vip 612 install

[EdB_4721]

I am a novice at this so please bear with me.

I bought a vip 612. I have a dish 500 with a quad lnb and, when I got HD another dish was added I asssume to get the hd signal. I am having problems getting the 612 to work. I am dropping signals from the satellites. I get 61.5, 110 and 119, but not all at the same time.

I got a separator with the receiver, however since the quad is older I would say it was from 2002 I do not believe DPP switch to be compatible with the separator. In any event the receiver won't work with the separator.

I do have a spare coax coming from the quad. From a receiver we do not use any more. I tried hooking one to both the sat inputs on the receive but I get a message that I am aimed at two different satelllites. When I unhook one cable the receiver works, but then I lose signal. From one of the three sats. Any help would be apppreciated.

Ed.

 

[KE4EST]

What model number is on the switch?

 

[EdB_4721]

I am not sure. The Info screen says somethiong about an sw 21.

 

[webbydude]

More than likely you have Legacy LNBs. Your best would be to upgrade to DP+ technology (DP+ twin for 110/119...DP dual for 61.5). If that's not possible, you may want to consider using the Legacy quad with a pair of SW21s and a Legacy dual (you won't need to use a separator, but it *will* need two feeds feeding Tuner 1 and Tuner 2)

 

[EdB_4721]

What model number is on the switch?

Sorry. I just got home the switch is and SW21-3SAT.

 

[EdB_4721]

More than likely you have Legacy LNBs. Your best would be to upgrade to DP+ technology (DP+ twin for 110/119...DP dual for 61.5). If that's not possible, you may want to consider using the Legacy quad with a pair of SW21s and a Legacy dual (you won't need to use a separator, but it *will* need two feeds feeding Tuner 1 and Tuner 2)

I assume that installing the DPP stuff or the SW 21 will require climing on the roof. It looks like I will need a professional install and it will have to wait until the 3 feet of snow melts off the roof. Unless you have other ideas.

I also forgot to add that I have an HD receiver in a bedrooom that the DVR replaced in the living room. I only get the 110 and 119 Sats on that receiver.

 

[TheKrell]

As webbydude says, you would do best to upgrade your legacy LNBs to DishPro if not DishPro Plus equipment. But that requires a trip to the dishes. If you can get to all 6 cables coming down from your root, you might try hooking that up to a legacy SW64. At least I think that will take all your cables and give you all 3 sats on 4 tuners, which may or may not be in the same receiver.

 

[EdB_4721]

As webbydude says, you would do best to upgrade your legacy LNBs to DishPro if not DishPro Plus equipment. But that requires a trip to the dishes. If you can get to all 6 cables coming down from your root, you might try hooking that up to a legacy SW64. At least I think that will take all your cables and give you all 3 sats on 4 tuners, which may or may not be in the same receiver.

I have come to the conclusion that I will climb on the roof and install the pro plus equipment with a new switch. It appears the pro plus equipmnet is the answer.

More novice questions: I have two dishes on the roof one for the 119 and 110 sats and one for the 61.5 sats, right?

So I get a DPP twin for the 110 and 119 dish that currently has the quad on it and says 500 and a duo for the other dish? Then run everything into a new switch then back out again? I will have a "spare" cable because wre ae going from 4 receivers to 3 so I can hook the dvr up with the separator or two cables? What kind of switch? DPP 44?

The receiver in the bedroom that the vip 612 replaced is a vip 211.

I will wait for the thaw and your most generous responses before going forward.

Thanks for your patience.

Thank all of you fo the input so far.

Ed.

 

[TheKrell]

So I get a DPP twin for the 110 and 119 dish that currently has the quad on it and says 500 and a duo for the other dish? Then run everything into a new switch then back out again? I will have a "spare" cable because wre ae going from 4 receivers to 3 so I can hook the dvr up with the separator or two cables? What kind of switch? DPP44?

If you are going to feed 3 receivers, then you will need an external switch. The DPP twin has an input for a wing dish (your dish pointed at 61.5), and 2 DishPro Plus outputs. It all magically works, even for 2 dual-tuner receivers, via the twin's internal switch. But if you are going to hook up 3 receivers, the twin's internal DPP switch is an extra cost without any benefit. Some would say they don't work reliably when feeding an external switch.

Instead I would buy a DishPro dual for your wing dish and a DishPro twin for your main Dish 500. Take 3 cables and plug them into an external switch, either a DP34, a DPP33, or a DPP44. I ordered those switches by cost. The DP34 is the cheapest, but you will have to run a cable from the switch to each tuner. Your 612, for example, would need 2 cables. You don't mention what your other receivers are, but if even one more is a dual-tuner receiver, then a DP34 won't work since it only has 4 outputs. Buy the DPP33 instead. Since it's a "Plus" variety, it can feed dual-tuner receivers via a single cable and what's called a "separator" behind the receiver. The DPP33 can feed at most 3 receivers, so if you ever decide to add a 4th, you are again out of outputs and would need the DPP44.

In all cases, you want to remove your existing legacy LNBs and existing SW21's from the system, since they are incompatible with DishPro equipment.

 

[EdB_4721]

Instead I would buy a DishPro dual for your wing dish and a DishPro twin for your main Dish 500. Take 3 cables and plug them into an external switch, either a DP34, a DPP33, or a DPP44. . . .

Thank you so much. . . I think I am going to go with the 44 so I can add the fourth receiver when I get the basement remodeled. I am ordering now. Now all we need is a thaw here so I don't fall off the roof!



Ed.

 

[EdB_4721]

Instead I would buy a DishPro dual for your wing dish and a DishPro twin for your main Dish 500. Take 3 cables and plug them into an external switch, either a DP34, a DPP33, or a DPP44. I ordered those switches by cost. The DP34 is the cheapest, but you will have to run a cable from the switch to each tuner. Your 612, for example, would need 2 cables. You don't mention what your other receivers are, but if even one more is a dual-tuner receiver, then a DP34 won't work since it only has 4 outputs. Buy the DPP33 instead. Since it's a "Plus" variety, it can feed dual-tuner receivers via a single cable and what's called a "separator" behind the receiver. The DPP33 can feed at most 3 receivers, so if you ever decide to add a 4th, you are again out of outputs and would need the DPP44.

In all cases, you want to remove your existing legacy LNBs and existing SW21's from the system, since they are incompatible with DishPro equipment.

OK I got the DP dual and DP Twin LNB's and a DPP 44. I am going to install the DPP 44 in the basement where all of the cabling comes in, and it is dry. There is a power source there too, so I can plug in the 44. The cables all check out to be compatible with the 44 and equipment.

I have a legacy quad for 110/119 SATs, and a legacy dual (single?) for the 61.5. It LOOKS --we got another snow storm so I can't get up on the roof-- like the 61.5 and one of the cables form the quad goes into the switch to a cable that comes into the house and runs to the living room that HAD a vip 211 but now has a vip 612. The 211 is now in the master bedroom. I know I have to take the 21 switch out of the line.

Now for the novice part. I see the new DP dual has two outputs. The DP Twin also has two outputs. Do I take the cables form the Twin and Dual and run them to the SAT side of the DPP 44? And then run them out the other side to the receivers? I also believe that I will have to update the software on the receivers. Do I just go into the set up menu and "force" an update on each receiver?

The receivers I now have are vip the 612, and 211 and a DP 301. I may add another dual tuner or just another HD receiver in the basement for a total of 4 receivers.

Many thanks so far. The weather is breaking here, so I should get on the roof Saturday or Sunday.

Ed.

 

[TheKrell]

I see the new DP dual has two outputs. The DP Twin also has two outputs. Do I take the cables form the Twin and Dual and run them to the SAT side of the DPP 44? And then run them out the other side to the receivers? I also believe that I will have to update the software on the receivers. Do I just go into the set up menu and "force" an update on each receiver?

Money bags! (I never found the moulah for a DPP44...)

You need one cable per satellite location going from your new DP LNBs to your DPP44. This means that one of the cables going to your dual is superfluous. (I reused mine for an OTA antenna, rather than using a diplexer up on the roof.) All we really need is a DP "single", but I don't think they are made any more. Plus half of my dual went south during a time when I was re-cabling my attic. Drove me crazy trying to find why 61.5 disappeared until I moved the cable over to the other output of my dual.

Once you have your new LNBs and switch cabled up, you don't actually need new firmware for your receivers. But you will need to do a Check Switch to get each receiver to update the method they use to select each sat.

 

[EdB_4721]

Thanks, I learned a lot.

Money bags! (I never found the moulah for a DPP44...)

Thanks again, I get it now. 1 cable for each satellite. I learned a lot about satellite tv. I'll let you know when I get it running.

Ed.

 

[EdB_4721]

Money bags! (I never found the moulah for a DPP44...)

Krell: FYI I see E-Bay has 44s for $80, they say new. I went with Sadoun for everything.

Any harm in connecting my now, not needed, fourth roof cable to the dual to protect the output from the LNB and the cable end from the weather? I will not connect it to the 44.

 

[TheKrell]

I see E-Bay has 44s for $80, they say new.

I recently bought a new DPP33 for $34 including shipping. I think my DP34 was even cheaper than that, but I don't remember. I sometimes buy things I don't really need if they're only $20 or thereabouts. Then when I do need them, I don't have to buy in an emergency situation. When stuff is pushing $100, I don't do that.

Any harm in connecting my now, not needed, fourth roof cable to the dual to protect the output from the LNB and the cable end from the weather?

I think that's a good idea, although the LNB being inside the I (or Y) adapter, doesn't really "see" any weather to worry about.

 

[EdB_4721]

Money bags! (I never found the moulah for a DPP44...)

You need one cable per satellite location going from your new DP LNBs to your DPP44. . . .quote]


Okay I got everything up. Did the check switch and everything LOOKS good on each receiver. Problem: It is bright and sunny here and the signal strength on 119 is low 10-15 and 110 is lower too like 30-35. I keep dropping 119 channels. I suspect I may need to realign the twin. I have a meter. My question is, since they are both on the same dish, which side of the twin would I hook the meter to 119 or 110?

 

[HIFI]

119

 

[EdB_4721]

119

Thanks. Is it unusual for a satellite signal to degrade when the sun comes up? I've noticed that in the morning I get 119 and 110 in the 40-50 range then it drops to the 10's (for 119) to the 20'6-30's for the 110? Is this because of the way the dish is oriented and the earth is turning in relation to the sats.? Or does it indicate some other porblem. Even with the weaker 119 signals (around 11) the check switch is ok and verified reception. I just can't lock on the channels.

Thank you all.

Ed.

 

[TheKrell]

Thanks. Is it unusual for a satellite signal to degrade when the sun comes up? I've noticed that in the morning I get 119 and 110 in the 40-50 range then it drops to the 10's (for 119) to the 20'6-30's for the 110? Is this because of the way the dish is oriented and the earth is turning in relation to the sats.? Or does it indicate some other porblem.

I have never even heard of that problem; I certainly haven't seen it happen on my setup. My wag is something is heating up and expanding or warping, causing the dish to go out of alignment during the day.

How tall is your mast? Is it stayed? What is it mounted to?

 

[EdB_4721]

I have never even heard of that problem; I certainly haven't seen it happen on my setup. My wag is something is heating up and expanding or warping, causing the dish to go out of alignment during the day.

How tall is your mast? Is it stayed? What is it mounted to?

The mast is the standard one that came with the 500 I would say its about 3 feet tall. It is not stayed. It is lag bolted to the roof. I suspect an alignment problem because I never had the problem before installing the new twin. I didn't touch anything as far as adjusting the dish. I just swapped out the DP twin for the Legacy Quad.

Could it be that disturbing the now 6-7 year old coax may have caused a problem?