Wish list: If you could design the PERFECT low-cost FTA receiver, what would it include?

anik

SatelliteGuys Pro
Original poster
Aug 28, 2004
356
2
U.S.A.
After reading some of the recent threads about the benefits and drawbacks of certain receivers, I got to thinking that it might not be a bad idea to ask what the "perfect" next-generation FTA receiver might include. One way to think about that is, what does your current receiver NOT do (or do poorly) that you wish it did? Or, what feature do you most like about your current receiver that wasn't present on your previous receiver?

If we had some idea of what people find desirable, this would give us a base of comparison against new and existing receivers. But I'm realistically most interested in thinking about features that should be able to be added to a low cost (under $100) receiver. I think that in the coming years, any receiver costing over $100 is going to be kind of a hard sell unless it is a total package. A company that stands behind the receiver and that can speedily address bugs and add new features would tend to make a receiver more valuable in my mind, but only if they are open to suggestions by users and and not the type of developers that take the attitude that they'll only add the features that interest them, and screw everyone else.

But anyway, I'll start the list, so here are the features that I think receivers of the future should have as a minimum:

* A GIGABIT, or at very least, a 10/100 Ethernet connection (WiFi is optional; in most cases a wired connection is much more reliable). Some of the following requires being able to connect to a local network or the Internet.

* A clock that keeps time without having to be reset every week or two. If the receiver has an Internet connection, then it can use an Internet-based timeserver to reset the time once or twice a day.

* PVR functionality. And the PVR should be able to save recordings to either a locally-connected USB drive, or to a network share on the local network. If the receiver has a USB port and you connect a hard drive to it, the recordings on that drive should be accessible (for example as a SAMBA share on the network). A PVR that only saves to a USB connected device that is not accessible from the local network is something I'd personally never pay more than about $50 for (and only do that very reluctantly).

* FAST and ACCURATE blind scan. Like it or hate it, the X2 seems to be the "gold standard" for this right now.

* Support of as many of the existing formats as possible - definitely S2. And even if the receiver doesn't have enough computational power to play a 4:2:2 signal, it should at least be able to record it, though as faster processors become available, playing 4:2:2 should be a greater possibility. Also, it should have a decent tuner that receives those "edge case" signals that some receivers just can't quite seem to pull in.

* A web interface that can be accessed over the local network from a web browser, similar to the way many networked devices are configured nowadays. From this browser you should be able to change settings on the device (particularly the video output setting, so that if you manage to set that to something incompatible with your TV and your screen goes dark, you can fix it from the web interface), and you should be able to schedule PVR recordings or see what's already been scheduled. It would also be nice if there were a way to view online TV schedule services (such as TitanTV) and then select a program for recording, but I have no idea whether that is really feasible.

* RELIABLE DiSEqC switching, particularly when controlling a VBOX or any other positioner/controller.

* Desirable but I could live without it if it would significantly increase the cost: The ability to steam live signals to other computers/devices on the network.

* HDMI output, of course, but also SPDIF (TOSLINK) audio output (some of us do still have perfectly good older audio equipment). And it had better not downscale 1080p signals, or compress 5.1 channel audio down to stereo! I would rather have a receiver that does not have built-in video and audio outputs at all than degraded video or audio (I'd just watch the recordings using VLC or XBMC or some other software on a HTPC).

* And one thing to omit (and I know I'll probably get an argument on this, but hear me out): The serial port. The problem with these is that very few newer computers even have a serial port anymore - they sort of died with dial-up modems - and anything that used to be done using a serial port should be able to be done via the ethernet connection. And that serial port takes up space on the back panel that could be taken over by other types of I/O that are more widely used nowadays. For the true hardware guys that feel they need a serial port connection, that could always be provided using a set of pins (similar to the GPIO pins on a Raspberry Pi) and an accessory serial port connector, or for that matter perhaps a USB to serial port converter. But a serial port is like a fax machine; they sort of refuse to die even though by all rights they should, because they have outlived their usefulness.

I'll stop there; if I thought about it longer I could probably come up with a few more things, but I realize the <$100 "sweet spot" price does not allow throwing in everything but the kitchen sink (though as CPU processing power improves I certainly expect that sooner rather than later, nearly everything I have suggested would be doable at that price point. Moore's Law and all that).

As for those manufacturers that want to cater to high-end customers, all I can say is, get ready for 4K and 8K (as demonstrated at CES 2014). That's how you'll sell your >$200 receivers in the future, by supporting the latest and greatest video formats. Of course, there will need to be ultra high def content on the birds first!
 
If it plays media files from a network server, it should play all popular codecs and read SMB/CIFS shares, **NOT** just be a DLNA client that requires specialized software on the server. I don't need any software to organize my media library for me, I already have it the way I want it, and I don't want to burn power transcoding things that any modern device has the power to play.
 
Designed and built in the US or in some other trusted non 3rd world country. Also built with first rate components and above minimum heatsinks.

An all original remote design with larger buttons that all function correctly.

A compartment to install a 2.5 inch hard drive inside the case.

A rectangular case that is stackable with other tv boxes.

Two USB ports so one can be used for a flash drive and the other for wifi connection.

Support open source playback and recording standards.

Limited and advanced user mode menu functions to support all levels of customer experience.

Support for some online streaming services.

A clock that works and does not drift.

A front display that can show time, recording status or channel name.

No obscene bright blue or red LEDs.

Ability to handle all audio standards and play them back through TV without needing an outside converter.
 
The more I think about it, the more I'm considering a Linux desktop converted for media use. That way, all the codecs could be easily updated without fearing whatever distro I'm using will go extinct. I also understand Netflix is going to HTML5 instead of Silverlight, which should eventually make Netflix compatible with Linux. I have to say that I've only used SD televisions to hook up computers before, and the picture quality is much worse when compared to a stand alone STB with RCA plugs. I'm not sure why the quality is that much more degraded. Maybe with HDMI connections, there is no difference. As I don't have anything but an SD TV right now, I'll keep that project on hold :(
 
Designed and built in the US or in some other trusted non 3rd world country. Also built with first rate components and above minimum heatsinks.

An all original remote design with larger buttons that all function correctly.

A compartment to install a 2.5 inch hard drive inside the case.

A rectangular case that is stackable with other tv boxes.

Two USB ports so one can be used for a flash drive and the other for wifi connection.

Support open source playback and recording standards.

Limited and advanced user mode menu functions to support all levels of customer experience.

Support for some online streaming services.

A clock that works and does not drift.

A front display that can show time, recording status or channel name.

No obscene bright blue or red LEDs.

Ability to handle all audio standards and play them back through TV without needing an outside converter.





quality.jpg :D
 
USB 3.0 ports.

USB ports should be able to power a harddrive (some have complained about this, doesn't affect me).

4:2:2 because it's here to stay. For now.

Adjustable lip sync presets for certain fussy channels.

Flamethrower remote control that plain flat out works.

Blind scan results that are clickable to watch and/or sort right then and there.
 
I would like to see a couple of improvments over my existing hardware:
-gigibyte ethernet or better (for broadcasting HD over the LAN)
-4:2:2 Mpeg 4
-16 and 32 PSK demod (maybe 64APSK if that is being used already)
-DVB S3 (likely coming soon to N.A.)
-ability to record ANYHING the receiver can process
-web interface (as ANIK described above for remote access to program sked, etc)
-really good ATSC receiver (recordable)
-Lots of extra processing power and memory, expandable.
-dual satellite receiver L-band inputs

Yes I am aware I am describing a HTPC system pretty much... Of course these are "wants" not "needs"; and my list will not likely be turned into reality any time soon. Progress is enevitable but sometimes slow...
I am quite satisfied with the AzBox and uHD receivers I have. I would need a really good reason to upgrade and nothing I have seen lately would make much difference or improve on what I have now. The lack of ISP bandwidth at my location truncates any need for streaming capabilities other than what would be contained within my LAN only.

-C.
 
Dual tuner!, 30 second skip on dvr'ed programs, and DOESN'T throw you out of a recording you are watching when a live timer recording kicks off or shuts down after recording. It would also be nice if it auto-marks a recording if you exit it, so it automatically starts there when you start to watch it again.
 
An AZplus is pretty close to top dog in many areas.It already has a true dual tuner,internal 3.5 HD capability,streaming is a pain but works ( needs improvement )..Transfering recordings from 1 AZ to another is easy thru the network using MAZ.

Making it the best ( which it already is imo ) could only be topped by adding an OTA tuner,H:264 4:2:2,16APSK,32APSK.

That being said would make an expensive box..Don`t see that happnin..:D

EDIT: I see cham was reading my mind.
 
I would like a box like the MicroHD but add to it Networking and support for common services such as Netflix, Amazon, Hulu, Vudu, TuneIn etc...

I would also add streaming support so you can watch FTA and recorded events on other DLNA enabled TV's in your house.

Oh and the box needs to support 4:2:2 so I can stop feeling inadequate. :D
 
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Lots of great suggestions here.

All that for $100 IMO is a pipe dream. $300 it should be doable

I'll add open source to the list.

I almost added "runs Linux" to my list but didn't really want to limit it in that way, and besides, the problem with running an operating system such as Linux is that there are invariably upgrades that sometimes break existing functionality. You can always take the approach that "if it ain't broke don't fix it" and not apply Linux updates, but then you miss out on security upgrades that might keep your box secure. The good part about running Linux would be that it would be a lot easier to add various network functions that one might need. For example, if you feel you need FTP access for some odd reason, it's easy to install a FTP server in Linux, but nearly impossible in a "closed" system.

I'm curious, though, as to which of these suggestions you think would necessarily be so costly to implement? Much of what has been suggested can be implemented in software, and if you are running Linux as the base system, then things like CIFS/SAMBA file sharing are either "baked into" the operating system, or can be easily added from a repository, usually for free. The only suggestion I have seen that I think might drive up costs is that it be made in the USA or some other first world country, and I don't know how much that would add to the costs. Personally I would prefer it not be made in China (at least not to China's usual quality standards) ;) but I would not mind if it were made in Japan or someplace like that (although nowadays I suppose Japan qualifies as being "first world"). But what I might have added to my list, had I thought about it, is:

Uses high quality capacitors that don't have a history of leaking, exploding, or changing value!

(I can tell you from experience that there is nothing quite like being awakened from a sound sleep by the loud bang of a capacitor committing harakiri, followed a few seconds later by the unmistakable stench that makes you think for a moment you are in the middle of a poison gas attack!) :eek:
 
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I wonder where the R&D money will come to create this Utopian device? The big players Dish and Direct, spend millions on receiver design and do they ever get it right? ;) Even with unlimited resource, can you actually make this work? Don't mind me.. I'm just pipe dreaming ;)
 
gigabit ethernet, dual tuner, plus atsc, 4:2:2, quality built for around $100...

When I was big in to mountain biking we used to have a saying,

cheap, light, strong, pick any two. Anyone that claims their selling all three are lying. I think with FTA we could easily replace light with feature packed. cheap, feature packed, and quality, pick any two, your not getting all three. There is always compromises in life.

UDL
 
Lots of good FTA receiver feature ideas in here. While many of these are already or soon will be implemented in upcoming AzBox miniMe American Edition firmware updates, I did add a few ideas from this thread on our internal ER (Enhancement Request) list. This is the first step in having new features implemented by our development team.

As always, we will give proper credit in our firmware release notes for any requests which comes from SatelliteGuys.US members. Please keep the good ideas coming and our North American development team will try their best to implement as many feature requests as possible.
 
built-in dvd burner,instead of playing with usb drives all the time for storage

Unfortunately that would definitely add to the cost and I think the majority of users would never use such a thing (I know I wouldn't). However, if the receiver ran some form of Linux then you should be able to connect an external DVD burner via the USB port, and with the right added software (which may already be included in some versions of Linux), burn your files to that. Alternately, if you can save recordings to a network share, or access them from another computer on the network, then you could burn the files to DVD from any computer on the local network that has a DVD burner.

Now that you can buy 3 and 4 TB drives, I think most people prefer to use those for storage of big files. DVD's just don't give you the same "bang for your buck" that they did in the days when the largest available hard drives only held a few hundred GB.

If you are wondering what an external DVD drive is, it's simply an internal DVD burner plus a case + power supply kit from someplace like Newegg, Amazon, Monoprice, or eBay. In fact you don't even really need the case, that's just for aesthetics - you just need the power supply and an adapter cable that plugs into the back of the DVD burner (or a standard hard drive) and converts it to a USB drive (often those are sold together in a combination package).
 

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