DISH and 4K
- Thread starter inazsully
- Start date
- Latest activity Latest activity:
- Replies 289
- Views 37K
satellites receives a compressed signal then amplifies it to retransmit it and then lnb on reception re-amplifies that signal again.
so correct me if I am wrong if its not power related but compression related.
I do know transmit power is limited to prevent "jamming" of other rf signals.
Satellite can easily deliver a fantastic 4k picture. But, like with any delivery system if they choose to compress the video too much to fit more channels in, it will not be a good picture.
Many cable operators use equipment that doesn't offer that kind of flexibility.
The newest Cox HD DVRs with ROVI have a "Auto-tune to HD" feature that may help with this.
Digital TV PQ isn't based on broadcast signal power. For the most part, either the signal gets through or it doesn't. In many cases, more power just means more multipath.
The only real reason that the satellite PQ can't be just as good is if the DBS feed is derived from a multiplexed and modulated OTA feed. If it comes through other channels (pre-mux), it has the potential to be much better.
If it takes more than 12MHz of bandwidth to deliver a fantastic 4K picture, things are going to get expensive.
The idiocy is if they devoted that same bandwidth to a few 1080i channels, everyone could be satisfied without having to upgrade anything.
It may have changed, and hopefully has, but if anyone leaves Dish, for instance, and goes to a cableco, they are likely to be sorely disappointed in the options available on their set-top boxes. My in-laws have Time Warner and the interface (GUI) is horrid and the list of "settings" is literally 5-6 items total.
While MPEG4 has several "Parts", each of those parts has an underlying technology that is typically known under some other name. MPEG4 is a "container" that holds any of a couple dozen "Parts". MPEG-7 is an XML wrapper that lets you add other stuff (like timecode based events and overlays).
Think of MPEG4 being more like the moving version of TIFF where the contents could be bitmapped facsimile encoding, JPEG or LZW compressed images along with a whole bunch of other background information.
HEVC appears to have been given the designation of MPEG-H Part 2.
For those here that seem to not understand sat transmission. The resolution that dish presents is full 1080. What you are seeing you think isn't full resolution is reduced bit rate. To get more HD channels carried something had to be adjusted and it is called variable bit rate. So they try to predict up coming needs of the picture how many bits that are need for the picture. And all the different picts needed on the transponder. We it isn't perfect at the adaption so there are less than optimum bits assigned at any given sec. But they do a fair good job. Also dish really needs to get it together and get rid of all those old receivers need to be gotten rid off so they can reclaim all the lost bandwidth.
Last edited:
Dish as far as I know doesn't use H. They are still using H.264/MPEG-4 AVC. MPEG H is the container for UHD up to 8k resolution.
Without compression there would be no signal what so ever. All digital signals are compressed. So no compression doesn't decrease the PQ. Smaller bit rates will decrease the PQ.
I was under the impression that smaller bit rates equal more compression. More compressed onto the transponder.
NOTHING is likely to equal optical media PQ.
Posted Via The FREE SatelliteGuys Reader App using an iPhone.
No not the same thing. You can have high bit rate and high compression. You can have high bit rate and low compression. You can have low bit rate and high compression and low bit rate and high compression. Compression is just a the format that is used to send the info on the digital stream. Bit rates are assigned to the compression. It is easier to use lower bit rates no matter what the compression is.
Getting lost in technicalities here.
Assuming the same source, compression codecs, and encoding equipment:
lower bit rate = less data = higher data compression needed = lower quality.
higher bit rate = more data = less data compression needed = better quality.
There can be variations in the quality of the compression based on the equipment used even when the specs for bitrate and codec are nominally the same.
Add in that there are different compression codecs and it is a little fuzzier. A 6mbps "mpeg4/h264" stream may look better and be of overall better quality than a 10mbps "mpeg2/h262" stream of the same source content, even though the mpeg4 stream is a lower bit rate.
But, again assuming there isn't enough bandwidth to transmit the data bit for bit, and with all other variables the same, lower bit rate = less data = higher compression needed = lower quality.
Assuming the same source, compression codecs, and encoding equipment:
lower bit rate = less data = higher data compression needed = lower quality.
higher bit rate = more data = less data compression needed = better quality.
There can be variations in the quality of the compression based on the equipment used even when the specs for bitrate and codec are nominally the same.
Add in that there are different compression codecs and it is a little fuzzier. A 6mbps "mpeg4/h264" stream may look better and be of overall better quality than a 10mbps "mpeg2/h262" stream of the same source content, even though the mpeg4 stream is a lower bit rate.
But, again assuming there isn't enough bandwidth to transmit the data bit for bit, and with all other variables the same, lower bit rate = less data = higher compression needed = lower quality.
Dish gets about 42mbit/sec on their HD TPs. They could deliver 4k without issue. Netflix/Amazon are talking 20mbit/sec. I do not think there would be complaints if 2 4k channels were on one TP each getting 20mbit/sec. The problem is that Dish will put 4 on there and people will complain.
Only four 4k channels on a transponder? Why not 6 or 8 ? I'm sure DISH will try cram as many as they can on a transponder ,using the mpeg of their choice.
