Is Dwayne Wade the best clutch TEAM player in the NBA NOW?? (2 Viewers)

houselog442

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Jan 21, 2005
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Do you honestly think that IF Shaq and Wade were healthy throughout the 1st half....at the midway point they were gonna be JUST .500??

Yes, I think if both Shaq and Wade were there for the first half of the season I still think they would have been a .500 team. I remember back at the first weeks of the season when both were playing and they were horrible! Riley got so desperate he had to bench some of his main starters outside of the big 2 because they just stunk it up (Payton, Walker, Posey) and play Kapono and even Dorrel Wright. Riley's presence had become so divisive in the locker room, the team only improved once he left for surgery and Rothstein came in to clean up the mess. The other part of the equation is that Shaq plays lazy and half ass during most of the regular season. His defense has been awful, and now relies more on his hooks and footwork on offense because his shoulder hit routine is getting called by the refs. Now Shaq has to play with the most effort he has done in his career just to get into the playoffs. They got 2 things going for them. One, the Eastern Conference sucks so bad its laughable, and second, the role players that are in the lineup now are playing better.
 

salsadancer7

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Yes, I think if both Shaq and Wade were there for the first half of the season I still think they would have been a .500 team. I remember back at the first weeks of the season when both were playing and they were horrible! Riley got so desperate he had to bench some of his main starters outside of the big 2 because they just stunk it up (Payton, Walker, Posey) and play Kapono and even Dorrel Wright. Riley's presence had become so divisive in the locker room, the team only improved once he left for surgery and Rothstein came in to clean up the mess. The other part of the equation is that Shaq plays lazy and half ass during most of the regular season. His defense has been awful, and now relies more on his hooks and footwork on offense because his shoulder hit routine is getting called by the refs. Now Shaq has to play with the most effort he has done in his career just to get into the playoffs. They got 2 things going for them. One, the Eastern Conference sucks so bad its laughable, and second, the role players that are in the lineup now are playing better.

Well, I have to agree with some of your post. They DID start out horrible...and I think alot had to do with some resting on their laurels for winning a championship. I also think a few came in awful shape. You were off on the benching of starters though, because both Posey and Payton were coming off the bench. Remember J-Wil have been injured MOST of the 1st half because of abdominal tear...and those injuries take a damn long time to heal. And she ONLY plays lazy because he comes in out of shape. OTHER than the 1st year on the team, he has been a tad too friendly with the buffet table.

Now the Eastern Conference IS terrible, because truth be told, outside of Detroit and Miami(yes, even in their current state WITHOUT Wade) and Chicago, there is a drop off. People better REALLY be ware of Chicago. But anyways, last year Eastern Conference was no different than this years. And EVEN if Detroit would have one, I STILL thought that the champion would have come from the East....because they just play better defense in the East...and I have noticed this the last few years....the Eastern Conference teams have always been able to sacrifice offense for defense. See Dallas now is NO different personnel wise as last year, but this year, the have been willing to sacrifice offense for defense. Now don't get me wrong, they have one of the better offenses in the NBA....but this year, it's the defense that has them playing so well.
 

Paul Wozniak

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Oct 26, 2005
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Salasa, for a change you didn't leave me with anything to argue about. I especially agree with your assessment of the eastern conference playing defense. As for your Heat, injuries are the biggest reason for their struggles. I'm sure championship hangover factors in to some extent, it does with every team that wins it all.
 

salsadancer7

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Salasa, for a change you didn't leave me with anything to argue about. I especially agree with your assessment of the eastern conference playing defense. As for your Heat, injuries are the biggest reason for their struggles. I'm sure championship hangover factors in to some extent, it does with every team that wins it all.

EXCEPT the MJ lead Bulls of the 90's when they were winning their championships...."repeat the three-peat" ....I loved when I lived in Chicago then and worked in the defunked Chicago Sportchannel.

Can you believe that it will be 10 YEARS since that time??!! WOW..talk about time flying!
 

sidekick

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Aug 17, 2005
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How is that hating? The facts speak for themselves:

Eastern Conference
Atlantic W L PCT GB Home Road DIV CONF L10 Streak
Raptors 32 28 .533 0.0 20-9 12-19 8-2 22-13 5-5 L2
Nets 28 32 .467 4.0 17-15 11-17 7-6 21-16 5-5 L2
Knicks 28 33 .459 4.5 17-13 11-20 2-8 17-21 6-4 W2
76ers 22 38 .367 10.0 14-15 8-23 5-5 14-20 5-5 W4
Celtics 17 42 .288 14.5 7-21 10-21 6-7 11-24 5-5 W4

Central W L PCT GB Home Road DIV CONF L10 Streak
Pistons 37 20 .649 0.0 19-10 18-10 6-4 26-11 8-2 W1
Cavaliers 34 25 .576 4.0 22-8 12-17 4-5 20-16 6-4 W1
Bulls 35 27 .565 4.5 24-8 11-19 9-3 24-12 6-4 W3
Pacers 29 29 .500 8.5 18-12 11-17 7-4 20-14 3-7 L5
Bucks 22 38 .367 16.5 13-13 9-25 1-11 11-25 3-7 L1

Southeast W L PCT GB Home Road DIV CONF L10 Streak
Wizards 33 25 .569 0.0 23-8 10-17 7-2 21-13 5-5 W2
Heat 29 29 .500 4.0 17-10 12-19 4-3 16-16 6-4 W2
Magic 28 33 .459 6.5 18-12 10-21 6-6 16-20 2-8 L3
Bobcats 22 38 .367 12.0 13-16 9-22 3-7 14-21 4-6 L5
Hawks 22 38 .367 12.0 10-18 12-20 4-6 12-23 2-8 L5


Actually, I was looking to see the Knicks make some noise in the playoffs, but the injury to Crawford may have dampened that possibility.




LMAO.....very good. Now your doing nothing but hating.....
 

salsadancer7

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How is that hating? The facts speak for themselves:

Eastern Conference
Atlantic W L PCT GB Home Road DIV CONF L10 Streak
Raptors 32 28 .533 0.0 20-9 12-19 8-2 22-13 5-5 L2
Nets 28 32 .467 4.0 17-15 11-17 7-6 21-16 5-5 L2
Knicks 28 33 .459 4.5 17-13 11-20 2-8 17-21 6-4 W2
76ers 22 38 .367 10.0 14-15 8-23 5-5 14-20 5-5 W4
Celtics 17 42 .288 14.5 7-21 10-21 6-7 11-24 5-5 W4

Central W L PCT GB Home Road DIV CONF L10 Streak
Pistons 37 20 .649 0.0 19-10 18-10 6-4 26-11 8-2 W1
Cavaliers 34 25 .576 4.0 22-8 12-17 4-5 20-16 6-4 W1
Bulls 35 27 .565 4.5 24-8 11-19 9-3 24-12 6-4 W3
Pacers 29 29 .500 8.5 18-12 11-17 7-4 20-14 3-7 L5
Bucks 22 38 .367 16.5 13-13 9-25 1-11 11-25 3-7 L1

Southeast W L PCT GB Home Road DIV CONF L10 Streak
Wizards 33 25 .569 0.0 23-8 10-17 7-2 21-13 5-5 W2
Heat 29 29 .500 4.0 17-10 12-19 4-3 16-16 6-4 W2
Magic 28 33 .459 6.5 18-12 10-21 6-6 16-20 2-8 L3
Bobcats 22 38 .367 12.0 13-16 9-22 3-7 14-21 4-6 L5
Hawks 22 38 .367 12.0 10-18 12-20 4-6 12-23 2-8 L5


Actually, I was looking to see the Knicks make some noise in the playoffs, but the injury to Crawford may have dampened that possibility.

So you actually think that IF both players were healthy....they would JUST a .500 team?? You ARE kidding right?:eek:
 

sidekick

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I stated that I believed they would be seeded 6th or 7th. Whether or not that would be .500 or not would depend on other teams as well. I think Shaq is out of it mentally and emtionally, as is Riley. The rest of the team feeds off of emotion. When it's not there, the team's not there. There's always a mini surge when a star player goes down. That's not indicative of a trend though, as such a surge is rarely sustained. This isn't a knock on the Heat, it's basic psychology. I think last season was Shaq's answer to the world that he still has it. Frankly, absent the occasional big game, I think he's disinterested now.

So you actually think that IF both players were healthy....they would JUST a .500 team?? You ARE kidding right?:eek:
 

salsadancer7

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I stated that I believed they would be seeded 6th or 7th. Whether or not that would be .500 or not would depend on other teams as well. I think Shaq is out of it mentally and emtionally, as is Riley. The rest of the team feeds off of emotion. When it's not there, the team's not there. There's always a mini surge when a star player goes down. That's not indicative of a trend though, as such a surge is rarely sustained. This isn't a knock on the Heat, it's basic psychology. I think last season was Shaq's answer to the world that he still has it. Frankly, absent the occasional big game, I think he's disinterested now.

I am curious now, this is your assessment according to what? Because LAST year, they ended up as a 2 or 3 seed, I don't remember exactly....Shaq is stil one of the top 5 centers in the game...regardless of age and top 15 or possibly 10 in the league....I would really to know where you are basing your statement on....like I said, I am very curious....
 

sidekick

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I've been following Shaq for years and saw countless games in L.A. at Staples and the Forum when he was with the Lakers. I'm a certified NLP practitioner and routinely profile people in my profession. I can see it in his body language that physically he may be at the game, but most nights he's elsewhere mentally.

I am curious now, this is your assessment according to what? Because LAST year, they ended up as a 2 or 3 seed, I don't remember exactly....Shaq is stil one of the top 5 centers in the game...regardless of age and top 15 or possibly 10 in the league....I would really to know where you are basing your statement on....like I said, I am very curious....
 

salsadancer7

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I've been following Shaq for years and saw countless games in L.A. at Staples and the Forum when he was with the Lakers. I'm a certified NLP practitioner and routinely profile people in my profession. I can see it in his body language that physically he may be at the game, but most nights he's elsewhere mentally.

So the other night when he had 31 points, 16 rebounds and 6 assists...his mind was where? Or 16 points, 9 rebs, 4 assists, 2 steals and 2 blocks LAST night...was he thinking of SoBe?
 

salsadancer7

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Like I said above, there will be a slight surge, but it won't last.

Ok...just my opinion....but to me, it sounds like you are hating because he is no longer wearing a Laker uniform. IF he was still in LA, they would have won a few MORE championship by now. BUT, your owner there in LA chose the 'black hole' over the franchise....sorry dude, good ole Jerry made that bed so now your Lakers and their fans have to sleep in it.
 

Ramy

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Ok...just my opinion....but to me, it sounds like you are hating because he is no longer wearing a Laker uniform. IF he was still in LA, they would have won a few MORE championship by now. BUT, your owner there in LA chose the 'black hole' over the franchise....sorry dude, good ole Jerry made that bed so now your Lakers and their fans have to sleep in it.

Unfortunetly your right. As much of a fan as I am of the Lakers, I think Buss made the wrong choice of letting Shaq go.
 

sidekick

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Was it Jerry or Mitch Kupchak? I'm thinking the latter. I agree that it was premature, by one year, to let Shaq go. Buss was too concerned about getting bang for his buck while Shaq was still a viable entity. Unfortunately the deal that was made was idotic. I'm not "hating" anything. Hate is a word that I rarely if ever use as it's an evil word. I do think, however, that the Lakers could have done better. We got three championships out of Shaq. Not too shabby. Personally, I think the one of the worst moves the Lakers made was getting rid of Derek Fisher. He was the real sparkplug for the Lakers. I saw many games at the Forum and Staples Center when Fisher made some gutsy move to get the Lakers back into the game. Those stats don't show up in the box score, but they mean so much.


Ok...just my opinion....but to me, it sounds like you are hating because he is no longer wearing a Laker uniform. IF he was still in LA, they would have won a few MORE championship by now. BUT, your owner there in LA chose the 'black hole' over the franchise....sorry dude, good ole Jerry made that bed so now your Lakers and their fans have to sleep in it.
 

salsadancer7

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Was it Jerry or Mitch Kupchak? I'm thinking the latter. I agree that it was premature, by one year, to let Shaq go. Buss was too concerned about getting bang for his buck while Shaq was still a viable entity. Unfortunately the deal that was made was idotic. I'm not "hating" anything. Hate is a word that I rarely if ever use as it's an evil word. I do think, however, that the Lakers could have done better. We got three championships out of Shaq. Not too shabby. Personally, I think the one of the worst moves the Lakers made was getting rid of Derek Fisher. He was the real sparkplug for the Lakers. I saw many games at the Forum and Staples Center when Fisher made some gutsy move to get the Lakers back into the game. Those stats don't show up in the box score, but they mean so much.

Sorry dude, you know FULL well that Jerry gave the final yea or nea...not Mitch. And what has Fisher done since he left the Lakers? FORGET talking championships....just stats...Fisher has done nothing....He has literally disappeared. And no offense to Fisher, he was not gonna win you championships....Shaq was. And neither will Kobi.....not a team player....never will be......ah, ok....I should never say never....;)
 

sidekick

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Of course, Buss had the final say; with Mitch's blessing. Re: Fisher, you need good role players on a team. Fisher made those around him better. Shaq didn't win any championships until he came to L.A. He won one more with a rejuvenated Heat team with another "little brother" on the team. He won't win again.
 

cybok0

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Oct 23, 2006
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Of course, Buss had the final say; with Mitch's blessing. Re: Fisher, you need good role players on a team. Fisher made those around him better. Shaq didn't win any championships until he came to L.A. He won one more with a rejuvenated Heat team with another "little brother" on the team. He won't win again.

And how many has Kobe won since Shaq left :eureka I know none.:smug
 

salsadancer7

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Like I said above, there will be a slight surge, but it won't last.

Hey Sidekick......24 point, 9 rebounds, 9 assists, 2 blocks and 2 steals.....guess that small surge has died out.....and a serious ass whipping of a playoff team.
And look at that, no Wade to be found AND slowly...but surely moving up in the playoff seedings.:eek:
 

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