Gas Price Info With National Gas Temperature Map
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dragon002 said:
dragon
E-85 is 85% ethanol, 15% gas
Gas in Minnesota is 10% ethanol year round (I think in winter some go to 15%) but E-85 can only be used in Flex Fuel vehicles (my 03 Ranger is) so I can run anywheres between all E-85 or all gas. To know if you have a FFV there is usually a leaf on the back of the vehicle, on the gas flap it says "this vehicle can take either unleaded gasoline or E-85 ethanol" and the 8th digit of your VIN is a V.
The E-85 is cheaper (45 cents per gallon sometimes) but you lose MPG (havent run a full tank to know how much I lose..they say betwen 2-10 mpg depending on age of vehicle. I am trying E-85 to see if its worth the difference (as long as I save money on the bottom line thats all I care)
We don't have Sonoco here. Very few citgo's etiher. Our big ones are
-Holiday (MN based company)
-SuperAmerica (also known as SuperGOUGEAmerica or SuperFRAUDAmerica) as they always are the first to jack up prices
-Kwik Trip
-Shell
-Conoco
-the rest are independents
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winter blend has more volatiles to help starting, summer less volatiles to lessen smog.
gasoline has changed a lot, put some in a bucket let sit in safe area, a week later a lot will still be there, years ago in my bike rebuilding days nearly all would evaporate.
today i use a little gasoline to clean bearings
gasoline has changed a lot, put some in a bucket let sit in safe area, a week later a lot will still be there, years ago in my bike rebuilding days nearly all would evaporate.
today i use a little gasoline to clean bearings
The figure I've heard through real world reports was approximately 20% loss in fuel economy with e85. I don't know if this was a "scientific" study or if it was just guess as to the actual numbers. If it really was a 20% loss in econonmy, there goes your $.45/gallon savings.Iceberg said:The E-85 is cheaper (45 cents per gallon sometimes) but you lose MPG (havent run a full tank to know how much I lose..they say betwen 2-10 mpg depending on age of vehicle. I am trying E-85 to see if its worth the difference (as long as I save money on the bottom line thats all I care)
cdru
I've heard everything from 10%-more than 30% depending on vehicle
The first tank I ran of straight E-85 (and they say disreagrd 1st tank) I was at 18 mpg..truck gets 20 mpg on gas
so
320/20=16 gallons times 2.55=40.80 for tank of gas
288/18=16 gallons times 2.10=33.60 for tank of E-85
I'm on tank 2 so we'll see what that comes out to when it gets low
I've heard everything from 10%-more than 30% depending on vehicle
The first tank I ran of straight E-85 (and they say disreagrd 1st tank) I was at 18 mpg..truck gets 20 mpg on gas
so
320/20=16 gallons times 2.55=40.80 for tank of gas
288/18=16 gallons times 2.10=33.60 for tank of E-85
I'm on tank 2 so we'll see what that comes out to when it gets low
Just went up to $3.25 for premium here in So Cal. Thinking about trading my BMW for a Prius.....
Iceberg said:dragon
E-85 is 85% ethanol, 15% gas
Gas in Minnesota is 10% ethanol year round (I think in winter some go to 15%) but E-85 can only be used in Flex Fuel vehicles (my 03 Ranger is) so I can run anywheres between all E-85 or all gas. To know if you have a FFV there is usually a leaf on the back of the vehicle, on the gas flap it says "this vehicle can take either unleaded gasoline or E-85 ethanol" and the 8th digit of your VIN is a V.
The E-85 is cheaper (45 cents per gallon sometimes) but you lose MPG (havent run a full tank to know how much I lose..they say betwen 2-10 mpg depending on age of vehicle. I am trying E-85 to see if its worth the difference (as long as I save money on the bottom line thats all I care)
We don't have Sonoco here. Very few citgo's etiher. Our big ones are
-Holiday (MN based company)
-SuperAmerica (also known as SuperGOUGEAmerica or SuperFRAUDAmerica) as they always are the first to jack up prices
-Kwik Trip
-Shell
-Conoco
-the rest are independents
thanks berg,
my '02 ranger supercab has the leaf on the tailgate.
then it could run E-85 if it wanted too
sadly, they are shutting down the Ford plant here in St Paul that made the winter Rangers (the ones for the cold weather states)
sadly, they are shutting down the Ford plant here in St Paul that made the winter Rangers (the ones for the cold weather states)
Well, we are finally getting to go on a short vacation to San Francisco in June, and we WERE going to take our "new to us" small truck.....but now that gas prices are soaring we are going to take our older little car that gets 36mpg. Bummer too, because the truck is much newer, has a CD player and great cup holders ).
).
NOTE for anyone considering a hybrid!
The cost of the vehicle is so much more you will never recoop the money. let alone replacing the battery bank, if you keep the vehicle a long time
prius and others are a marketers dream touchey feel good but really just extra profilt for the company
The cost of the vehicle is so much more you will never recoop the money. let alone replacing the battery bank, if you keep the vehicle a long time
prius and others are a marketers dream touchey feel good but really just extra profilt for the company
I can justify the addition 4k since I drive almost 120 a day. A coworker has been driving a Prius hybrid the past 18 months and loves it. I used to drive my V8 F-150, but I have been driving our spare car (my wife's old car get 26 mpg) for about a year after fuel prices went up. We're not in the market for another car, but I am seriously considering a Prius.
I'll be driving 78 miles round trip to work starting this evening and thru the weekend till Monday night in my V8 F150...4 trips, better than driving my old 4x4 (just grin and bear it)
(just grin and bear it)
Actually current hybrids are about break even---but as gas prices go higher that might change. The next generation of Lithium Ion hybrids will allegedly be able to "do more" even at highway speeds. Whish should increase the savings.
Not sure if this was posted already, but it goes into some nice detail on the rises.
Analysts and industry officials said occasional shortages are possible for another few weeks, though they emphasized that the problem has more to do with delivery schedules than a dearth of fuel. Empty pumps are not nearly as frequent as they were after Hurricane Katrina, which knocked out the electricity needed to run pipelines delivering fuel from the Gulf Coast to the rest of the country.
The supply hiccups have occurred as refiners stop using the gasoline additive methyl tertiary-butyl ether, or MTBE, and instead replace it with the more environmentally friendly fuel, ethanol, which in the U.S. is mainly derived from corn. MTBE has been found to contaminate groundwater and refiners are worried about costly lawsuits from municipalities.
''It pretty much caused the whole industry to stampede into the use of ethanol,'' said Geoff Sundstrom, a spokesman for AAA's national office.
But the shortages have not been caused by any lack of supply. Instead, fuel distributors say they are experiencing logistical challenges as terminal owners drain their tanks of MTBE-laced gasoline in preparation for the switch to ethanol blends. As a result, some retailers have had to wait longer than usual for deliveries and pumps have run dry in the interim — an outcome one distributor referred to as ''ethanol hell.''
The Northeast — with the exception of New York and Connecticut, which switched to ethanol last year — and Texas are the two regions most affected by the switch because of their heavy use of MTBE-blended gasoline. Particularly affected are Philadelphia, Baltimore, Washington, D.C., Richmond, Va., and parts of Delaware and New Jersey, Sundstrom said. Parts of Texas had shortages two weeks ago. California switched to ethanol two years ago, while most other states aren't users.
Certain regions are required by federal law to use reformulated gasoline to cut down on pollution. For example, Philadelphia and surrounding counties have a mandate but it's not a requirement for most of the rest of Pennsylvania, according to the Pennsylvania Petroleum Marketers and Convenience Store Association in Middletown, Pa.
Another logistical complication with ethanol is that it cannot be shipped through pipelines because water molecules in the pipelines will stick to it, creating problems for motorists' vehicle engines. Instead it has to be transported by truck, rail or barge from the Midwest. The concerns about mingling various fuel supplies is why terminal owners must scrub their tanks clean after draining them of MTBE-blended gasoline. Last week, a Motiva terminal in Newark, N.J., that disperses ethanol-blended gasoline had to replace its supply entirely after water seeped in, prompting complaints from drivers. ''Customers were pulling away and not getting very far,'' said Stan Mays, a spokesman for Motiva, a joint venture of Shell and Saudi Refining Inc. He said the problem has since been fixed.
With gasoline demand rising ahead of summer, trucks are idling in long lines at terminals, waiting for their turn to get the new reformulated gasoline, industry officials said. And earlier this week, eight gas stations in Philadelphia and Wilmington, Del., told AAA they ran out of MTBE gasoline while awaiting the new formulation. Two have since been resupplied. Tracey Bing, an employee at a Lukoil station in Philadelphia, said the gas station waited 29 hours before getting its ethanol gas at 4 a.m. Friday. ''We just shut down the gas and we only had premium available,'' he said.
But the situation is improving, said Shannon Breuer, a spokeswoman for Sunoco Inc., a petroleum refiner and marketer in Philadelphia with 4,700 gas stations, concentrated mainly in the Northeast. ''The shortages have been very shortlived,'' she said. ''We do have a commitment to have the rollover, the switch from MTBE to ethanol by May 6.''
Traditionally, the switch to cleaner burning fuel specifications before summer contributes to rising prices, said Jeff Lenard, spokesman for the National Association of Convenience Stores. This year, the transition to ethanol is causing some further price increases.
Analysts and industry officials said occasional shortages are possible for another few weeks, though they emphasized that the problem has more to do with delivery schedules than a dearth of fuel. Empty pumps are not nearly as frequent as they were after Hurricane Katrina, which knocked out the electricity needed to run pipelines delivering fuel from the Gulf Coast to the rest of the country.
The supply hiccups have occurred as refiners stop using the gasoline additive methyl tertiary-butyl ether, or MTBE, and instead replace it with the more environmentally friendly fuel, ethanol, which in the U.S. is mainly derived from corn. MTBE has been found to contaminate groundwater and refiners are worried about costly lawsuits from municipalities.
''It pretty much caused the whole industry to stampede into the use of ethanol,'' said Geoff Sundstrom, a spokesman for AAA's national office.
But the shortages have not been caused by any lack of supply. Instead, fuel distributors say they are experiencing logistical challenges as terminal owners drain their tanks of MTBE-laced gasoline in preparation for the switch to ethanol blends. As a result, some retailers have had to wait longer than usual for deliveries and pumps have run dry in the interim — an outcome one distributor referred to as ''ethanol hell.''
The Northeast — with the exception of New York and Connecticut, which switched to ethanol last year — and Texas are the two regions most affected by the switch because of their heavy use of MTBE-blended gasoline. Particularly affected are Philadelphia, Baltimore, Washington, D.C., Richmond, Va., and parts of Delaware and New Jersey, Sundstrom said. Parts of Texas had shortages two weeks ago. California switched to ethanol two years ago, while most other states aren't users.
Certain regions are required by federal law to use reformulated gasoline to cut down on pollution. For example, Philadelphia and surrounding counties have a mandate but it's not a requirement for most of the rest of Pennsylvania, according to the Pennsylvania Petroleum Marketers and Convenience Store Association in Middletown, Pa.
Another logistical complication with ethanol is that it cannot be shipped through pipelines because water molecules in the pipelines will stick to it, creating problems for motorists' vehicle engines. Instead it has to be transported by truck, rail or barge from the Midwest. The concerns about mingling various fuel supplies is why terminal owners must scrub their tanks clean after draining them of MTBE-blended gasoline. Last week, a Motiva terminal in Newark, N.J., that disperses ethanol-blended gasoline had to replace its supply entirely after water seeped in, prompting complaints from drivers. ''Customers were pulling away and not getting very far,'' said Stan Mays, a spokesman for Motiva, a joint venture of Shell and Saudi Refining Inc. He said the problem has since been fixed.
With gasoline demand rising ahead of summer, trucks are idling in long lines at terminals, waiting for their turn to get the new reformulated gasoline, industry officials said. And earlier this week, eight gas stations in Philadelphia and Wilmington, Del., told AAA they ran out of MTBE gasoline while awaiting the new formulation. Two have since been resupplied. Tracey Bing, an employee at a Lukoil station in Philadelphia, said the gas station waited 29 hours before getting its ethanol gas at 4 a.m. Friday. ''We just shut down the gas and we only had premium available,'' he said.
But the situation is improving, said Shannon Breuer, a spokeswoman for Sunoco Inc., a petroleum refiner and marketer in Philadelphia with 4,700 gas stations, concentrated mainly in the Northeast. ''The shortages have been very shortlived,'' she said. ''We do have a commitment to have the rollover, the switch from MTBE to ethanol by May 6.''
Traditionally, the switch to cleaner burning fuel specifications before summer contributes to rising prices, said Jeff Lenard, spokesman for the National Association of Convenience Stores. This year, the transition to ethanol is causing some further price increases.
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