Space in the Clarke belt.

[123tim]

How is it possible to have more than one satellite in what seems the same location in the Clarke belt? I am thinking of Galaxy 11 Nimiq 1 (Both at 91.0 degrees), but it seems that there are other locations that have even more than that.
Thank you.

 

[PSB]

All the satellites are Parked in a 15KM box so its easy to have them stacked together at the same orbital position. I think 101w is the busiest slot!

 

[123tim]

All the satellites are Parked in a 15KM box so its easy to have them stacked together at the same orbital position.

Pete,
Sorry, I'm sort of dense sometimes. Does this mean that they can be positioned side by side?
I hate to divert my post, but does this also mean that there's a lot more room for future satellites?

Edit- After looking at 110 degrees ( I think that this is where you said it was The busiest) I got to wondering who decides who puts their satellite where?
Thanks for the answer.
Tim

 

[GeorgeLV]

The satellites are 22,240 miles above the earth. They can physically be miles apart from each other in space and still appear to come from the same angle from earth.

 

[charper1]

Here you go:

 

[MikeDuncan]

22 thousand miles, eh? No wonder I am having problems pointing LOL!

 

[Tron]

Contrast that 22 THOUSAND miles with the roughly 220 miles from Earth that the International Space Station orbits within.

 

[123tim]

OK. I'm still dense, so I'd better check to make certain that I understand this. I'll use 110.0 West as my example.
I understand that the magnitude of the distance allows for satellites to appear to be at the same position while they actually are not. Does this mean that the satellites are just a couple of miles apart in longitude (Which I am thinking is no.), or latitude? (I'm thinking yes) Latitude seems to be what the sat charts show.
One of my problems in understanding is this: I thought that for a geosynchronous orbit, the satellite would have to be exactly on the equator. At 110 degrees, six satellites are parked. If they are 3 miles apart (in latitude), that would equal 18 miles of separation. Maybe this isn't really much considering the earths size? Maybe the satellite is able to correct itself in orbit? Maybe I'm completely off in my reasoning?
How far apart (in actual miles) would two satellites be that are 2 degrees apart?
Like Galaxy 10R at 123.0 W and Galaxy 12 at 125.0 degrees West? I'm going to try to figure this out. I'm certain that I'll come up with the wrong answer.
Thanks for putting up with stupid questions
Edit - Using a 2 * 3.14 * Radius = C and assuming a radius of 22,500 miles I get an answer of 785 miles (for distance between satellites with 2 degrees separation.) If this is correct, I guess that 18 or so miles wouldn't be much of anything.

 

[No Strings]

22,300mi + 4,000 mi (earth radius) = 26,300

26,300 x 2 = 52,600 (Clarke orbit diameter)

3.14 x 52,600 = 165,164 (Clarke orbit circumference)

165,164/360 = 458.8 miles per degree.

458.8 x 2 = 917.6 miles per 2 degree slot.

Neal

 

[PSB]

THANKS Neal, what about the co-location distances? Not been able to gleam that info anywhere.

 

[PSB]

Talking about the Clarke Belt I did find this great link to his original article from an October 1945 copy of Wireless World.

EXTRA-TERRESTRIAL RELAYS
Can Rocket Stations Give World-wide Radio Coverage?
By ARTHUR C. CLARKE

http://www.lakdiva.org/clarke/1945ww/1945ww_oct_305-308.html

I have this on my office wall

 

[charper1]

What an amazing read. It puts into perspective one's thoughts on our rapid advancement of the 70's - 90's as really being back in the 40's - 60's. We are just the beneficiaries of our grandfather's and father's work. (well I am because I am only 37) Mine are both gone, and to them and all the others, I SAY THANK YOU, for EVERYTHING! I am sure they were called crazy back then.

 

[No Strings]

THANKS Neal, what about the co-location distances? Not been able to gleam that info anywhere.

On that I am not sure but I do believe that they stack them putting them above or below eachother.

I have a friend that works at DTV and was doing a drift pattern analysis and I think they keep the DTV birds in a 10km x 10km box.

Neal

 

[123tim]

What an amazing read.

Indeed.


I'd like to thank everyone for their help and comments. Don't stop!

So a "box" can run by either latitude or longitude I guess ?

 

[123tim]

458.8 x 2 = 917.6 miles per 2 degree slot.
Neal

Thanks for the correction.

 

[No Strings]

Indeed.
I'd like to thank everyone for their help and comments. Don't stop!
So a "box" can run by either latitude or longitude I guess ?

The box is both. Like a square in the sky. Each controller has different standards that it tries to keep (I would imagine) depending on the type spacecraft, fuel comsumption, ect.

Neal

 

[goaliebob99]

Contrast that 22 THOUSAND miles with the roughly 220 miles from Earth that the International Space Station orbits within.

That makes you wonder if anyone has lost satellite signal as the ISS crosses paths with the sat signal ?

 

[Katrinasucks]

That makes you wonder if anyone has lost satellite signal as the ISS crosses paths with the sat signal ?

I dunno, but I live about 8 miles from an airport and when the big jets fly off the east runway, I lose the signal for a second. I must be just in the right spot.

 

[Katrinasucks]

BTW Tim, Here is a site with a 3D model of all the sats

http://science.nasa.gov/Realtime/JTrack/3D/JTrack3D.html

NORAD had a great site too with everything listed that is orbiting the earth including space junk. (There is a wrench up there that as I recall has been orbiting since like the late 70's.) My memory is fuzzy and I can't find it in my 10,000 bookmarks I've acquired over the years.

Maybe I'll try to google it up.

 

[Tron]

That makes you wonder if anyone has lost satellite signal as the ISS crosses paths with the sat signal ?

That's a good question. I would think that, with the relative speed of the ISS versus the geosynchronous-orbiting communications satellites, that it would be like a mosquito flying across the surface of your dish