Wasted Bandwidth

[BarryO]

Waste of BW: shopping channels. Also, too many PPV channels: with DVR technology, you need at most 1 or 2.

Locals used to be a huge BW waste; not no so much now with spotbeam technology. And Charlie had to do it to get cable customers.

I don't think the ESPN's are a waste of BW, even though I never watch them and I've never understood why I was supposed to care about the athletic activities of total strangers. But I'll acknowledge that alot of people do, and I'll agree with people like Noam Chomsky that big-time team sports serve a significant purpose in society, acting as a modern-day "opiate of the masses"; giving John Q. Public something to be passionate about that's basically meaningless (and diverting him from looking too much into what the Power That Be are up to). I just resent the ESPN's high rates being part of my Dish bill. If ESPN wants to charge that much, it should be broken out as a premium tier.

 

[Bobby]

Okay lets get this thread back on track.

First: The shopping/ppv/interactive/bingo channels are in theory a source of money for dish. So taking them away isn't an option.

I definatly think that ESPNHD is "wasting" a lot of bandwidth because it is upconverted so often. I have no problem with it if they are playing real HD. But somehow ESPN needs to be pressured into getting some real HD content.

Also it looks like the HD Demo channel is being removed. When I called about getting it (just as another way to show of the HD TV) I was told it was not available anymore on 148 and would be leaving the other wing soon.

The demo channel was never available on 148, only on 61.5. With the HD channels, with the exception of CBS-HD, all HD is now on 110. It would make sense to get rid of the Demo channel entirely. HDNet is a very nice 24/7 demo channel.

ESPN-HD is gearing up now. They have an average of 4 events a week from now through March. They said, going in, that they would be upgrading along the way through Summer 2004 and then they would have much more HD content. I loved Sunday Night Football in HD, that for me makes it worth the bandwidth.

 

[BarryO]

It would make sense to get rid of the Demo channel entirely. HDNet is a very nice 24/7 demo channel.

"Bikini Destinations" is not a good choice to show off HDTV to your mother-in-law, or any female in general.

Has it been publically announced that the HD demo channel is going away? Don't the stores need it?

 

[MacKenzieIII]

The demo channel was never available on 148, only on 61.5. With the HD channels, with the exception of CBS-HD, all HD is now on 110. It would make sense to get rid of the Demo channel entirely. HDNet is a very nice 24/7 demo channel.

ESPN-HD is gearing up now. They have an average of 4 events a week from now through March. They said, going in, that they would be upgrading along the way through Summer 2004 and then they would have much more HD content. I loved Sunday Night Football in HD, that for me makes it worth the bandwidth.

Ahh, I was under the impression it was on 148.

Hope you are right about ESPN-HD, I am not a big football watcher but right now they have US Soccer on. But it its just upconverted.

Also if we want to talk about "waste" I guess the CBSHD feeds that send upconverted stuff during most of the day is kinda a waste. But again hopefully in the next year they will start having more HD content.

 

[dfergie]

"congratulations you have a dish 500"

 

[Neutron]

I think the remote control help channel is wasted bandwidth as well.

 

[James Long]

Why not get rid of the international channels because of the demographic of the average lawn cutter too?

Internationals are not "wasting bandwidth" as much. They are tucked off to the sides on 61.5 and 148 or hidden on 121. And those birds have available space that is being wasted simply by not having any channel on them.

The key location to be "worried" about space being wasted is on 110/119 - Dish500. Those are the orbital slots nearly all E* customers see. (How many Dish300 @ 119 customers are left?) And suprise: Dish500 is where all the sports feeds are!

But now we are back on track let's look at the bandwidth waste. My prior answer still stands ("Any channel I don't watch"), but to be more specific: Any channel that isn't sold. Why are there any internal channels on Dish500?

There are currently 8 internal channels on 110, most could be put on wings or elsewhere. These channels are reported to be:
257 SPRKY E* "SPRKY" - The electrical power output in Wyoming. Wow.
258 INFO E* "INFO"
259 INFO9 E* "INFO9"
988 DISH6 E* Dish6 Showroom Promo
999 RTLR E* Retailer News
9905 DVR E* DVR Info (uplinked, but is it used?)
9950 RDRCT Info Card - Probably needs to stay
9983 ETC3 E* "ETC3" - Used for BingoTV

Retailers should have 61.5 dishes for the HD Demo ... why not put the other demo and internal stuff over there?

BTW: HDDemo is a good channel since all the content is approved for public display. Stuff on other channels is for "private in home viewing". And the content may suprise at times, as noted.

JL

 

[Smoky]

Channels 923 - 981 wasted bandwidth. By the way, I think 'Bikini Destinations" is an excellent use of bandwidth.

 

[dfergie]

Channels 923 - 981 wasted bandwidth. By the way, I think 'Bikini Destinations" is an excellent use of bandwidth.

If possible needs more bandwidth

 

[Tahoerob]

Take away ALL SPANISH channels off of the standard paks & add them to the wings as extra. This would give plenty of room for more HD.

 

[arachide]

I cast my votes for:

the music channels (just wondering does anyone listen to these?)
The "Superstations package"- can't get enough WB programming.
PPV- do we NEED that manychannels?
And do we really need that many Pr0n channels? (playboy,spice, extasy, etc?)

 

[dfergie]

Never listen to the music channels myself.

 

[BarryO]

Never listen to the music channels myself.

Yea, but audio takes up very little BW.

 

[James Long]

Yea, but audio takes up very little BW.

There are 32 stereo feeds and 30 mono feeds on 119. (None on 110.) If they moved all the audio to one transponder, it would fill it completely. As it stands, the music channels are taking up the left over space across many transponders - so the impact isn't as strong as it appears. Plus, just like the Shopping Channels, they have the distinction of being paid for by Musak. Musak uses the E* feeds to sell to businesses for their background music.

Here's another bandwidth waster for you: Multiple channels of the same PPV. Then again, sales are probably boosted by having the show start more often, just like multiple screens at the cinema.

JL

 

[wes55]

PPV where 4 channels have the same movie

 

[HDTV Rookie]

OK, someone please explain why we need so many news channels. Why 2 CSpans, Why CNBC & CNBC World, Same with CNN & CNNFN, and isn't Headline news owned by the same company that owns CNN.

What's up with the so called sports PPV channels in the 400 range, never seems to be anything on them. (well maybe anything I care for)

The Mens Channel, seems to never have anything on it when I am channel surfing, is it bad timing or just a bad channel

Now for the more poplular channels, I just can't seem to bring myself to watch anything on BBC, Bravo, Soapnet, or the Game Show Channel,



PS- didn't anyone learn from American Pie what happens at Band Camps.

 

[martincva]

Great "poll". Here's my list -- will Charlie listen?

Ok, first some comments, to keep the flames down

First, I don't know if and how much bandwidth the "Let's advertise DISH on a DISH channel so that DISH customers know that DISH is available if they want to sign up for DISH" channels take up. But if they are taking up anything, get rid of them. WE ALREADY HAVE DISH.

Second, I listed channels that I do not watch, and have never watched. I am not necessarily indicating that they are without merit, just that I have no interest in them. If enough people do want them, I have no problem with them staying on the air. Just like there are people who have no need for sports realize that a reasonable number of sports channels helps keep the subscription numbers up at the critical mass.

Third, education, religion and shop-at-home channels -- isn't one or two of these enough? I realize that they are free or no cost to Charlie, but they take up bandwidth (that is the point of this thread, isn't it?). I would rather have the channels empty than put in free junk that nobody watches. That way, there is clearly space for adding new "compelling" programming, instead of all of us wondering where it will fit.

Fourth, comments on individual channels or groups --

I see little need for all of the educational channels. We watch BYUTV on a regular basis. I think that we are not alone in this. What type of viewership is there for the other channels? If I were told that only 200 or 300 people had ever turned on BYUTV, I would expect it to go away. Any channel should face the same scrutiny. Maybe I am underestimating the viewership on the edu channels. If so, my apologies, and may they ever broadcast! But if not, see my third point (keep them empty).

I have great respect for those who provide or watch the religious channels. But do we need all of them? I have not spent much time watching them, but see the need for one or two. But we currently have 4. If the viewership of these channels is below a certain level (I don't have a specific number in mind), cut off the two that have the lowest viewership.

Music channels. Do we need 20 stereo and 20 mono? Get rid of half of them. We only listen to the Holiday Music channel during December. Other than that, we never listen to any of them. We would rather listen to our own CDs and get a much better sound. And do we need 2 different VH1 and 2 MTV channels? Isn't one of each enough?

There are a bunch of sports alternative channels. Get rid of them. If something is blacked out locally, do what the locals do. Watch Oprah.

Shopping channels. One or two is enough. My wife enjoys watching QVC. But she has never been able to stomach more than a few minutes on any one of the others. Get rid of most of these. Even if QVC is the lowest rated, get rid of it, and keep only the top one or two.

News channels. Not going to start a flame war over FOX vs. CNN vs. MSNBC. Keep them all. But do we really need CSPAN 2, or CNBCW? And I think that HNN has worn out its welcome. The other channels and the internet have made it irrelevant. Nobody keeps it on all day. And for quick update I would rather get on the web.

Science channels (oh boy). I am not necessarily for getting rid of all of them. We don't watch them, but can see the value. If there are enough viewers for each individual channel, keep it. But if there are some that do not have enough viewers, kick it out.

Childrens channels -- same question, do we need all of them? Aren't there enough. And yet I see posts on this forum that want even more! I think we have at least 4 or 5 too many. Let the ratings decide.

Sports -- Although I am sports junkie, I think that there are some that could go. Get rid of 2 or three (plus the alternates). Clean out the non-watched channels to make more room for HD.

Enterntainment -- I have no problem with any of these, but we just don't watch them. If we are in the minority, keep the channel. If nobody else is watching it either, get rid of it. These are going to be purely subjective, and each is so different, that I am not claiming that they are redundant like the religious or shopping channels. As above, let the ratings decide.

OK, here is my list. A total of 90 channels. We could fit some "compelling" new stuff on these spaces.


System
9900 - D500
103 - ONPPV

BTV
9612 - BTV
9611 - BTV
9602 - BTV
9601 - BTV

Education
9415 - FSTV
9412 - UCTV
9411 - NAUHS
9410 - LINK
9409 - RFDTV
9408 - DSTAR
9407 - COLRS
9404 - UWTV
9402 - PBS-U
9401 - HITN
9400 - RSRCH

Mono music
923 : 946 - AUD01 : AUD19

Sports alternates
448 - ALT4
447 - ALT3
446 - ALT2
445 - ALT1

Religious channels
264 - WISDM
262 - ANGEL
261 - EWTN
260 - TBN

Shopping channels
229 - ISHOP
228 - SHNBC
227 - ACN
225 - TBFC
224 - SAH
223 - HLC
222 - HSN
221 - STUFF
219 - MALL
218 - MENS

News
212 - CSPN2
207 - CNBCW
202 - HNN

Science
195 - DWINGS
194 - DHOME
193 - SCIEN
192 - DTIME
191 - TECH
190 - RLTY
189 - DHLTH

Junk (?)
188 - SOAP

Childrens programming
179 - DKIDS
177 - NICKG
175 - BOOM
169 - NOGIN
167 - GAC

Music
163 - VH1CL
161 - MTV2
158 - FUSE

Sports
151 - OLN
149 - FOXWD
146 - ESPN2A
145 - ESPNA
139 - DSTOP

Entertainment
135 - BBC
133 - FOXMO
132 - TCM
131 - IFC
128 - WE
124 - BET
121 - HISTI
115 - STYLE
114 - E!
112 - HGTV
111 - DIY
110 - FOOD


Remember, I am not saying that all of these are useless or unneeded. Just that these are satellite channels that we have never watched. If they went away, we would not cry. But if there are many others that do, I am happy to support their desire to keep it on the air.

- martincva

 

[Mr Tony]

There are a bunch of sports alternative channels. Get rid of them. If something is blacked out locally, do what the locals do. Watch Oprah.

The sports alternate channels are when more than one sports team is on a RSN. Another is when a RSN covers more than on state. Perfect example is FSN N (436)..It covers both MN & WI. MN can see only MN sports (Wolves, Wild, and up until the end of last year, the Twins). WI can only see the Bucks & Brewers. When the Bucks & Brewers are on FSN, they are on Sports Alt 2 (446). The main channel (436) has whatever is on in MN.

Education
9415 - FSTV
9412 - UCTV
9411 - NAUHS
9410 - LINK
9409 - RFDTV
9408 - DSTAR
9407 - COLRS
9404 - UWTV
9402 - PBS-U
9401 - HITN
9400 - RSRCH

These are FCC mandated Public Interest channels. Each provider has to set a specific amount of channels aside for PI channels.

Mono music
923 : 946 - AUD01 : AUD19

agreed on these...

Shopping channels
229 - ISHOP
228 - SHNBC
227 - ACN
225 - TBFC
224 - SAH
223 - HLC
222 - HSN
221 - STUFF
219 - MALL
218 - MENS

These stations pay to get their programming on Dish...also helps keep our bill down

Music
167-GAC
163 - VH1CL
161 - MTV2
158 - FUSE

I personally like GAC (for the Grand Ole Opry) and VH1CL (although MuchMoreRetro on ExpressVu blows this channel out the door). MTV2 for the Headbangers Ball (boy there's a clash..Headbangers ball & Grand Ole Opry)

 

[video62]

They're not going to be able to kill off the mono audio channels... that's what feeds the Muzak service to stores, restaurants, businesses, etc. Again, audio takes up very little bandwidth.

Also, channels with just a mere stationary logo screen (i.e the Dish logo or the Dish 500 screen) don't take up much bandwidth either.

 

[mattb]

Also, channels with just a mere stationary logo screen (i.e the Dish logo or the Dish 500 screen) don't take up much bandwidth either.

I remeber reading at one point the channels with the Dish Logo are static-assigned meaning they take up pretty much Zero bandwidth, the music you hear is a redirected Muszak channel or Dish CD channel.

I could be wrong though