New Slimline 3 install in Atlanta

[noremac]

After 6 weeks of back-and-forth with DirecTV and a barely-cooperative local installer, my parents finally have HDTV, courtesy the new SL3 dish. Their very wooded location did not support seeing the 110 & 119, so this was their only option for reliable reception (although they did have a 'temporary' 5-lnb feed a few days prior).

Thanks to DirecTV higher-tier customer service for making this happen. But it was torture dealing with the local installer, where some combination of ignorance/laziness/not-getting-paid made getting this dish installed correctly almost impossible. The stories my folks were told about this dish not existing, not being able to see the satellites, not being able to find a good location (that was actually easy), still needing to see 110, 119 ..., and then they still left the wires above ground and left off a screw on the feed arm. %&@*)!#$

Here are some pics!

 

[Zynergi]

If there is NLOS for 119 then no installer is going to install in a 119 HD market, primarily because he will end up loosing the money he gets paid for that job, so its a waste of 2 hours. The 3lnb Slimline obviously helps tremendously with 119 NLOS issues but unfortunately there are still very limited areas D* is using it yet. In all other areas the HD Guide Data still streams off the 119 so we are still required to call a no line of sight on the entire install if the 119 can not be seen. I am by far not a lazy Installer but if the lot is as wooded as you say I would not be spending much time there either.

As far as the lines above the ground, that should not have happened, he should have either offered to bury it and post the dish for a cost or rescheduled the job for when you could have a trench dug, imo.

But grats on getting the install done.

 

[Smith P.]

If there is NLOS for 119 then no installer is going to install in a 119 HD market, primarily because he will end up loosing the money he gets paid for that job, so its a waste of 2 hours. The 3lnb Slimline obviously helps tremendously with 119 NLOS issues but unfortunately there are still very limited areas D* is using it yet. In all other areas the HD Guide Data still streams off the 119 so we are still required to call a no line of sight on the entire install if the 119 can not be seen. I am by far not a lazy Installer but if the lot is as wooded as you say I would not be spending much time there either.

As far as the lines above the ground, that should not have happened, he should have either offered to bury it and post the dish for a cost or rescheduled the job for when you could have a trench dug, imo.

But grats on getting the install done.

Half true - ONLY for those channels on 119W EXACTLY. Excluding local from other sats, for those channels EPG data spreading across 101W tpns.

 

[Smith P.]

noremac, could you tell us what is a designator assigned to the dish; regular 5 LNBFs dish is AU-9S; it could be printed on a box or stated in paperwork.

 

[noremac]

Sorry, I'm 600 miles away! I don't think my folks got any particular paperwork, and the installers usually remove boxes. Is there some marking on the feed I could ask them to find?

 

[Smith P.]

Just ask anything what they could reveal related to the designator. Thanks.

 

[Zynergi]

The dish itself is the same and comes the same as it always has, the only change is the 119 and 110 LNB feed horns are removed, as a tech we get the dish and LNB's separately, so if you have a AU9 now you can just swap LNB's although it would probably just be cheaper to disable 110/119 in the Sat Setup Menu.

On the Bulk box the 3 LNB say's SL3 if that helps.

So the LNB's that Fit the AU9 are

SL5 - 5 LNB Ka/Ku 99,101,103,110,119
SL3 - 3 LNB Ka/Ku 99,101,103
SWM5 - 5 LNB Ka/Ku Single Wire 8 tuner
SWM3 - 3 LNB Ka/Ku Single Wire 8 tuner

 

[texasbrit]

Half true - ONLY for those channels on 119W EXACTLY. Excluding local from other sats, for those channels EPG data spreading across 101W tpns.

No, the guide comes from 119 whenever you are tuned to a 103/110/119 channel, and from 101 if you are on a 99/101 channel, that's how the stacking plan works on the Slimline 5. It is modified on the Slimline 3 dish so that you get the 101 guide even when you are on 103.

 

[Smith P.]

OK, if you would be know how APG build, not that 'stacking plan' what is irrelevant here, then we will talk.
If you have REAL knowledge, I mean the APG data - sat:tp:SCID:network:channels (CO and ACO records).

 

[Zynergi]

Well I know for sure that in NC on a 5 LNB Slimline if you have no los (or loose it) you will not acquire any HD guide data. I have gone on numerous service calls where there was no guide information, and been on these since the mirror of 119 to 99c. I have also on a couple of these along with a couple friends houses, tested setting the Hxx Receiver set up on a 5lnb re-set to a 3 lnb KaKu LNB in sat setup and the guide starts to propagate again. So no I don't (and he probably doesn't) have any "data" to prove that fact other than hands on and a confirmation from D* ISS.

 

[texasbrit]

I have hands-on experience of this and also confirmation from inside DireCTV that this is how it works, and that the Slimline 3 changes the stack plan so that 101 is diplexed onto 103. The guide is transmitted simultaneously on 101 and 119. There is no doubt that if you don't have line of sight to 119 and you leave a receiver on 103 for too long you will lose guide updates. If you tune the receiver to a 99 or 101 channel the guide will come back. There have been literally dozens of posts about this on various forums, and many people have set up the workaround to autotune their receivers to a 101 channel every night and this restores their guide.
On the DVR only tuner 1 processes the guide so you need to make sure tuner 1 is tuned regularly to 101.
If you have the SWM then none of this matters because the SWM uses the 101 guide and sends it down a separate channel to all receivers regardless of which satellite thay are tuned to.

But zynergi I have to disagree with you. Setting a receiver connected to a 5-lnb dish so it thinks it has a Slimline3 dish will NOT solve this problem. A 5-lnb dish uses the 99/101 and 103/110/119 stacking plan even if you tell the receiver it is a Slimline3. It just behaves like a Slimline 5 with no 110/119, except that the 110/119 satellites are removed from the guide. If you have no 119 signals, you will have the guide issues from time to time unless you have a Slimline 3 or are using SWM.

 

[Smith P.]

Sorry, I barked on wrong three.
When you'll have some technical info, I would glad to check it for you, if it real or not.
So far I know what I see in stream.

 

[cubsfan34]

Kind of off topic, but what HD channels are still on 110 and not on the 99/103 yet (if any)?

Lyngsat still shows ESPNHD, TNTHD, and a few other HDs on 110w, and not on any other satellite. What channels are not available in the Slimline 3 LNB set up?

EDIT:

Also, I have heard from some people that with this LNB skewing isn't necessary because of the satellite spacing, is that true?

 

[ChrisPC]

Kind of off topic, but what HD channels are still on 110 and not on the 99/103 yet (if any)?

Lyngsat still shows ESPNHD, TNTHD, and a few other HDs on 110w, and not on any other satellite. What channels are not available in the Slimline 3 LNB set up?

EDIT:

Also, I have heard from some people that with this LNB skewing isn't necessary because of the satellite spacing, is that true?

From what I've read, all HD channels should be on 99 or 103 at this point. Lyngsat is not always 100% correct. I would think skew would still be necessary, especially since the Ka beam is so much narrower than the Ku.

 

[texasbrit]

All the HD channels are now available on 99/103; there are still duplicates on 110/119 of channels like ESPN but these will be going away "soon".
The SL3 is physically identical to the SL5 apart from the LNB itself so you still need to tilt the dish exactly the same as you do with the SL5. However, since 99 and 103 are so close to 101 you probably don't need the same accuracy on tilt as you do to get 119 on the SL5. I am told that under normal circumstances (with a dish that is correctly plumb) you just need to dial in the tilt for your location and then concentrate on the azimuth/elevation and this will bring in high 99/103 signals. I haven't installed an SL3 but that would make sense; with the SL5 if your dish is showing low 99/103 signals you rarely (never?) have to adjust the tilt to align the dish.

 

[Matt9876]

On a 99-101-103 install the tilt adjustment is mainly to balance 99-103 Ka signals.

Ka band signals are a bit more touchy than most would think.

 

[JamesJ]

On a 99-101-103 install the tilt adjustment is mainly to balance 99-103 Ka signals.

Ka band signals are a bit more touchy than most would think.

I saw a chart that says the area to hit a KA signal as compared to KU was almost in half to a third of the size, its that much of a difference, I wish I would have saved that

 

[Jimbo]

This is an interesting thread

I wish I could understand what Smith P talks about abit more.
I know he has access to seeing what is in the data stream and that is very useful, but often you talk about things that are over most people head, without enough explanation.

I have done plenty of installs and understand what is going on with most of this stuff, but have yet to do the new 3 lnb set up's or the SWM's .

I have a potential 3 lnb set up, if it was readily available as a friend has fought losing signal from the 110 and 119 for years now due to trees that are out of his control.

Jimbo