Comcast channel lineup is ....

[CrimsonKnightDX]

Where did you get the idea that Comcast was moving away from QAM for their conventional TV channels?Channel mapping is most certainly possible with QAM. They can even fall back on PSIP for those that still offer clear QAM channels.

As for IP streaming, the X1 uses QAM and IP. The STB has a DOCSIS 3.0 eCM imbedded. Each XI3 connects to the main hub using IP for video from the X1. I believe it's only a matter of time before QAM is eventually replaced by full inbound IP streams for the X1 and future versions.

Thanks for the QAM clarification. How does channel mapping with QAM interfere or prevent Comcast from doing a national lineup for cable channels? (excluding locals of course.)


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[harshness]

I believe it's only a matter of time before QAM is eventually replaced by full inbound IP streams for the X1 and future versions.

I can't imagine why Comcast would prefer TCP/IP over QAM for getting out the basic channels. It is one thing to send a single cast out to 20,000 people but it is a whole different story sending out 200 different streams all the while supporting significant numbers of on demand streams. The network would have to be pretty finely divided to prevent overloading major sections.

Thanks for the QAM clarification. How does channel mapping with QAM interfere or prevent Comcast from doing a national lineup for cable channels? (excluding locals of course.)

It probably doesn't, but given the varying capabilities of Comcast's many franchises (I think there are five in the San Francisco Bay Area), the system as a whole just isn't uniform enough to come up with a model that works across the board.

 

[cypherstream]

The channel mapping is all done in software. It could easily be fixed but they are "too big to fail" so I don't know if you'll ever see it fixed. TWC went into a national channel lineup, and I'm not sure if that project is complete or still underway. 1-99 stayed the same, not to confuse people, but channels 100 and up remain constant throughout their national footprint. If there happens to be a channel exclusive to an area, that number is just skipped over in other area's or maybe a different RSN is in an "rsn slot".

Another nice thing TWC has done is in software if the equipment is set to output 720 or 1080, it automatically tunes the HD stream. So even if TNT is channel 24 for example, and HD box tunes TNT HD simply by typing in that simple number (like DirecTV).

Passport Echo software has an addon feature for HD Auto tune as well. Not as many cable operators offer it though. Dual HD/SD channel maps can be configured for SARA guides as well. I used to think it was not possible at all with the blue i-Guide (Comcasts default system), but I found a YouTube video showing that it is possible to HD Auto tune using I-Guide. It was a Charter system. X1 has the ability though to automatically tune in HD feed. It's all up to the cable operator what they offer. I personally like a cleaner, more organized, easier to use HD system so I stick with DirecTV. I'll leave cable for what they are best at... Internet service. Comcast is leading in IPv6, DOCSIS 3.1 trials and constantly pushing the envelope with speed upgrades. TWC has been far more advanced offering much more HD, ethnic channels, Switched Digital Video, 860 MHz systems, OCAP software, auto-hd, etc... I think maybe thats what Comcast eyed during that failed merger attempt. Comcast could have used TWC's video engineers expertise because Comcast doesn't have much at all. TWC could have used Comcast's internet engineers expertise as well for IPV6 and leading the way with DOCSIS 3.1. But that merger failed and was not approved. We will have to see if Comcast can fend for themselves. Maybe they see the writing is on the wall and the future is not TV... its Internet and streaming. Maybe that is why they put the majority of their investment there.

 

[CrimsonKnightDX]

I can't imagine why Comcast would prefer TCP/IP over QAM for getting out the basic channels. It is one thing to send a single cast out to 20,000 people but it is a whole different story sending out 200 different streams all the while supporting significant numbers of on demand streams. The network would have to be pretty finely divided to prevent overloading major sections.It probably doesn't, but given the varying capabilities of Comcast's many franchises (I think there are five in the San Francisco Bay Area), the system as a whole just isn't uniform enough to come up with a model that works across the board.

Thank you Harshness for your input. I appreciate it. You're probably right and it makes sense. Going full IP is a lot of bandwidth! Especially on top of the existing internet subscribers. So maybe QAM is for the near future still.


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[CrimsonKnightDX]

The channel mapping is all done in software. It could easily be fixed but they are "too big to fail" so I don't know if you'll ever see it fixed. TWC went into a national channel lineup, and I'm not sure if that project is complete or still underway. 1-99 stayed the same, not to confuse people, but channels 100 and up remain constant throughout their national footprint. If there happens to be a channel exclusive to an area, that number is just skipped over in other area's or maybe a different RSN is in an "rsn slot".

Another nice thing TWC has done is in software if the equipment is set to output 720 or 1080, it automatically tunes the HD stream. So even if TNT is channel 24 for example, and HD box tunes TNT HD simply by typing in that simple number (like DirecTV).

Passport Echo software has an addon feature for HD Auto tune as well. Not as many cable operators offer it though. Dual HD/SD channel maps can be configured for SARA guides as well. I used to think it was not possible at all with the blue i-Guide (Comcasts default system), but I found a YouTube video showing that it is possible to HD Auto tune using I-Guide. It was a Charter system. X1 has the ability though to automatically tune in HD feed. It's all up to the cable operator what they offer. I personally like a cleaner, more organized, easier to use HD system so I stick with DirecTV. I'll leave cable for what they are best at... Internet service. Comcast is leading in IPv6, DOCSIS 3.1 trials and constantly pushing the envelope with speed upgrades. TWC has been far more advanced offering much more HD, ethnic channels, Switched Digital Video, 860 MHz systems, OCAP software, auto-hd, etc... I think maybe thats what Comcast eyed during that failed merger attempt. Comcast could have used TWC's video engineers expertise because Comcast doesn't have much at all. TWC could have used Comcast's internet engineers expertise as well for IPV6 and leading the way with DOCSIS 3.1. But that merger failed and was not approved. We will have to see if Comcast can fend for themselves. Maybe they see the writing is on the wall and the future is not TV... its Internet and streaming. Maybe that is why they put the majority of their investment there.

Thank you for that really fantastic insight! I always wanted to know why Comcast could not do the same. I remember growing up having Comcast, and finally went to DTV. I was amazing how awesome and nice the channel lineup in the guide was , and having the same HD location as the SD. The little things make a huge difference. I went back to Comcast a few months ago, and realized they are still doing two completely different locations far apart in the lineup. I hear other people, who come from satellite make the same observation on how confusing or just out right obnoxious it is.

As you mentioned, TWC has a national lineup like DTV and Dish. I wonder if Comcast did buy TWC if that would have flowed over to Comcast existing lineups making them all universal.


None the less. I appreciate your response, and this is why I really enjoy these forums. The vast amount of knowledge is amazing here!

 

[harshness]

Thank you Harshness for your input. I appreciate it. You're probably right and it makes sense. Going full IP is a lot of bandwidth! Especially on top of the existing internet subscribers. So maybe QAM is for the near future still.

Not just QAM, but MPEG4 (or better) and perhaps higher orders of QAM. In much the same way that the satellite carriers have their advancing modulation and compression schemes, comparable technologies are also available to the cable operators. The cable operators don't carry nearly as many channels as the satellite providers so perhaps their pressure to upgrade isn't as great.

 

[CrimsonKnightDX]

Not just QAM, but MPEG4 (or better) and perhaps higher orders of QAM. In much the same way that the satellite carriers have their advancing modulation and compression schemes, comparable technologies are also available to the cable operators. The cable operators don't carry nearly as many channels as the satellite providers so perhaps their pressure to upgrade isn't as great.

I am not sure if that is the case, not wanting to upgrade. I did a channel lineup comparison last night with Directv and Comcast. Directv had a few more channels, a few in HD that were not on Comcast, such as Nick Jr or TvLand. Maybe 3 channels in HD difference. Again, this varies from market to market in Cable.

I know the X1 is using MPEG4 via QAM. Do you know if VOD is using IP or QAM as well?

 

[king3pj]

Thank you for that really fantastic insight! I always wanted to know why Comcast could not do the same. I remember growing up having Comcast, and finally went to DTV. I was amazing how awesome and nice the channel lineup in the guide was , and having the same HD location as the SD. The little things make a huge difference. I went back to Comcast a few months ago, and realized they are still doing two completely different locations far apart in the lineup. I hear other people, who come from satellite make the same observation on how confusing or just out right obnoxious it is.

As you mentioned, TWC has a national lineup like DTV and Dish. I wonder if Comcast did buy TWC if that would have flowed over to Comcast existing lineups making them all universal.


None the less. I appreciate your response, and this is why I really enjoy these forums. The vast amount of knowledge is amazing here!

I don't know if your box supports custom guides but what I did on my Tivo with Charter is just remove all the SD channels from my guide as soon as I switched. There is no confusion for me because I still only have 1 channel number for every channel just like I used to on Dish a few years ago.

Charter also seems to have pretty good channel grouping in my area. All the premium movie channels are together, news is together, kids channels are together, sports are together, locals are together, etc...

The only difference for me is that the numbers are higher than they were on Dish. Most of my HD channels are in the 700s-800s with the exception of the the premiums being in the 500s.

 

[CrimsonKnightDX]

I don't know if your box supports custom guides but what I did on my Tivo with Charter is just remove all the SD channels from my guide as soon as I switched. There is no confusion for me because I still only have 1 channel number for every channel just like I used to on Dish a few years ago.

Charter also seems to have pretty good channel grouping in my area. All the premium movie channels are together, news is together, kids channels are together, sports are together, locals are together, etc...

The only difference for me is that the numbers are higher than they were on Dish. Most of my HD channels are in the 700s-800s with the exception of the the premiums being in the 500s.

Are you able to reassign a channel location in Tivo? For instance is NBC HD local is normally Channel 9, and the HD is 653, can you make 653 HD at the location of 9?

 

[osu1991]

Are you able to reassign a channel location in Tivo? For instance is NBC HD local is normally Channel 9, and the HD is 653, can you make 653 HD at the location of 9?

No

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[CrimsonKnightDX]

No

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Darn! I knew it as a long shot but.. thought I would ask. Thank you.

 

[king3pj]

Are you able to reassign a channel location in Tivo? For instance is NBC HD local is normally Channel 9, and the HD is 653, can you make 653 HD at the location of 9?

No

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osu1991 is right. That's not really what I meant by a custom guide though. I was talking about just removing channels I don't watch, like all the SD channels and channels I don't subscribe to, from my guide.

 

[DWS44]

Amazingly, the local cable company (not part or one of the conglomerates) recently rolled out the Passport HD Auto-tune here. Noticed it at my parents apartment.

Was shocking to see anything new added, considering otherwise that the interface on those boxes hasn't changed in over a decade.

 

[CrimsonKnightDX]

osu1991 is right. That's not really what I meant by a custom guide though. I was talking about just removing channels I don't watch, like all the SD channels and channels I don't subscribe to, from my guide.

Right, I understood what you had meant, I was just curious on that aspect, which I doubted to begin with. So on the X1 you can set favorites, and remove that channel from the lineup which is nice, but you only have one favorites list.

 

[CrimsonKnightDX]

Amazingly, the local cable company (not part or one of the conglomerates) recently rolled out the Passport HD Auto-tune here. Noticed it at my parents apartment.

Was shocking to see anything new added, considering otherwise that the interface on those boxes hasn't changed in over a decade.

So with that.. does it autotune to the HD channel when you input the SD channel number? the X1 has that, I just wish when I put channel 7 in, it was the same location at 7 as the HD in the guide or channel map.

 

[DWS44]

So with that.. does it autotune to the HD channel when you input the SD channel number? the X1 has that, I just wish when I put channel 7 in, it was the same location at 7 as the HD in the guide or channel map.

Yes. The SD & HD channels are still recognized as separate channels (Ex. SD channel is 107, corresponding HD channel is 1107), but with the auto-tune option turned on, if they input 107, it will automatically tune to 1107 instead.

 

[king3pj]

Yes. The SD & HD channels are still recognized as separate channels (Ex. SD channel is 107, corresponding HD channel is 1107), but with the auto-tune option turned on, if they input 107, it will automatically tune to 1107 instead.

Tivo has recently implemented this feature too. I don't know if it's the exact same technology but it accomplishes the same thing. I read about it in the patch notes for the latest software update to my Tivo Roamio. I have never seen it in action since all the SD channels have been removed from my guide since day one when I switched from OTA to cable.

 

[CrimsonKnightDX]

Yes. The SD & HD channels are still recognized as separate channels (Ex. SD channel is 107, corresponding HD channel is 1107), but with the auto-tune option turned on, if they input 107, it will automatically tune to 1107 instead.

Ah okay! Yes this feature is currently present. The issue I find is per say in the guide, you are looking at channel 7 and its 1107 for HD. When you hit record on the episode in the guide, it will record it on channel 7 not in HD on 1107. You will need to scroll to your HD section of channels and set it from the guide there. Which is a bummer. It would be nice when you see in the guide channel 7, you are looking at 7 in HD. So if you were to select to watch, its not auto tuning to HD, you are going to HD at that location. Also recording on that location as well.

 

[harshness]

I am not sure if that is the case, not wanting to upgrade. I did a channel lineup comparison last night with Directv and Comcast. Directv had a few more channels, a few in HD that were not on Comcast, such as Nick Jr or TvLand. Maybe 3 channels in HD difference.

Comcast probably doesn't offer many of the foreign language channels that AT&T (DIRECTV) does. With the exception of local broadcast channels, every channel that DIRECTV carries is available to every location they serve. For AT&T, this is a concern in both directions as they must send everything single channel up to the satellites regardless of where it ends up. Comcast grabs only what they need for their service area, crushes it with their special compression and spits it back out.

 

[harshness]

It would be nice when you see in the guide channel 7, you are looking at 7 in HD. So if you were to select to watch, its not auto tuning to HD, you are going to HD at that location. Also recording on that location as well.

As you might have guessed, Comcast isn't about making things easy for TiVo users. They like the revenue stream that comes from those using the in-house DVRs.

It will also make them a lot more nimble when they stop supporting CableCard to not have all that owned hardware in the field.