Signal Loss

Discussion in 'C-BAND Satellite Discussion' started by wvman, Apr 26, 2019.

  1. wvman

    wvman Topic Starter SatelliteGuys Pro
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    I have a puzzling problem. After adding a second receiver to my system, I started suffering signal loss on one receiver and I don't know what's causing it. My wife watches Light TV on 91W often. For some reason, if the receiver in the other room isn't on the same satellite, all signal is lost on every channel on this satellite. If I go to 91W on the other receiver, all the channels come back.

    Occasionally, we will be watching something on the main receiver and the screen will go black the message "No Signal" will pop up for a second or two and the signal will come back and everything is back to normal. All of my dishes, except the Ku dishes have Titanium dual output LNBF's on them. At first I thought the problem was caused by each receiver being on different circuits in the house.

    I ran a new drop and installed a new outlet on the same circuit as the main receiver, and it still did it. I had a friend who's a certified electrician and an electrical engineer come out and check the electricity in the house. Nothing out of the ordinary. The main receiver is an Amiko Mini HD265 and the second is a Geosat Pro HDVR-3500. Below is a picture of my switch configuration.

    Any ideas? Almost forgot to mention that both receivers run through a TripLight Line Conditioner.

    IMG_0008[1].jpg
     
  2. comfortably_numb

    comfortably_numb Dogs have owners, cats have staff
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    I've experienced this issue and I believe it is caused by a weak power supply. I have two receivers and a host of dual LNB's, and before I added a beefier power supply to my Amiko HD.265, I would experience complete signal loss like you have. I would check to see what amperage your power supplies are providing, and consider replacing them with beefier ones. Solved my problems.

    PS- KE4EST is now selling 6 amp power supplies for the Amiko. $15 shipped IIRC. I highly recommend it.
     
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  3. wvman

    wvman Topic Starter SatelliteGuys Pro
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    I have some 2 amp filtered power supplies for my video cameras that are 12VDC output like the ones that came with the receivers. Those should work fine. I'll switch them out and see what happens. Thanks. :) I'll also order a couple from KE4EST just in case.
     
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  4. danristheman

    danristheman SatelliteGuys Pro

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    What i use 4 zinwell powered 22khz switches. 8 dual output lnbs to 4 zinwell 22khz then into 3 8x1 pansat switches. You have to many lnbs to power up. Look into something I have. Faster change between satellites.
     
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  5. wvman

    wvman Topic Starter SatelliteGuys Pro
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    Actually, I don't use a 22Khz tone, so only one port is powered at a time. Last night I dug up two 3 amp power supplies and hooked them up and it's didn't make a difference. The power supplies that came with the receivers were only 450ma supplies. My configuration is a bit slower between channels than yours would be.

    I've never cascades switches, so that would be all new to me, but I'm willing to give it a shot. I'd appreciate a picture of your switch configuration. Be interesting to look at. Thanks for the reply. :)
     
  6. a33

    a33 SatelliteGuys Pro

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    My first thought would be, that somehow you need the other receiver to power the LNB; maybe because the one cable has a high resistance or contact problem.
    When you swap the cables of the 91W LNB at the switches, does the problem change?

    Don't know if that is a related, or unrelated problem.

    greetz,
    A33
     
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  7. wvman

    wvman Topic Starter SatelliteGuys Pro
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    I've swapped most of the cables from one switch to the other and it didn't make a difference. I've checked voltage drop and resistance in all the cables. Found nothing. I even powered up both outputs on all the LNBF's to see if there was a voltage drop from one to the other when both receivers are on, and found no significant difference. The highest was about 4ma.

    All the cables to all 8 dishes is new, ComScope RG6 quad shield with high quality Snap-N-Seal connectors, and both Pansat switches are new. I even checked all F-Connectors for stray strands from the outer shield. The only thing I haven't done is splash it with Holy Water and say a prayer. :)
     
  8. a33

    a33 SatelliteGuys Pro

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    So, could the one input port of the diseqc switch have a problem?
    Have you also tested without diseqc switch connected / with diseqc switch by-passed?

    A33
     
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  9. . Raine

    . Raine SatelliteGuys Pro
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    Do you have another receiver that you can swap out temporarily with the 3500?

    I was having those type issues with my 3500 and I replaced the stock power supply with a 2 amp one, that cured it for a month or so but then it started again, then a week or so later it crapped out completely, dead.
     
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  10. wvman

    wvman Topic Starter SatelliteGuys Pro
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    As the picture shows, I am using two switches. I have checked each satellite without the switch and it didn't do it hooked direct to the dish. However, I changed both switches when I rewired the dishes. I'm using 8 dishes, so running a movable dish for each room is kind of not what I want to do. I'd rather have all the dishes hooked to two switches. It's much easier for my wife that way.

    Danristheman's suggestion earlier might be something I may have to try to eliminate the problem. :)
     
  11. wvman

    wvman Topic Starter SatelliteGuys Pro
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    So far, I haven't lost a receiver or switch, but I have a shelf full of receivers. I buy one and test it, then get another and so on. :) I've been kicking around the idea of a 4K receiver, but I'm not certain which one to go with. Not a lot of 4K up there anyway yet. It's a lot of fun to play with. Right now, I have 1009 channels programmed in. :)
     
  12. comfortably_numb

    comfortably_numb Dogs have owners, cats have staff
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    How about the Edision OS Mio 4K ;)
     
  13. wvman

    wvman Topic Starter SatelliteGuys Pro
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    Been kicking it around.:)
     
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  14. a33

    a33 SatelliteGuys Pro

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    Well, something is wrong in the receiver - switch - LNB combination, and it is puzzling indeed!

    I'm wondering: Is there power on the switch port, while the receiver has no reception? Or has the power been 'reset' to port 1 of the switch?


    To check this possible 'switch reset' possibility further:
    What happens when you switch the 'other' receiver off again: Is the signal lost
    a) immediately
    b) after switching to another channel at 91W
    c) after switching to another satellite, and then back to 91W
    d) only after total poweroff ?


    Greetz,
    A33
     
    #14 a33, Apr 28, 2019
    Last edited: Apr 28, 2019
  15. primestar31

    primestar31 SatelliteGuys Master

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    IMO, do NOT buy another receiver until you are positive you have this signal issue repaired. I had what sound much like this same thing happen last year, and it turned out to be my second receiver caused a ground loop through the HDMI port, and partially ZAPPED one output of my Titanium C2w-PLL lnbf.

    I had the same symptoms. Start reading my thread from this post, and see if yours is that same:

    I'll take "Name that satellite" for $500 please! HELP!
     
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  16. danristheman

    danristheman SatelliteGuys Pro

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    Prime might be on something, but you might need a setup like mine.
     
  17. wvman

    wvman Topic Starter SatelliteGuys Pro
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    That sounds pretty close to what I've been experiencing. I never even thought about the HDMI cables. I have an additional TV in the bedroom that's hooked through a 2 way HDMI splitter. I also have a 4 port HDMI switch at the main receiver so I can switch between my DVD player, the LR TV and my security system. If that's the problem, how do you remedy the problem?

    A ground loop through the HDMI circuit could be a real pain in the butt to fix, short of unhooking the other inputs. I have 4 HDMI ports on the TV, but I'm not sure it would fix the problem by hooking all of them directly to the TV and switching them at the TV. I think there's an HDMI out on it too, so I could hook the BR TV to it. :)
     
    #17 wvman, Apr 29, 2019
    Last edited: Apr 29, 2019
  18. primestar31

    primestar31 SatelliteGuys Master

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    I never fixed mine as of yet. I am planning on running a ground wire from the service ground rod out to my new c-band dish and pole, but had to wait for Winter to end. I have all the stuff needed to do it, but it has to go underground under my driveway, so it'll be a bit as of yet.

    Not sure if that'll fix it. If not, the only cure would be a tv set that doesn't have the problem. How to figure that out before I buy one, beats me...

    P.S. I even tried an HDMI to Component converter box since I had one laying around, but it didn't work either. Still had the ground loop.
     
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  19. wvman

    wvman Topic Starter SatelliteGuys Pro
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    I bonded all 8 of my dishes together and ran a ground to the service entrance to balance the grounds. It didn't help, but we have extremely poor electric service out here in the country. A couple years ago during deer season, I walked the power company's right of way and I found over a half mile of primary ground wire lying on the ground below the power poles.

    The whole power system lacked a ground and the system depended on a single ground at the transformer and entrance to ground everything. I raised hell for 2 years and to this day, the ground cables are still laying in the right of way. The last serious snow storm we had broke down trees across the power lines and snapped off poles. Instead of replacing the poles in some areas, they actually installed insulators in nearby trees and tied the 8300 volt primary line to them.

    Some are still tied to trees even today. :(
     
  20. comfortably_numb

    comfortably_numb Dogs have owners, cats have staff
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    I, too, live in the country and have power issues. Mainly brownouts and blackouts. I have UPS systems with AVR on all of my electronics to try and isolate myself from the power issues.
     
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