Outdoor antenna needed in Lansdale, PA

[johnearly]

Greetings,
I'm really glad I found this forum. I need some help with HD both for myself and my mom and from all the posts I'm seeing I think I found the right place for answers (unlike my local RadioShack, which seems to have no correct answers for anything).
My antenna problem:
I bought my mom a Sony HD DVR (model DHG-HDD500) and a nice LCD TV to watch it on, and after I got everything set up we could see a handful of HD stations. The problem is that mom wants to get PBS (at least WHYY from Wilmington) and that is coming in pretty crappy analog SD, nothing digital at all. I looked at antennaweb.org and got *really* confused, because the result they give and what I see are rather different.
Here is what antennaweb gives for my mom's street address:
* yellow - uhf WPPX-DT 61.1 i WILMINGTON DE 179° 14.0 31
* yellow - uhf WPVI-DT 6.1 ABC PHILADELPHIA PA 180° 13.9 64
* yellow - uhf WTVE-DT 51.1 IND READING PA 298° 22.2 25
yellow - uhf WTXF 29 FOX PHILADELPHIA PA 179° 14.1 29
* yellow - uhf WTXF-DT 29.1 FOX PHILADELPHIA PA 178° 12.8 42
* yellow - uhf WPHL-DT 17.1 WB PHILADELPHIA PA 179° 14.0 54
* yellow - uhf WYBE-DT 34.1 PBS PHILADELPHIA PA 179° 14.0 34
* yellow - uhf KYW-DT 3.1 CBS PHILADELPHIA PA 180° 13.9 26
green - uhf WGTW 48 TBN BURLINGTON NJ 180° 13.9 48
green - uhf WPHL 17 WB PHILADELPHIA PA 179° 14.0 17
green - uhf WPSG 57 UPN PHILADELPHIA PA 179° 14.2 57
* green - uhf WPSG-DT 57.1 UPN PHILADELPHIA PA 179° 14.0 32
lt green - vhf WPVI 6 ABC PHILADELPHIA PA 179° 13.8 6
lt green - uhf WTVE 51 IND READING PA 296° 32.7 51
lt green - uhf WYBE 35 PBS PHILADELPHIA PA 179° 14.0 35
lt green - uhf WFMZ 69 IND ALLENTOWN PA 353° 23.7 69
lt green - vhf WCAU 10 NBC PHILADELPHIA PA 179° 13.9 10
lt green - vhf KYW 3 CBS PHILADELPHIA PA 179° 13.8 3
* red - uhf WCAU-DT 10.1 NBC PHILADELPHIA PA 179° 14.0 67
* red - uhf WHYY-DT 12.1 PBS WILMINGTON DE 179° 14.0 55
blue - uhf WLVT 39 PBS ALLENTOWN PA 354° 23.7 39
* blue - uhf WLVT-DT 39.3 PBS ALLENTOWN PA 353° 23.7 62
blue - uhf WPPX 61 i WILMINGTON DE 192° 37.6 61
blue - vhf WHYY 12 PBS WILMINGTON DE 179° 14.0 12
* blue - vhf WBPH-DT 59.1 FMN BETHLEHEM PA 353° 23.7 9
My first question is about the distances; they don't make much sense. Do the cities and distances bear any relationship to each other? If so, how is channel 12.1, WHYY, 14 miles away in Wilmington and at the same time channel 61, WPPX, 37.6 miles away still in Wilmington? The real problem is that I can't quite figure out why I get some stations and not others, based on that chart. The biggest head scratcher for me is WHYY and WCAU. Both are listed in "red" and at 179° and 14 miles away, yet 10.1 comes in great both analog and digital, and WHYY sucks analog and is untunable in digital. I tried an outdoor amplifier but that didn't seem to make any difference. The antenna is the typical rooftop affair, cost about $50 from RadioShack about 20 years ago and I'm willing to replace it if that will fix the problem. Another thing is that 6.1, near the top of the list, is very weak, but 6, 6.2, and 6.3 are all fine. Might the problem be elsewhere? Any suggestions will be appreciated!
Thanks,
John.

 

[Tower Guy]

Greetings,
I'm really glad I found this forum. I need some help with HD both for myselfMy first question is about the distances; they don't make much sense.

Do the cities and distances bear any relationship to each other? If so, how is channel 12.1, WHYY, 14 miles away in Wilmington and at the same time channel 61, WPPX, 37.6 miles away still in Wilmington? The real problem is that I can't quite figure out why I get some stations and not others, based on that chart. The biggest head scratcher for me is WHYY and WCAU. Both are listed in "red" and at 179° and 14 miles away, yet 10.1 comes in great both analog and digital, and WHYY sucks analog and is untunable in digital. I tried an outdoor amplifier but that didn't seem to make any difference. The antenna is the typical rooftop affair, cost about $50 from RadioShack about 20 years ago and I'm willing to replace it if that will fix the problem. Another thing is that 6.1, near the top of the list, is very weak, but 6, 6.2, and 6.3 are all fine. Might the problem be elsewhere? Any suggestions will be appreciated!
Thanks,
John.

The cities listed are the city of license, not the location of the transmitter.

6.1, 6.2 and 6.3 are all the same transmitted signal. It's unlikely that 6.1 is bad while 6.2 and 6.3 are fine. I'd guess that your antenna is not aimed perfectly and the differences in signal just happened at the time that you measured them. Try the test again.

Your problem is to figure out which way to aim your antenna. Unless you have a rotor there's too many choices.

 

[NightHawk]

It looks as if WHYY is currently running under special temporary authority (low power) at only 87 KW. They have a construction permit to go full power sometime in the near future.

This is often the difference in reception success.

 

[snaggerbob]

How do find out how much power a station is transmitting?

 

[Weezknight]

Yeah, good luck with WHYY. I'm a little north of Lansdale and I can get everything very good with my indoor antenna. However I don't get WHYY digital at all, and UPN57 is pretty touchy with its digital signal.

Good luck and let us know how it works out with a rooftop. If it gets WHYY I may have to go that route. They do a lot of HD stuff!

 

[Jim5506]

How do find out how much power a station is transmitting?

You can use any one of the several sites that pull the data from the FCC database:

1. www.TVRadioworld.com - look up the state, city and TV information and look at the station in question. Click on the Complete FCC data for the analog station. Look for the Service designation DS for Digital Special Temporary Authority. 4-5 lines down is the Effective Radiated Power (ERP).

2. http://www.2150.com/broadcast/ - use the www.ngdc.noaa.gov site at the top to find your longitude and latitude and magnetic declination. When you click the Show Stations button, the 3rd from last column is ERP and height above ave terrain.

 

[NightHawk]

How do find out how much power a station is transmitting?

Enter the station callsign and click on the DT station.

http://www.fcc.gov/mb/video/tvq.html

 

[newsposter]

the FCC site for philly:

http://www.fcc.gov/fcc-bin/tvq?stat...t2=&mlat2=&slat2=&dlon2=&mlon2=&slon2=&size=9

ignore my signals readings..i copied from another post

uhf  station  signal  power  height
26 (cbs3)    90-92      770/375
31 (pax61)   90-91       
32 (upn 57)  90      250/400
34 (wbye35)  80-85      358/377
42 (fox 29)  25-45      305/161
54 (wb 17)   60ish      500/354
64 (abc 6)   85+      500/390
67 (nbc10)   85++      560/377

I'm 40 miles out from philly and using a DB8 antenna. I hear the channelmaster 4228 is about the same at half the price but not sure where to get either locally.

OTA SD is even so much better than the directv locals that I record most everything not in HD even OTA (takes more space but worth it). Now MPEG 4 may be a whole different game. I haven't seen it.

good luck with fox..real PITA

 

[dodge]

Whyy

WHYY is a great pbs affilate they are the ones that produce Hometime. I wish the govt would give the like 1 billion kw to transmit on so everyone can get pbs with rabbit ears...

 

[newsposter]

WHYY is a great pbs affilate they are the ones that produce Hometime. I wish the govt would give the like 1 billion kw to transmit on so everyone can get pbs with rabbit ears...

I always wondered why you'd see them around philly stores etc on the show. Weren't there some guys (furniture guys?) that also were philly?