MPEG2 Western Arc shutoff

[HipKat]

I personally would never upgrade a cust to a Duo...because as soon as we do that...they hit the 2 tuner limit, or want to add another TV...those are fun calls.... But it does hit a price point, so....

I agree but we get a LOT of them on Mpeg upgrades

 

[zippyfrog]

BTW, obviously those channels that have a MPEG4/HD and MPEG2/SD duplicates, the MPEG2/SD version will just disappear Leaving the MPEG4/HD version.

But what about those channels that are only in SD? Can SD be transmitted in MPEG4, or are all those channels going to have to be up rez’d to HD?

I didn't mention this in my earlier post, but right now some of the channels that have MPEG4/HD and MPEG2/SD are having the HD being moved to 110 or 119, but the SD channels are being moved to 129. To me that says when 129 goes away, that is when those SD channels go away. I can't tell the pattern of what is being moved over - it is hit and miss with the SD channels that have been moved to 129. NFL Network in SD got moved to 129, but Science Channel SD stayed on 110. Also, quite a few of the music channels got moved from 119 to 129.

SD channels can be in MPEG4 - that is what is currently being done on Eastern Arc. My guess is that when this is all said and done, Western Arc and Eastern Arc are going to be nearly identical in terms of configuration - two satellites for each, with MPEG4 being the standard for both SD and HD.

 

[telstar_1]

BTW, obviously those channels that have a MPEG4/HD and MPEG2/SD duplicates, the MPEG2/SD version will just disappear Leaving the MPEG4/HD version.

But what about those channels that are only in SD? Can SD be transmitted in MPEG4, or are all those channels going to have to be up rez’d to HD?

I'm sure that SD can be transmitted in MP4, it just wouldn't take as much bandwidth as HD (i.e., very little). As to formatting, I would expect them to now make everything 16:9 such that 4:3 SD would have sidebars.

Always wondered how long they would persist in keeping up a dual (and duplicative) SD/HD service. So are there any other RX's than 625 now going away? Is 322 still running? I would be interested in seeing some (rough) timeline as to when given models went dark, going back to the 90s.

Dropping the SD will obviously clear a LOT of bandwidth on 119 for current (and more efficient) 129 HD to migrate. Also this transition means a RX-only swapout with the dish unchanged. I presume that Charlie will ask most to self-swap. Anyone still on a single-feed SD?

I've been putting off relocating my dad's dish as a tree has been growing and weakening 129 (which ain't great to begin with); last year it seemed to oddly not be that bad, but now maybe I won't have to at all.

When they started in with 129 that made my job significantly harder in accessing signal on installations.

 

[zippyfrog]

Always wondered how long they would persist in keeping up a dual (and duplicative) SD/HD service. So are there any other RX's than 625 now going away? Is 322 still running? I would be interested in seeing some (rough) timeline as to when given models went dark, going back to the 90s.

Dropping the SD will obviously clear a LOT of bandwidth on 119 for current (and more efficient) 129 HD to migrate. Also this transition means a RX-only swapout with the dish unchanged. I presume that Charlie will ask most to self-swap. Anyone still on a single-feed SD?

I have wondered this myself. There might be some contractual obligations where Dish has to carry both an SD and a HD feed. But are any non-HD receivers being installed at this point? Is there a such thing as an MPEG4 receiver that is SD only and doesn't do HD? That is the only thing I can think of for why they would need to keep two feeds of each channel up there.

 

[HipKat]

I'm sure that SD can be transmitted in MP4, it just wouldn't take as much bandwidth as HD (i.e., very little). As to formatting, I would expect them to now make everything 16:9 such that 4:3 SD would have sidebars.

Always wondered how long they would persist in keeping up a dual (and duplicative) SD/HD service. So are there any other RX's than 625 now going away? Is 322 still running? I would be interested in seeing some (rough) timeline as to when given models went dark, going back to the 90s.

Dropping the SD will obviously clear a LOT of bandwidth on 119 for current (and more efficient) 129 HD to migrate. Also this transition means a RX-only swapout with the dish unchanged. I presume that Charlie will ask most to self-swap. Anyone still on a single-feed SD?

I've been putting off relocating my dad's dish as a tree has been growing and weakening 129 (which ain't great to begin with); last year it seemed to oddly not be that bad, but now maybe I won't have to at all.

When they started in with 129 that made my job significantly harder in accessing signal on installations.

In our experience, most of the people that we are upgrading have the older Dish 500s with DP twin LNB’s‘s so a dish swap is necessary

 

[telstar_1]

In our experience, most of the people that we are upgrading have the older Dish 500s with DP twin LNB’s‘s so a dish swap is necessary

It would be for a multituner receiver needing DPP multiplexing; couldn't a DPP twin be swapped for an older DP twin without change to the dish? Do they still offer new a single- or dual-tuner (HD-MP4) RX that can use the older DP multiplexing?

I have wondered this myself. There might be some contractual obligations where Dish has to carry both an SD and a HD feed. But are any non-HD receivers being installed at this point? Is there a such thing as an MPEG4 receiver that is SD only and doesn't do HD? That is the only thing I can think of for why they would need to keep two feeds of each channel up there.

Of course, and I forgot to mention, this did give them some measure of signal backup and failure redundancy as far as HD's on the WA being able to autoswitch from 129 to the "SD equivalent" from 119/110 in either bad weather or possibly in case of a failure on 129. But if they don't even own a sat at 129 it's got to be better at this point to drop that location altogether, as it was always a significant compromise signal-wise.

 

[MikeD-C05]

There is still city HD locals on spotbeams on 129. When I had western arc dish hooked to the satellite my locals were on 129 sat spot beam 8.

 

[nelson61]

I would be shocked if come August 1, 2023 anything is on 129. In fact, I wouldn't be at all surprised if under the configuration section where we can check satellite strength that 129 completely disappears, just like 77 disappeared from the config when it was no longer in use.

I believe 129W will be the workhorse for the western arc until it runs out of fuel or has a mechanical/electrical failure. Years from now.

 

[telstar_1]

I believe 129W will be the workhorse for the western arc until it runs out of fuel or has a mechanical/electrical failure. Years from now.

Well, so what's the deal then? From this communication from DiSH they are now dropping MP2 transmission, which would free up a lot of bandwidth on 119 and 110. In changing over to all MP4, they have to do that from 110/119 or else all cx's would need 129 reception for basic service. They'd not only have to install a lot of upgrade dishes, they'd lose a lot of cx's from lack of LOS and from dissatisfaction with 129's lower power. And I greatly doubt they would duplicate in MP4 on both 129 AND 110/119. Plus they're already apparently in migration away from 129.

If they're paying rent on their 129 sat, it would make no sense for them to keep doing that when 110/119 can easily carry the load in MP4. Cheap as Charlie is I don't know why he wouldn't have done this sooner.

 

[nelson61]

Well, so what's the deal then?

It's been a while since I have looked at them.
Bsck then 61e was the workhorse for eastern locals and ,72w carried the general programming. All in HD and both satellites highly utilized.

On the West, 129w was 50 percent locals using about half the transponders with general programming on the other half,.

110w was also a major source for HD locals, using about half the transponders and covering both sides of the continent
while Directv controls more the 10 percent of the transponders.

And, directv controls more than a 1/3 of the 119w transponders.

I just doubt Dish would have the capacity to make it with approx 1.5 satellites in the western arc while also doing the heavy lifting for nationals across the country.

 

[navychop]

But he’s keeping it as a backup as long as he rents. He frees it up, maybe somebody else snags it and it’s no longer available to carry some Dish load if some other satellite fails.

 

[nelson61]

If the past is any indication of leases, we will read that 129w has been renewed on a year to year basis in the 3rd quarter 10k

 

[scooperhsd]

BTW, obviously those channels that have a MPEG4/HD and MPEG2/SD duplicates, the MPEG2/SD version will just disappear Leaving the MPEG4/HD version.

But what about those channels that are only in SD? Can SD be transmitted in MPEG4, or are all those channels going to have to be up rez’d to HD?

Absolutely - check on the Eastern Arc for confirmation. There are lots of MPEG4 / SD channels for channels without HD .

 

[telstar_1]

Locals became a major thorn in Dish's side after they got pinched for letting dealers & customers within broadcast range activate distant network affils rather than bothering with an offair antenna. They sold dealers a "reference antenna" kit they were supposed to use to measure whether local signals were strong enough to bar the cx from distants, but many dealers just shoved the kit in a corner and lied that the signals were bad. Not too long after that, they got barred from activating distants at all unless a cx was way out beyond a grade B contour, so many responded by giving a false physical address out in a corner of MN or somewhere and having mailing at their actual.

Out of all of this DiSH has spent crazy resources on putting "every" locals market up on the birds.

Back to my question about Rx's- anyone know what pre-hoppers still work (and on which arc, etc), or know any history on previous obsoletings?

 

[scooperhsd]

Ones that PROBABLY work - VIP series (at least for now) on anything that Hoppers work on - i.e. Eastern Arc (61.5 and 72.7) and Western Arc (currently 110, 119, and 129, but rumors on here indicate that 129 may be leaving). They should also work on oddball slots that were used for Foreign language packages, if any of them are still being used.

 

[scooperhsd]

It's been a while since I have looked at them.
Bsck then 61e was the workhorse for eastern locals and ,72w carried the general programming. All in HD and both satellites highly utilized.

On the West, 129w was 50 percent locals using about half the transponders with general programming on the other half,.

110w was also a major source for HD locals, using about half the transponders and covering both sides of the continent
while Directv controls more the 10 percent of the transponders.

And, directv controls more than a 1/3 of the 119w transponders.

I just doubt Dish would have the capacity to make it with approx 1.5 satellites in the western arc while also doing the heavy lifting for nationals across the country.

I've said it before on here - I think 129 is going to be "forever". Just not enough capacity with out having more of 119 / 110. I do see Western Arc HD Locals moving to 119/110 as much as possible, and SD locals will completely disappear, much like what happened to Eastern Arc .

129 has real visibility issues for the NE USA, especially New England.

 

[ScubaGuy]

It's been a while since I have looked at them.
Bsck then 61e was the workhorse for eastern locals and ,72w carried the general programming. All in HD and both satellites highly utilized.

On the West, 129w was 50 percent locals using about half the transponders with general programming on the other half,.

110w was also a major source for HD locals, using about half the transponders and covering both sides of the continent
while Directv controls more the 10 percent of the transponders.

And, directv controls more than a 1/3 of the 119w transponders.

I just doubt Dish would have the capacity to make it with approx 1.5 satellites in the western arc while also doing the heavy lifting for nationals across the country.

What about the fact that EchoStar XXIII is sitting idle at the 110 slot?

EchoStar 23 at 109.9°W - LyngSat

I've been waiting for them to start using this satellite for about a year now.

Would it help out the situation for transponder room compared to what they're using now?

Dish USA on EchoStar 10/11 at 109.8°W - LyngSat

 

[nelson61]

They are using all their licenced transponders. No more bandwidth available. So the E23 transponders are "spares" .

 

[navychop]

Possibly for another location.

 

[scooperhsd]

Maybe the "unlaunched" Echostar satellite will be loaded to the gills with spotbeams ?