to multiplayer games, for sure.
    
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      Re:
      Yeah, ping is a issue. A very large one. And if this goes on ahead, its going to be the nr 1 issue. Now, it would not surprise me that the bandwidth could be good, but even then, ping is a big issue.
      
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        That's why these and others like it are LEO. The latency is not much different from DSL.
        
        
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    Re:A global network of high-latency torrent server (Score:5, Informative)
    by Thagg (9904) <thadbeier@gmail.com> on Saturday November 08, 2014 @10:13AM (#48340337) Journal
    These will not be high latency. If you have 700 satellites more-or-less evenly distributed around the globe (say from 60S to 60N latitude) and you want a minimum of 45 degree elevation to the nearest satellite, they can be lower than 400 miles altitude, or 600 miles away. Assuming that the system will bounce signals from the satellites to a distributed network of fiber connected ground stations, latency should only be 10ms more than a pure cable transmissions.
    
    Previous satellite internet to geosynchronous satellites are nothing like this.
    
    I agree with other commenters that this is pretty unlikely, but SpaceX and Tesla were quite unlikely to succeed as well.
    
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      Replying to undo accidental moderation.
      
      
      
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      Re:
      Free space communications also have the advantage of a group velocity of c, rather than c / 1.5. This may not seem like much a difference, but it's enough that there is a considerable amount of research going into air-core fiber (although air-core is also promising for high power due to lower non-linearity).
      
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    Re:
    Iridium didn't have enough bandwidth to work for data, for any commercial pursuits. Satellite Internet is a growing industry. Doing satellite data better than the other guys would be a winning plan. Iridium didn't do satellite data. Just voice, and even that wasn't that good (no coverage in cities, the tall buildings block signal, no coverage indoors or heavy canopy). Great for a handset in the middle of the flat desert. Thankfully, the military needed that, so they kept afloat, after writing off the
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  Just a hint of musk (Score:5, Insightful)
  by rmdingler (1955220) on Saturday November 08, 2014 @09:58AM (#48340273)
  The people familiar with the matter cautioned the venture is in its formative stages, and Mr. Musk's participation isn't certain.
  Maybe, but dropping his rather formidable name into a venture produces instant positive reception.
  
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• 
  I wish them every success (Score:3)
  by John.Banister (1291556) * on Saturday November 08, 2014 @10:07AM (#48340311) Homepage
  I hope this works well for them, and I can buy access to the service several years from now. If the satellites pass messages directly to each other and could relay messages between two customers on the ground with the only centralized communications occurring in orbit, then it seems to me that it could be more challenging for organizations like the NSA to get in the middle of large numbers of those user communications simultaneously.
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    Re:
    If they start building these, you can rest assured that at least half the engineers working on the project will be on the NSA payroll.
    
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      Re:
      I wonder what the NSA would pay. If they plan for this in advance, it might provide for significant savings.
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  astronomers might not like this. (Score:4, Interesting)

http://www.satellitemarkets.com/pdf2014/sept14.pdf

 

[Lue]

Is it true that LEO satellites have lower latency? What orbit are the Dish Internet satellites in?

That's why these and others like it are LEO. The latency is not much different from DSL.

 

[Stargazer]

LEO satellites are much much closer to earth than geosynchronous satellites. The future is LEO for broadband access. This is a better solution than towers. I am surprised that the cell and satellite companies have not invested into this years ago.

 

[Lue]

Charlie's KU bandwidth needed to run this new sat. venture? or is other bandwidth going to be used? Could video be delivered by this new venture? Just as expected Google and Musk will team up for this large project, will charlie be invited/needed with his large blocks of bandwidth? Watch the video below.
http://www.foxbusiness.com/technolo...ntcmp=ob_article_footer_text&intcmp=obnetwork

 

[Stargazer]

Charlie could probably use LEO satellites for their bandwidth. LEO requires more satellites than GEO but I think they can be launched much more quickly. They could offer tv, internet, phone triple play through LEO satellites.

 

[navychop]

Can we really expect it to be much better than Iridium?

 

[Lue]

Can we really expect it to be much better than Iridium?

Elon's try at automobiles (Tesla) has all the automakers playing catch up.
Elon's try at space (SpaceX) rocked the aerospace industry at unheard of pricing, figuring this venture will rock the telecom industry as well.

Charlie, where are you? Google has already negotiated with all the content providers, appears programming will not be a problem for the new venture.

 

[DishSubLA]

And how many Google ventures have just floated into the ether. What Google does, and does pretty well, is allow their people to try ANYTHING they think might be the next new thing for the future, and after some time the ambitious ventures either work out to be something that could make money in the marketplace or just peter out as being too esoteric or where the economies are just bad. While this method costs a fair amount of money and resources (Google's failed barge for whatever it had planned) it can lead to one or two things that can make Google a heap of money, so it is worth the risk and resources, and Google wants its managers and employees to INNOVATE and think forward and not be afraid to TRY even a somewhat "kooky" idea because if Google doesn't support that, it will end up like a lot of other tech companies that are asleep in the present and totally not thinking of the future while competitors are on the cutting edge and reaping profits from the next big thing.

The thing is none of these companies really know what will be the future product or service, so they have to risk being experimental, in all places at the same time to be able to catch that fly ball, or they perish. This whole LEO thing is still an experimental trial balloon. I wouldn't bet on it just yet because most of these ideas just end up going nowhere.

 

[Lue]

Charlie could probably use LEO satellites for their bandwidth. LEO requires more satellites than GEO but I think they can be launched much more quickly. They could offer tv, internet, phone triple play through LEO satellites.

What/How is this LEO based service delivered to the end user? I could see an uplink at stationary locations (homes/business's). Just wondering if a LEO uplink would be much smaller and use less power (dangerous) than the current Dish uplink equipment? Anybody Know?

In a mobile (cars,trains,planes, etc.) situation will they use the cellular tower model (and maybe Charlies bandwidth) to send/receive to mobile units? Looking like a game changer for the industry to me. Hopefully they will need Dish's
spectrum somehow.

Now is an amazing time for mergers. Not just because they're all happening at the same time, but because they're taking place amid a grand convergence of all media onto a single platform: the Internet. Voice, video, data — sooner or later, it will all be carried over broadband. These companies know it. And they're preparing themselves for the epic slugfest ahead.

"Everybody is trying to get through the door at the same time," said Daniel Berninger, a network architect and analyst at the Washington-based Voice Communication Exchange Committee. "Nobody wants to be left out without a dance partner."

http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs...at-explains-this-years-spate-of-tech-mergers/

http://qz.com/294888/satellite-inte...ss-widow-maker-so-why-does-elon-musk-want-in/

 

[Stargazer]

LEO satellites are smaller, cheaper and has a lot less latency. They can be launched much quicker. The downside is that they cover a much smaller area so they need lots of them to cover the same area that one satellite does. They would not require as much power due to the smaller size and being much closer to earth. I am reading that Google has made good progress with their loon project, the wifi on weather balloons.

 

[TheKrell]

Well... I don't know how LEO sats (or balloons) can be really low power because the ground receivers would have to use a tracking dish to see them. The alternative is to use higher power and a much less directional receiving antenna.

 

[JM42]

Well... I don't know how LEO sats (or balloons) can be really low power because the ground receivers would have to use a tracking dish to see them. The alternative is to use higher power and a much less directional receiving antenna.

There would be a network of them. Think of a cell tower system in reverse. The end user device is (relatively) stationary, while the "towers" are moving overhead.

 

[TheKrell]

My point is that you can't do this with a dish any longer, and any other antenna will be less sensitive and require more power.

 

[bigjohnok]

LEO birds require a tracking dish(even with a tracking dish you might need more than as the birds orbit) or multiple stationary dishes with associated switching equipment to be able to keep a 24/7 connection.
Either option is going to cost money and I do not see any sat company(outside of niche outfits) installing a tracking dish or multiple stationary dishes plus the associated equipment without the customer ponying up some cash up front.

 

[Lue]

Is this the tracking dish you are referring to?

http://www.kymetacorp.com/products/automobiles/

Have heard rumors that Dish has talked to these guys.

http://www.satellitetoday.com/techn...-production-september-demonstration-with-o3b/

http://www.kymetacorp.com/kymeta-rxtx-milestone/

http://www.kymetacorp.com/products/fixed-antennas/

 

[Stargazer]

Kymeta’s portable Ka-band satellite terminal is roughly the size of a large laptop. The company is continuing to test out its technology with commercial partners this year. One of the metamaterial antenna’s top value propositions is that it eliminates the need to move in order to track satellites.

There is mention of Medium Earth Orbiting (MEO) satellites. That must be in between the distance of LEO and GEO satellites.

I see LEO satellites as best of both worlds, satellite that has a large coverage area and cell towers that have low latency. This will open up triple play opportunities to those outside the cable market and wider coverage areas. This is the next big thing. This could be the solution to weak cell signals and what satellite tv needs to compete with the cable companies.

DirecTV is reportedly interested in the technology because the user can install the antennas, eliminating the need for truck rolls and potentially reducing customer churn.

 

[Lue]

I agree, if the Sat. TV companies do not do this, others will be glad to. Elon Musk (spaceX) promises unfettered VERY low cost internet access. Google already has the content (Google Fiber), even the cable companies could themselves provide this new /cheaper form of delivery. As someone has said, this is the new "Space Race", will be very interesting to see who wins, just wondering if Dish is in the catbird seat with it's Vast spectrum holdings?

 

[Stargazer]

I seen where Google invested in 03b which is supposed to be doing LEO I had thought. Directv expressed interested in LEO and if AT&T buys Directv they could incorporate LEO phones and television on them as well.