HTL HD Default Ratio

[ckudrna]

The fact is, 4:3 HDTV sets exist, and in large numbers. I could care less if it is not recognized, but most DTV broadcasts keep any text so when expanded on a 4:3 HD set they will not be lost. This was the case today for the PGA event on, any leader board graphics were all kept to fit when the HD signal was expanded onto a 4:3 with the edges cut off.

The local Cubs games on WGN have the score bar on the top centered so it lines up perfectly when expanded on a 4:3 set.

Broadcasters are taking into account 4:3 sets when sending out HD signals, or it is just a great coincidence. Which do you think is the case?

Correct me if I am wrong, but when has the ATSC been responsible for "acknowledging" various formats of televisions produced? I thought they only dealt with the digital signals being broadcasts??..............They have no dealing with actual sets made, only broadcast standards. They call it "DTV", not "HDTV".

Still confusing the vocab huh?

 

[ckudrna]

4:3 HDTV sets have the bars you are trying to eliminate anyway

Ok, you still do not get it. There are no bars when viewing a 16:9 broadcast in standard or expand. The box defaults to standard when tuning to a 16:9 broadcast. The user must switch the format to expanded in order to eliminate the image from being shrunk. If the box is default to expand, the regular 4:3 broadcasts are stretched out. No bars are involved with any of this. You prove again you have NOT A CLUE what you are talking about.

This forum does not deal with modifying equipment to illegally get programming. This is in no way illegal. So, it is certainly within the bounds of the forum TOS.

If you are happy with your setup go watch it, You have contributed nothing to this question but have shown over and over you keep mixing up vocab and have no idea what you are talking about. Why don't you leave it to someone who knows what they are talking about?

You have really dug yourself a hole here, each and every post you show the world how you have little understanding of the terminology you wrongly use.

 

[slacker9876]

I'm done

 

[ckudrna]

Hmm, you were so sure you had all the answers not too long ago...........

Leave it to someone who knows what they are talking about. You have failed in showing me that you have any real understanding of DTV.

 

[slacker9876]

The fact is, 4:3 HDTV sets exist, and in large numbers. I could care less if it is not recognized, but most DTV broadcasts keep any text so when expanded on a 4:3 HD set they will not be lost. This was the case today for the PGA event on, any leader board graphics were all kept to fit when the HD signal was expanded onto a 4:3 with the edges cut off.

The local Cubs games on WGN have the score bar on the top centered so it lines up perfectly when expanded on a 4:3 set.

Broadcasters are taking into account 4:3 sets when sending out HD signals, or it is just a great coincidence. Which do you think is the case?

Correct me if I am wrong, but when has the ATSC been responsible for "acknowledging" various formats of televisions produced? I thought they only dealt with the digital signals being broadcasts??..............They have no dealing with actual sets made, only broadcast standards. They call it "DTV", not "HDTV".

Still confusing the vocab huh?

Consider yourself corrected:
The ATSC Standard for Digital Television (DTV) encompasses a number of elements, documented in various Standards, Recommended Practices, and Implementation Guidelines. The document map on this web site includes all ATSC documents and selected documents from SMPTE, SCTE, ITU, and other organizations.

 

[ckudrna]

Those are all broadcast standards, not standards that are given to the television companies that they must follow. I can make a 234:61 format TV if I want, the size or aspect ratio of the viewable area of the TV has nothing to do with the ATSC. Formats that broadcasters use are reccomended by the ATSC as good practice. The FCC is the only body that has legal authority to MAKE anyone broadcast in a certain way.

Consider yourself corrected, AGAIN.

I thought you were done, you keep striking out here.

 

[slacker9876]

Hmm, you were so sure you had all the answers not too long ago...........

Leave it to someone who knows what they are talking about. You have failed in showing me that you have any real understanding of DTV.

Ummmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm ... I said that no it can't be done like 4 times in here. You have a real short circuit don't you? I know more about DTV and SAT TV than you will ever know ... mostly becuase I RTFM and ignore "data" from idiots like you.

If you have any data to support it can be done feel free to post it here. Oops, that is right YOU are the ONE whom does not know!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[ckudrna]

Ummmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm ... I said that no it can't be done like 4 times in here. You have a real short circuit don't you? I know more about DTV and SAT TV than you will ever know ... mostly becuase I RTFM and ignore "data" from idiots like you.

Dude, just stop already. You have no idea what you are saying. You said no it cannot be done because it was not in the manual, then you said it may be possible by modifying the software, and then you went on to say all these things about the ATSC and DTV and HDTV sets that was not true, you even said that "I should buy a HDTV if I wanted to watch these programs" with no knowledge that 4:3 HDTV sets are made and puchased in large numbers.

I do not think you really know anything. Every other response you have given in other threads has been skewed from the truth, you just do not know everything you think you do. If you have something worthwhile to contribute, please go ahead and do so, telling me I am an idiot for no real reason (when you are the one that keeps making mistakes about a wide range of topics) is just plain funny. Please be done already, just accept that you do not know how to go about doing this and you can be of no help.

I am seeking an answer from someone who knows what they are doing, and you obviously do not. You are the one writting one line replies staing "you are an idiot" and things like that. Not only does this prove you know not what you are talking about, but you act like a two year old in the process.

Accept the fact you do not know how to do this, and get out of this thread already.

This is the best part yet

If you have any data to support it can be done feel free to post it here. Oops, that is right YOU are the ONE whom does not know!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I thought the original post was a question, was it not? How do you go about doing this. You do not know, you have no business posting in here. If you have the answer let me know, but you do not.

You were wrong about so many things here. You should go back and read some of them, i think they are real funny.

Don't lie to yourself, if your posts here about DTV and HDTV sets is what you think is "fact" you have a lot to learn. You have showed us all that you really have little idea what you are talking about. You read the manual to figure out how to turn it all on because you would not know otherwise.

If you have an answer please contribute, if you want to belittle other people with your overwhelming "knowledge" of everything SAT related (which you have shown has been total BS, you have not a clue between the difference of DTV and an HDTV, let alone that HDTVs come in 4:3)........ go somewhere else.

 

[slacker9876]

Is it possible to set a default ratio on the CHANNEL LEVEL on the HTL HD?

No it is not possible to do this at the channel level, all availablbe modes are listed under Menurefrences: TV Aspect Ratio, you can MANUALLY set these when you tune a channel by using the ratio button on your remote. This is only allowed if the BROADCAST format SUPPORTS changing these modes, this is COMPLETELY dependant upon the received broadcast.

I would want it done on the channel level so i can set ESPN HD and such to Expand while keeping regular channels (CNBC, MSNBC, CNN, whatever) in "Standard" mode to avoid stretching.

You can't always get what you want, but if you try sometimes, you just might find you get what you need -Mick Jagger

The TV can be set for letterbox, cutting off a few inches on the top and bottom. It is only a 36" set (the biggest one that would fit in this piece of furniture) so lossing the top and bottom for letterbox on everything does not make sense.

This is best adjusted by the receiver. This is becuase if you change the aspect of the television, then the receiver, the modes do not function as designed and you break down the quality of your picture.

Another gripe with the HTL HD is the lack of program name upon tuning to the channel. Maybe this can be set, but I do not know why it is not the default. Program name upon selection of channels in the surf menu would be nice too.

You can't always get what you want, but if you try sometimes, you just might find you get what you need -Mick Jagger

I can see you are quite knowledgable, perhaps the end all be off of knowledge of this site. We are all idiots and peons, that is why WE seek YOUR advice. Maybe if you could get DirecTV to hire you as an enginner you could have some say over the functionallity of the hardware & software they design. You may find this difficult as your employee file shows you are best suited for taking out the trash from my office.

 

[slacker9876]

Correct me if I am wrong, but when has the ATSC been responsible for "acknowledging" various formats of televisions produced? I thought they only dealt with the digital signals being broadcasts??..............They have no dealing with actual sets made, only broadcast standards. They call it "DTV", not "HDTV".

Okay, you may consider yourself corrected, yet again. The ATSC is the committee that makes all decisions (standards) in relation to DTV and HDTV. You can see for yourself at atsc.org

The Advanced Television Systems Committee, Inc., is an international, non-profit organization developing voluntary standards for digital television. The ATSC member organizations represent the broadcast, broadcast equipment, motion picture, consumer electronics, computer, cable, satellite, and semiconductor industries.

Specifically, ATSC is working to coordinate television standards among different communications media focusing on digital television, interactive systems, and broadband multimedia communications. ATSC is also developing digital television implementation strategies and presenting educational seminars on the ATSC standards.

ATSC was formed in 1982 by the member organizations of the Joint Committee on InterSociety Coordination (JCIC): the Electronic Industries Association (EIA), the Institute of Electrical and Electronic Engineers (IEEE), the National Association of Broadcasters (NAB), the National Cable Television Association (NCTA), and the Society of Motion Picture and Television Engineers (SMPTE). Currently, there are approximately 130 members representing the broadcast, broadcast equipment, motion picture, consumer electronics, computer, cable, satellite, and semiconductor industries. ATSC incorporated on January 3, 2002.

ATSC Digital TV Standards include digital high definition television (HDTV), standard definition television (SDTV), data broadcasting, multichannel surround-sound audio, and satellite direct-to-home broadcasting.

On December 24, 1996, the United States Federal Communications Commission (FCC) adopted the major elements of the ATSC Digital Television (DTV) Standard (A/53). The ATSC DTV Standard has been adopted by the governments of Canada (November 8, 1997), South Korea (November 21,1997), Argentina (October 22, 1998) and Mexico (July 2, 2004).

A detailed history of the development of the ATSC Digital Television Standard explains the process of the FCC Advisory Committee on Advanced Television Service (ACATS) and the role of the ATSC.

 

[slacker9876]

Are we having fun yet Neutron?

 

[ckudrna]

I appreciate the part up until your typical smart ass remarks. You are a PEON not a PEE-ON. I am not sure where i said that I was the most knowledgeable person here, but you sure did try to tell me i was a total idiot for even asking this question. You then went on to demonstrate your expansive knowledge by making a ton of false statements and mixing up words.

The TV will allow me to adjust the ratio from letterbox (lines on top and bottom) and to fill the frame. I obviously want to fill the frame, so i use that one. From there I can adjust the ratio on the box, but all DTV channels default to standard, which squeezes the whole 16:9 image onto the 4:3. The DTV broadcast format does accept changing these formats.

Having a way to attribute the default ratio for a given signal format WOULD be great. So all incoming 16:9 broadcasts stay in the native horizontal resolution but be chopped off at the sides.

Update-

I called Directv tech support tonight to ask them about this, and "Matt" said they are aware of the issue and are working with Hughes to incorporate something more like a signal conversion that defaults based on the TV ratio. He said an initial setup option where you can select the size of the TV and it would set DTV broadcasts to display in expand and SD in standard, which does the job perfectly. Hopefully we can see something like this in a couple months with new software or at least have this on all new receivers. I was quite surprised that other people were actually thinking about this, especially after slacker said "I was the only one with this problem".


A happy ending after piles of BS from a armchair expert.

Buddy, the ATSC deals with standards of broadcasting and receiving. It does not tell tv manufactures what size and ratio TVs to make. Manufactures do this because they THINK that the public will want a set that will work well with the broadcasting standards, is that not smart of them!! The ATSC has no authority to impose any rules or regulations, that what the FCC does. I can make up a standards company too and decide which toilet paper i want to use, etc. See the word "RECOMMENDS" before everything they do? They do nothing, but RECOMMEND things to people. Do you still not get this? You have been trying to look stuff up all night to find a shred of truth in your incorrect statements haven't you? HA HA HA.

You have been corrected at least 10 times here tonight, you keep digging a hole, and now Directv even said they are aware of this and are working with Hughes to make a solution. All of your banter and you were dead wrong about most everything you said. No need to talk anymore.

 

[slacker9876]

Okay, now I am DONE ... for real this time, this is getting too old now. I am right, you don't know, you don't listen, you are wrong .... nanny nanny billygoat. So feel free to have the last word.:haha

...and after all we know that every CSR / ENG at D* is the letter of the law.

 

[ckudrna]

Okay, now I am DONE ... for real this time, this is getting too old now. I am right, you don't know, you don't listen, you are wrong .... nanny nanny billygoat. So feel free to have the last word.

HA HA HA. You still have not made one correct statement here tonight. You have dug a hole and now you are trying to slip away, maybe you will delete all your posts with your false truths in them. Your pile of BS has gotten so large it has fallen on you and blocked you view of the 16:9 so you can now only see 4:3 and you do not know what to do!!!

...and after all we know that every CSR / ENG at D* is the letter of the law.

You just stated a few posts back that because I am so smart I should be working at D*, but no according to you engineers and CSRs at D* are all morons? Hmm, another turn here. I did not see that coming!!!

Oh, and now the company is not good enough for him. He needs the president of Tanzania to tell him it will be switched.

You sound a lot like you are a John Kerry fan, you lay on the Bullsh!t real thick, and then make it into truth in your head, and then try to smear it all over innocent people. I see a striking similarity.

 

[stevesmall]

you do should just get a room it is obvious you are in love with each other !!!!!!!!

 

[slacker9876]

Okay this will be my last post Richard. I submitted your question to D* via e-mail .. it does not get more official than this ... in case you don't like reading your answer is STILL NO, just like I said.

Thanks for asking about High Definition Television (HDTV). We broadcast most of our HDTV offerings in 16:9 format, since most HDTVs have a widescreen with that ratio. If we receive signals from our programmers with content in the 4:3 format, you may see black areas on the right and left edges of the screen that make the image fit the viewing area.

If you have a square (4:3 aspect ratio) HDTV, and we broadcast the HD signal in the 16:9 widescreen format, you may see black areas at the top and bottom of your screen.

To change the aspect ratio or screen format settings on your Hughes HTL-HD receiver:

1. Press the MENU button.
2. Highlight and SELECT Preferences.
3. The TV Aspect Ratio option will be highlighted.
4. Use the RIGHT arrow key to move to the format choices.
5. Use the UP/DOWN arrows to highlight a format choice. Press the SELECT button to choose one of the following modes for viewing:
-4x3 program on 16x9 TV: Normal, Wide, Panorama, Zoom, Cine-Zoom
-16x9 program on 4x3 TV: Letter Box, Cropped, Squeezed
-16x9 program on 16:9 TV: Standard, Expand, Shrink 6. Press EXIT button to return to TV.

If you need further assistance, please refer to your owner's manual or call our technical support center at 1-800-531-5000 and select the option for technical assistance.

Thanks again for writing. I hope you find this information useful.

Sincerely,

Ty
DIRECTV Customer Service



Original Message Follows:
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DIRECTV FEEDBACK MESSAGE

Name: Chris

Status: Subscriber

[Account Number: ]

[Topic Selected: Technical]

Subject: HTL-HD

Details: With the new 4:3 HD monitor, it is quite annoying every time i tune into channels like ESPN HD, Discovery HD, and any other HD channel for that matter, as all of the 16:9 images are squeezed onto the 4:3 monitor.

Is it possible to set a default ratio on the CHANNEL LEVEL on the HTL HD?


You dumbass ... I told you so LMAO!!!!!

 

[towelie]

Wouldn't the resolution not be as good if you enlarged 16:9 programming to fit onto a 4:3 screen?

 

[slacker9876]

Wouldn't the resolution not be as good if you enlarged 16:9 programming to fit onto a 4:3 screen?

When it is a 4:3 HDTV, the resolution would be fine, it would still be 1080i, 720p or whatever. The issue you encounter is the image would be cropped or letterboxed. Just like when you watch DVD's in OAR on a 4:3. In fact a lot of DVD's are OAR and you still have bar on the 16:9 TV's too. Usually this is to a lesser degree but it all depends on the ratio the film was shot in and the DVD was mastered with.

 

[branchbouncer]

I hope that D* is working on thier own software,hughes no longer make any products for D*


http://www.hns.com/HNS/Rooms/Displa...Entity[OID[59544A7F79A59244A83C8FF30219FEB4]]

 

[towelie]

I understand the letterboxing (I have a 4:3 hdtv). but the original question (as I understand it), was trying to unletterbox at 16:9 image to fill a 4:3 screen. that enlarged (and cropped) image wouldn't have the resolution as it did letterboxed, no?