which codecs can handle 4:2:2

[bid0n]

Hi folks,

which codecs exactly can handle 4:2:2?

I've been experimenting with elecard on my ss2 usb, can't seem to get around to watch anything.

Is there any other codecs, like nvidia purevideo, cyberlink, etc?

Another question would be, is there any 4:2:2 being used in HD? whether mpeg2 or mpeg4, and if so, which codecs would be capable of doing this?

I've recently realized my elecard codec gets unbearably jerky on my ss2 pci on mpeg2 1080i. Isn't elecard supposed to properly decode mpeg2 HD?

Thanks a lot

 

[jerryt]

Hi folks,

which codecs exactly can handle 4:2:2?

I've been experimenting with elecard on my ss2 usb, can't seem to get around to watch anything.

Is there any other codecs, like nvidia purevideo, cyberlink, etc?

Another question would be, is there any 4:2:2 being used in HD? whether mpeg2 or mpeg4, and if so, which codecs would be capable of doing this?

I've recently realized my elecard codec gets unbearably jerky on my ss2 pci on mpeg2 1080i. Isn't elecard supposed to properly decode mpeg2 HD?

Thanks a lot

Elecard is the only that I know works.

 

[bid0n]

Hi jerryt, hows your diseqc swichting/motor going these days?

Thanks for the reply mate.

So is elecard meant to do mpeg2@1080i? it's very jerky on my setup. I'm using the version that came bundled with progdvb.

All you folks out there use elecard on HD?
It may sound like a daft question but i can't find any info on this.

I do have a great setup - core2duo E6600, it's rock stable on H.264...

 

[jerryt]

Hi jerryt, hows your diseqc swichting/motor going these days?

Thanks for the reply mate.

So is elecard meant to do mpeg2@1080i? it's very jerky on my setup. I'm using the version that came bundled with progdvb.

All you folks out there use elecard on HD?
It may sound like a daft question but i can't find any info on this.

I do have a great setup - core2duo E6600, it's rock stable on H.264...

NBC on 103? I will have to try later, but it was working smoothly before.

Switches and motor all working well, thanks for asking!!

 

[mark_calgary]

I abandoned progdvb a long time ago as it had too many issues with stability on my system and the user interface drove me up the wall. I've seen the jerkiness you describe with elecard on progdvb but, to be honest, once in a while I've also seen the same using elecard with DVBDream.

My most stable application is DVBViewer (not free) which is what I use if I'm going to record something and want to be confident it won't crash in the middle of the night.

Elecard has no issues with HD or even 4:2:2 HD on my system (Athlon64 X2 4600) even using just one processor core.

Have you tried VLC for 4:2:2 material? If you set progdvb to unicast stream to 127.0.0.1 port 1234(or what ever unused open port you want) you can open it locally with VLC. I do this sometimes with DVBDream especially when elecard has issues. On a high end system like a core2 or A64 X2 you can even use very processor intensive deinterlacing algorithms in VLC like "bob" for a truly outstanding picture.

 

[bid0n]

Really? i always thought vlc gave *really* crappy deinterlacing... no way i can compare it to purevideo or the latest cyberlink purevideo-accelerated deinterlacing...

 

[mark_calgary]

Looks good to me but I'm not into playing around with the latest and greatest decoders. Plus I'm mostly using the swiss army knife called TSReader+VLC.

Maybe we need to start a thread with comparisons of different decoders on the same source with links to images.

 

[bid0n]

Yes that might be a great idea. I'm used to purevideo's spatial-temporal deinterlacing hardware accelerated and VLC sure looks disgusting to me...

Doesn't Tsreader use an internal player of its own where you can choose codecs, graph filters, etc? do you really need vlc to be able to watch something using tsreader?

Do you do any tweaking on VLC or just you use it "out the box"+ choose your Bob deinterlacing for watching video?

I tried grabbing a screenshot of vlc but image doesn't show up...

 

[mark_calgary]

Yes that might be a great idea. I'm used to purevideo's spatial-temporal deinterlacing hardware accelerated and VLC sure looks disgusting to me...

Doesn't Tsreader use an internal player of its own where you can choose codecs, graph filters, etc? do you really need vlc to be able to watch something using tsreader?

Do you do any tweaking on VLC or just you use it "out the box"+ choose your Bob deinterlacing for watching video?

I tried grabbing a screenshot of vlc but image doesn't show up...

I'll have to give purevideo a look again as it is installed on my machine. I played with it a little months ago but I wasn't doing a video quality comparison at the time. Mostly I was looking at CPU usage (this was before I upgraded my processor) on 4:2:2 HD and someone (incorrectly I believe) suggested it worked for 4:2:2.

TSReader does not display video on its own. It does decode a single frame of each video channel in the stream. You must send the stream to an external application like VLC or to local or networked hardware.

I like VLC as it is easy to use and allows me to easily transcode video to sizes, bitrates, and formats that the slower computers in my house don't choke on so I can watch from wherever I am working.

I'll try and do a side by side comparison since I can use DVBDream to display using DirectShow and also stream locally to VLC simultaneously.

Perhaps everything looks good to me compared to the muddy HD that comes from my cable provider.

 

[bid0n]

I'll have to give purevideo a look again as it is installed on my machine. I played with it a little months ago but I wasn't doing a video quality comparison at the time. Mostly I was looking at CPU usage (this was before I upgraded my processor) on 4:2:2 HD and someone (incorrectly I believe) suggested it worked for 4:2:2.

I think you should, i reckon it's the most interesting stuff on the mpeg2 side. I'd like to compare it to ati's avivo but i can't get hold of an avivo video card.
I'd love it to work for 4:2:2 but i reckon it doesn't, but as i said, this is new stuff for me so i can't really tell...
Btw, cyberlink 6 and 7 work with the purevideo VPU chip the same way as the nvidia purevideo codec IMO.

TSReader does not display video on its own. It does decode a single frame of each video channel in the stream. You must send the stream to an external application like VLC or to local or networked hardware.
I like VLC as it is easy to use and allows me to easily transcode video to sizes, bitrates, and formats that the slower computers in my house don't choke on so I can watch from wherever I am working.

I understand this, but i have no use for its streaming capabilities. I just use a local pc to watch telly... i can't get around to watch anything with vlc, it just does my head in! the deinterlacing looks really bad to me.

I'll try and do a side by side comparison since I can use DVBDream to display using DirectShow and also stream locally to VLC simultaneously.

I should get around to do that too, just need to find out how to get a screenshot of vlc!

Perhaps everything looks good to me compared to the muddy HD that comes from my cable provider.

 

[dashaund]

I guess I'm the one that incorrectly said that PureVideo decodes 4:2:2. Well, it seems to work for me. When I load up a 4:2:2NBC feed on AMC1 in DVBDream, it doesn't give me any errors (the codec doesn't turn red), and plays fine. It doesn't accelerate it, no, but it still plays. CPU usage is comparable to, say, Elecard. I'm having trouble with smoothness. The only renderer that plays perfectly smooth is VMR. VMR9, Overlay, and Generic seem jerky...but CPU usage is the same across the board. This occurs regardless of decoder or H.264 codec. Is this the case with anyone else here? VMR9's picture quality is preferred, however it's not smooth, so I'll take the smoothness instead. 4:2:2 HD with anything over 20Mbps stiffles my processor, so, not much I can say there. Trying to keep CPU cycles down with good PQ is a headache to say the least. What else are you guys using?

 

[bid0n]

I guess I'm the one that incorrectly said that PureVideo decodes 4:2:2. Well, it seems to work for me. When I load up a 4:2:2NBC feed on AMC1 in DVBDream, it doesn't give me any errors (the codec doesn't turn red), and plays fine. It doesn't accelerate it, no, but it still plays. CPU usage is comparable to, say, Elecard. I'm having trouble with smoothness. The only renderer that plays perfectly smooth is VMR. VMR9, Overlay, and Generic seem jerky...

Hi Dashaund
Great, i'll have a go on that... next problem will be to find a 4:2:2 feed i can tune to in europe with my dish these days...

Btw, how can one tell if a broadcast is 4:2:2? is there any program that will clearly state that somewhere?

 

[bid0n]

Ah! just found one, i can see it with elecard. With purevideo and video render i get a pin error though... will try and quickly build a graph to check

edit: how the heck do you create graphs with altdvb?
dvbdream's jerky...

re edit:
well rolled back to a previous version of elecard and now alt-dvb can see my elecard codec. It's decoding 4:2:2 fine now. But still can't figure out how to get purevideo codec working on video render... are you sure about this dasaund?

 

[bid0n]

wow tsreader just crashed my computer this is not good man

edit:

now windows can't see my skystar 2 anymore!!!!

re:edit: after a 2 reboot, it's back and everything's ok. But i think i'll be careful next time i try using *****tsreader!!

 

[Trevorm7]

I get the same jerkyness with dvbdream, vmr and vmr9 make it better but the brightness and contrast are wrong. Strange thing is the jerkyness wasn't there until I hooked up my 37" 1080p monitor with dvi, previous was 17" crt @ 1280x960 75hz vga, now 37" lcd @ 1920x1080 60hz dvi. What the problem is I think is the 60hz refresh rate because I already tried different resolutions.

For 4:2:2 use ffdshow and set deinterlacing to bob, I am disgusted with elecards (mainconcept right?) blocky looking red colors.

Purevideo seems to have the best pq with generic renderer, overlay seems to look a little softer.

 

[dashaund]

Yes I'm sure. Hmmm...not sure about the PIN error. I'm guessing that's the same thing as it is here on the NBC 4:2:2 feeds on AMC 1 where it asks for a PIN number...like it's encrypted or something. But, it does that on every codec with me, not just Purevideo. Trevorm7, you're seeing the exact same results I am. Purevideo does look a lot better. Wish I could use FFDshow. What CPU and graphics card do you use? I'm considering diving in for the E6600, which is one of the new Intel Dual Core 2 chips. My 3400+ just can't keep up with the 4:2:2 HD stuff. SD and 4:2:0 HD it does okay ONLY with Purevideo. I sorta have my hands tied, ya know? Don't like that. But it's gonna cost me over $400 for the chip and a new board, and I'm debating about whether it's worth it.

 

[bid0n]

Yes I'm sure. Hmmm...not sure about the PIN error. I'm guessing that's the same thing as it is here on the NBC 4:2:2 feeds on AMC 1 where it asks for a PIN number...like it's encrypted or something. But, it does that on every codec with me, not just Purevideo. Trevorm7, you're seeing the exact same results I am. Purevideo does look a lot better. Wish I could use FFDshow. What CPU and graphics card do you use? I'm considering diving in for the E6600, which is one of the new Intel Dual Core 2 chips. My 3400+ just can't keep up with the 4:2:2 HD stuff. SD and 4:2:0 HD it does okay ONLY with Purevideo. I sorta have my hands tied, ya know? Don't like that. But it's gonna cost me over $400 for the chip and a new board, and I'm debating about whether it's worth it.

The pin connect error's a graph file thing, 's got nothing to do with encryption actually. I don't understand why you would get no image at all on purevideo with any render other than video render... I mean, elecard, it'll display the image whether it's vmr9, overlay, etc. I need to get this working to understand what's going on!! If anyone knows how to build graph files that work with alt-dvb then i'll be able to give it a go

Regarding your upgrade, mate, you could always consider getting an X2 for your platform. Are you on s939? If so, then you'd only need to swap your cpu. Though i strongly suggest getting 1 or 2GB ram.
Have you never gotten into o/c? you could boost your machine to quite some interesting gain, probably.
I had the same trouble over a month ago, when i first started to get into the HD reception (HD for me rhymes with H.264) and there was NO WAY i could get that going on my 3200+ My original idea was to get an X2, but then i just realised that a core 2 duo was much more interesting... and that i could probably sell my mobo+cpu+ddr atm which i did
Not regretting the swap, not a bit

 

[mark_calgary]

The pin connect error's a graph file thing, 's got nothing to do with encryption actually. I don't understand why you would get no image at all on purevideo with any render other than video render... I mean, elecard, it'll display the image whether it's vmr9, overlay, etc.

Regarding your upgrade, mate, you could always consider getting an X2 for your platform. Are you on s939? If so, then you'd only need to swap your cpu. Though i strongly suggest getting 1 or 2GB ram.

I've had issues using elecard once in a while where it would only display using VMR9 rendering (and crash minutes later), other times it would operate in any rendering mode, yet another time I required the Nvidia post processor to be used as well. I'm not an expert on graphs so was a bit lost on why. Certainly something I did screwed it up. At the moment it is all working well.

A month ago I upgraded from a A64 3200 to an X2 4600 on a 939 board. A very simple procedure. If I was to change motherboards I would go for a core2 duo as well. But the X2 has been well worth it. 4:2:2 HD doesn't tax the machine at all. I'd love to try H.264 but haven't got a source for one yet. Perhaps I'll find a test file somewhere.

One thing to remember is that some decoders are single threaded and won't use the second CPU so, in the case of something like my X2 4600, it may work like a single A64 3800.

 

[mastermesh]

You guys got the links to where you can download these programs? I just ordered my DVB World Box last night, so will probably need them in the near future. (Extra Happy Christmas to me from my wife!)

 

[bid0n]

which programs dude?