Over the air HD "Digital Service" EPG

[Hall]

The 811 and 6000 receivers (not sure about the 5000 or the JVC model) are NOT DVRs. That seems to be the key with Dish and DirecTV DVRs. Standard, non-DVR receivers, often do read and display PSIP data.

What I and others have referred to about behavior in the recent past, this part

In order for the receiver to see what program information is available, the channel must be included in the subscribed DMA package from DISH Network accompanied with the necessary satellite feed in order to display the program information into the electronic program guide.

is that Dish was, for a short time, providing the guide data for sub-channels of channels they do carry. For example, they carry my local CBS, channel 7(-00), for me. The digital feed is channel 7-01 and currently has guide data. Their add'l sub-channel, 7-02, says "Digital Service" today. For two brief days, it listed "Weather Now" or something like that.

 

[Peter Parker]

But you can (in some cases) get OTA EPG data for channels outside of your DMA that you can receive OTA. I get it for several stations in the Baltimore DMA one of which I have never been able to view on my 622 although it may have picked up duringa scan.

 

[Hall]

That's not related to this.

 

[Derwin0]

The FOX 34-01 is also broadcast by them on 34-00 Soooo away the email goes...

Are you subscribed to locals? You will not get any local guide data if you are not subscribed to Dish Locals.

edit...noticed that the attachment shows you are subcribed to locals. Therefore a Dish Problem. I have one local (WGCB) that does the same thing.

 

[mdonnelly]

If you get EPG data for a Dish local, but not the associated digital primary, it could be a problem with the station's PSIP not being in strict conformance with the standard. There's some information there that ties the digital channel number to the analog channel, and Dish uses that to bind their EPG data to the digital channel.

Dish is known for having a very picky PSIP algorithm, which kicks out data that some other receivers will accept. Complain enough, and Dish will either modify their software, or will contact the station to report a PSIP issue.

 

[ClevelandRob]

I wish there was a way to send EPG data from an SD local to the HD OTA counterpart... That would fix everyone's problems. Then E* wouldn't have to send any additional info.

 

[bowens]

If you get EPG data for a Dish local, but not the associated digital primary, it could be a problem with the station's PSIP not being in strict conformance with the standard. There's some information there that ties the digital channel number to the analog channel, and Dish uses that to bind their EPG data to the digital channel.

Dish is known for having a very picky PSIP algorithm, which kicks out data that some other receivers will accept. Complain enough, and Dish will either modify their software, or will contact the station to report a PSIP issue.

E* should allow us, if we want to, to choose what channel's guide info gets mapped to each digital channel. For instance, my local digital PBS is on 36-1 and the local through E* is on channel 5. 36-1 did not have any guide info for a long time, so I had to keep channel 5 in the guide so I could see what was on. If they would have allowed me to assign the guide info from channel 5 to channel 36-1, this would have all been taken care of.

 

[Peter Parker]

That's not related to this.

true. but an earlier post might have inadvertently misled people into thinking otherwise.

 

[navychop]

"...Would be nice to record 24 in HD again..."

You do understand, you can set a manual timer (start/stop times, channel #) just like with old VCRs? I do this to record OTA ER & DH.

 

[kb7oeb]

E* should allow us, if we want to, to choose what channel's guide info gets mapped to each digital channel. For instance, my local digital PBS is on 36-1 and the local through E* is on channel 5. 36-1 did not have any guide info for a long time, so I had to keep channel 5 in the guide so I could see what was on. If they would have allowed me to assign the guide info from channel 5 to channel 36-1, this would have all been taken care of.

If the analog is on 5 then the station is legally required to remap to the analog number. If you added the station when they were having a problem it might show the real digital channel. You should try scanning again to see if they have corrected the problem.

 

[mathewpotter]

This is the email response I got from e*.

I see that most of us are on the same page here. From what IV read its DISH who is not sending the EPG for those chans to the DVR.

On there own website it says that the 622 DOES NOT GET THAT INFO OVER THE AIR. Some other models do. Guess Ill just wait and see.



The post about them having strict algorithms is probably the case.


----

Dear Mr. Potter,

Thank you for expressing your concerns and interest in DISH Network. The dishquality email box is managed by the Quality Assurance department; we only handle picture quality issues. We have forwarded your concerns to the appropriate department. They responded by clearing our system and then checking with your local provider. It turns out the problem is on their end, they are working to resolve, but currently no estimated time of restoration.

At DISH Network we appreciate the time customers take to email their audio/video quality concerns. Thank you for your patience and for being a valued customer.

EchoStar Satellite LLC
Quality Assurance Department
dishquality@echostar.com

 

[FitzAusTex]

Come on E*! Just give us ALL the local channels EPG info. Fine, give it to us only if we subscribe to locals if you must, but give it to us. I should say give it BACK to us, as I had EPG channel and subchannel info for ALL my locals for a month from Jan 5th- Feb 7th, 2007. They know how to give us this info, they did give us this info, and we want it back, PLEASE.

Yes, I know I can record PBS HD content via a manual timer, but I'm tired of searching PBS's website, and setting 10 - 12 manual recordings each week.

 

[Derwin0]

I wish there was a way to send EPG data from an SD local to the HD OTA counterpart... That would fix everyone's problems. Then E* wouldn't have to send any additional info.

They could, but it would fubar name based recording.

 

[Scott Greczkowski]

I actually asked this question to Mark Jackson and to Charlie and neither had an answer.

Subchannel information WAS available here in Connecticut on the 622 for about a month, and then one day the subchannel data was removed from the uplink and its been gone ever sense.

 

[bowens]

If the analog is on 5 then the station is legally required to remap to the analog number. If you added the station when they were having a problem it might show the real digital channel. You should try scanning again to see if they have corrected the problem.

Apparently my local channels do not see a need to follow the law. PBS, analog channel 5, is and always has been on digital channel 36. No remapping. CBS, analog channel 53, is and always has been on digital channel 28. No remapping. I guess they don't know the rules or are just too lazy to follow them.

 

[Hall]

I actually asked this question to Mark Jackson and to Charlie and neither had an answer.

Charlie didn't know ?? He runs the company and I'd hope he doesn't get involved in details like this....

Mark Jackson, on the other hand, might. Was he going to look into it for you ?? Is it possible this guide data was done unofficially ??

 

[Jim5506]

I am not sure digitals are REQUIRED to map to their analog channel number - never heard of that.

The channel mapping was done at the request of stations to be able to associate the digital channel with the old analog channel. If they don't choose to do it - no biggie.

 

[Hall]

The stations or their lobbying groups definitely pushed the issue so that they could re-map to their existing analog channel numbers. Part of it was familiarity with the number they've had for years. I mean, my local CBS is "channel 7", not 41-1...

They don't want to have to remodel or renovate their sets, re-paint or re-sticker their vehicles, letterhead, etc, etc (this stuff adds up to a lot more than the layman thinks when there's a name change, address change, etc).

 

[DWS44]

Y'all might like to drop into the uplink activity...apparently guide data is returning!