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A users notes from the CEDIA Expo

Scott Greczkowski

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Sep 7, 2003
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I saw this EXCELLENT post from a gentleman named Alan Dana on the alt.dbs.echostar usenet newsgroup.

I hope Mr Dana does not mind but I wanted to share his note with all the members here at SatelliteGuys.US

Mr Dana was lucky enough to attend last weekd Cedia Expo and has a very interesting report.

I don't know if Mr Dana is a member here yet, but he should be!

Here you go a VERY interesting read!

 
It will support recording onto the hard disk from the OTA antenna input, but only HD programs, not Standard Definition or cable input.

I'd bet that he meant that he 921 will record Digital OTA, but not analog. This would be due to additional hardware being required to convert the analog TV signal to Digital before it could be written to the Hard Disk. If the OTA is Digital then it would not need to be converted.

Digital OTA can be either High Definition or Standard Definition. Analog of course can only be Standard.

Cyclone
 
$399 MIGHT work okay for the 811, but $1199 will blow me and about 50% or more potentials users away from getting it. Everyone has said for a long time that the price point maker or breaker would be about $999. I hope they know this!
 
It's disappointing to me that the price of the 811 gets announced at $299 in July Technical Chat, then gets raised to $399 after dealer input(?).

One would have thought that Dish would work this out with the dealers before any price announcement....
 
He said that no firm decision has been made, but that there was a possibility that no fees would ever be levied at the DP, 501, or 508 customers.

That is wise choice. I have already taken a copy of a 501 brochure that clearly states "FREE PVR" to the local office of the State AG and "chatted" about how to proceed should E* ever get STUPID enought to levy a fee on the receivers. The AG does not believe that changing the name of the service from PVR to DVR or DVOD abrogates the terms of service. So E* don't even think about trying to float that lame line.

but that some of Dish's most loyal, level-headed defenders on the forums were now either switching or contemplating switching to DirecTV
Amen. It is pathetic that after 7 yrs of being a loyal subscriber that I found it necessary to visit the AG because I am afraid E* is unwilling to do the right thing, and has now left the impression that they will now screw anyone at the drop of a hat.
 
What if E* sent a software upgrade and changed a 501 to a 502?(Just renameing the receiver)
 
Well, we talked about such tricks and they didn't believe that would float. The "box" I bought was promoted as being fee free. Even changing the software by adding features for an added cost would be problematic unless the customer had the option to refuse the upgrade and keep the receiver as is. Automatically sticking new software on the receiver and then charging for the new functionality would still ahve my AG after them. They woudl have a hard time dumping the receiver as well. The staff looked up the oldest Dish reciver around, the 2000 is still isted as active on the Dish website and lists that it is still receiving upgrades, so dumping the 501 or 508 would be be out character with Dish's historic maintenance and thus tantamount to forcing the customer to take a for fee model. Changing the name of the 501 or 508 or 721 won't work. The 510 is different because it is being advertised as carrying a fee.
 
Scott Greczkowski said:
He said that no firm decision has been made, but that there was a
possibility that no fees would ever be levied at the DP, 501, or 508
customers.

Alan

Don't DP users already pay a DVR fee? Does this mean that E* had been considering adding ANOTHER fee on top of the one that DP users already pay?
 
dlsnyder said:
Don't DP users already pay a DVR fee? Does this mean that E* had been considering adding ANOTHER fee on top of the one that DP users already pay?

Some DishPlayer owners do pay a $9.99 a month PTV fee. Others get it for free because they either bought it when DISH was offering "free lifetime PTV service" (which they latter changed to 3 year PTV service) or they paid $99 for "lifetime" or "3 year" PTV service (depending on when the customer ordered the service).

"Lifetime or 3 year" PTV service was set to expire in June of this year and DISH did start billing some DishPlayer owners $99 for 3 more years (which DISH said was a mistake due to "auto renewal" on the PTV option). Then DISH said that anyone that got it for free (or paid the $99 fee) three years ago will continue to get PTV until the end of the year. Those that have been paying $9.99 will continue to pay the $9.99.

It is not at all clear what DISH is going to do about the DishPlayer PTV fee at the end of this year but many DishPlayer owners (including myself) have already made up their mind that they will never pay any PTV fee to use the DishPlayer's recording feature.
 
Thats messed up. Why so paranoid?
 
Scott Greczkowski said:
He said that no firm decision has been made, but that there was a
possibility that no fees would ever be levied at the DP, 501, or 508
customers.
[/quote]

Do they also mean 721 customers? I would assume so. Also is it meant that no fee would ever be levied at the 501, 508 customers on any future DVR receivers such as the 510 or just on the receivers that they have now and that any future 501, 508 receivers that new customers activate would incur the fee? It has already been said that 501, 508, 721 customers were to be grandfathered from DVR fees on those units.

Also what if someone had a 501 or 508 then had it shut off or has some but has not activated them yet? Would they end up charging you DVR fees for the 510 and other future DVR receivers anyways? Probably so. You probably have to have a 501, 508, or 721 currently active on the account to get the fees in the future waived if they would even do this for those customers. Perhaps this will be another promotion they will give existing customers on future DVR receivers, grandfathered from DVR fees or free DVR functionality for a given amount of time like 1 or 2 years.
 
Unthinkable said:
Thats messed up. Why so paranoid?

It is pretty apparent that Dish is looking for ways to bring the older DVRs into the DVOD fee arena. I would bet my bottom dollar his lawyers are are looking at how they could go about it. If he wasn't, Charlie wouldn't even be MENTIONING the 501, 508 and 721.

I am just making sure that E* knows that some of us are "thinking" about them as well. E* tried this with the DP, I was one the people that had an official document from E* that said the DP $99 special offer was for free PVR for life. Dish started backpeddling after I sent them a copy. Do you think they had an epiphany and put the renewed fee on hold out of goodness! HAHA! I am not saying my documents alone led them to rethink that idea, but I know it was a factor, a legal one to boot.

E* lives by the lawsuit, I am just speaking their language.
 
Its sad that we as a group have lost faith in E and believe they are out to screw us. Charlie should of just said never a fee on older receivers pre 510. By the lack of comments it indicates its being considered.