Some Dish Info

[tom9730]

no 921 in the list of receivers

 

[Weezknight]

In the Facts thing they mentioned about the HD OTA locals needing the new receivers, plus HD Bronze.

I'm not upgrading right away, but I currently get my OTA HD from the 811 with the HD Pak. Am I to assume they're going to disable the OTA on the 811 after 2/1?

 

[lakebum431]

There is no way they are going to disable the OTA on the 811. What would be the point?

 

[Weezknight]

There is no way they are going to disable the OTA on the 811. What would be the point?

To force me into an upgrade when the HD Locals are available in my area.

 

[Scott Greczkowski]

No the new HD locals which Dish will send via Satellite will ONLY be in MPEG4, so if you want to see these local HD channels via Satellite you will need a MPEG4 receiver.

If you are already getting them off air you can continue receiving them off air, they are not shutting features off just because HD locals might be available in your area.

 

[cleblanc]

What are they going to do with the NY and LA locals that are now distant networks as well as local networks. CBS-HD is on 61.5 in MPEG2 and can be received by people who qualify. Will this channel be converted to MPEG-4 and then all the people who have access now will lose it unless they upgrade the receiver. Or will the NY and LA networks be done in MPEG-2? Or will there be a combination which is CBS stays in MPEG2 but the new ones come on in MPEG-4?

 

[Brewer4]

Looks like Dish has priced my need out for extra HD. I have Directv and plan to keep since the family loves Tivo but wanted to keep Dish for extra HD. I was a new customer last year and my lease new package deal ends in May. I also got the East Coast deal where AT60 was only 20 bucks. I was gonna switch to just HD package but cant do that under a lease scenario and the buy new receiver and just get HD pack is just flat out too much. Either way, there's too much overlap with Directv and the extra cost is just not justified.

 

[Brewer4]

With the announcement of Netflix offering HD DVD and Blu-Ray discs, that solidifies my decision to toss Dish. I prefer my movies via Netflix and now they have committed to both formats. Zee ya.

 

[jsanders]

There is no way they are going to disable the OTA on the 811. What would be the point?

The point is to force you to subscribe to their locals. The new DirecTV HD DVR that is supposed to come out soon has the OTA tuners removed completely from it.

With the tactics of dish with their HD Only Pack and DirecTV getting rid of the ATSC tuners, the Sony HD OTA DVR or the series 3 HD TiVo are looking very attractive. Those companies need to understand that they also need to market to those that want to augment their free, local programming with free guide data! They need to learn it soon, or they will loose business!

 

[drdr]

Same goes for those of you who were able to lease the 942. You all paid a $250 lease fee and come April 1st, you can give Charlie his box back and only pay $99 to get the latest and greatest (still to be proven) PVR. For those of you who paid $600 - $900 for their current HD PVR, you have to give Charlie your old PVR plus another $99 for the honor of leasing his equipment.

I understand that they would want leased equipment back on an exchange. Have the details on upgrades for existing customers who own the 921/942 been officially released yet? How do you know that they have to return purchased equipment in exchange for a lease?

 

[Scott Greczkowski]

The point is to force you to subscribe to their locals. The new DirecTV HD DVR that is supposed to come out soon has the OTA tuners removed completely from it.

How are you being forces to subscribe to their locals? Maybe I am missing something here.

 

[waltinvt]

If this is the case, I will be ecstatic.. HD locals for New York City (Hello Super Bowl) I get to add the channels 2/1 that I want, and then I upgrade in April when they have enough of the machines.

E* if you are reading this do it this way, announce that the new channels will be in Mpeg2 on a temporary basis. then on July 1st, change the headers tot he mpeg4 plan. Thsi gives you several months to get the new machines in the pipeline, we get the new channels we want, and you get more revenue. Everybody wins. THIS is how you solve the problem, and give them enough notice so people won't whine too loud.

I've suggested this more than once right after the announcment but I don't think anyone's listening. Besides it probably makes too much sense

 

[waltinvt]

How are you being forces to subscribe to their locals? Maybe I am missing something here.

Come on Scott.

Technically nobody's "forced" into anything but I think it's pretty obvious that Dish has been making it harder to use OTA without subing to their locals.

Their OTA tuners have never been as good as STB type digital tuners or those built into HDTVs.

Per most posts here over the last year, each suscessive Dish HD receiver with OTA has been weaker in terms of pulling in signals.

Dish restricts the EPG part of the PSIP data stream for signals received by the 942's OTA tuner and won't pass on their own epg info unless you sub their locals.

And now apparently there will be a $6 surcharge if subs want to use the OTA tuner without subing to certain Dish programming packages.

How much more obvious does it need to get to realize that Dish DOES NOT WANT subs using OTA, they want us to buy their locals instead. This is going to get even more obvious now that Dish is getting into HD locals.

 

[jsanders]

I understand that they would want leased equipment back on an exchange. Have the details on upgrades for existing customers who own the 921/942 been officially released yet? How do you know that they have to return purchased equipment in exchange for a lease?

I called Dish last week to cancel my service. When I did, the CSR told me that you don't have to return purchased equipment to get the 622 lease upgrade. You have to take the CSR's words with a large grain of salt though, most of them don't seem to be well informed.

 

[NightRyder]

I called Dish last week to cancel my service. When I did, the CSR told me that you don't have to return purchased equipment to get the 622 lease upgrade. You have to take the CSR's words with a large grain of salt though, most of them don't seem to be well informed.

An executive CSR told me the same last night.


NightRyder

 

[jsanders]

How are you being forces to subscribe to their locals? Maybe I am missing something here.

You are aware of everything that waltinvt said. The DVR isn't useful w/o guide data, it becomes an old fashioned VCR. You know the issues. D* is removing their ATSC tuners from their future DVR because they want you to subscribe to THEIR locals.

You seem to have changed tone from a few months ago. Where is the Scott that started the campaing to say no to the $100 sports fee D* was going to charge to HD customers? Now we have a Scott that tells us at CES that Charlie is going to make a good deal for upgrading to the 622. Yes, is a good deal for HIM, not us!

Here they are trying to cheat us again. They say the increase is only on *average* 4%, but they are increasing DVR fees by 20%, and "access fees" by 20%, and HD Pack only people by over 150% when all of the increases are added up. Yet, this same dish isn't willing to take a 76% increase from Lifetime! That is fine, but it makes E* a HYPOCRITE!

Are you willing to start one of your campaigns to complain about some of the thigns E* is doing? How about a campaign where your 34k satellite guys pick a prime hour and everyone call dish simulteanously to complain. It would serve a good purpose. Dish wouldn't be able to service their normal customers, yet they would still be paying for those calls to India, and they would still be paying CSRs salary. You could also have everyone simultaneously tell every consumer advocate group about this. Woudn't it be a shame if this ended up on the local 6 O'Clock news everywhere? You *might* have the power to hit them in the pocketbook. That gives leverage to ask for a few reasonable concessions. Dish obviously likes to play hardball, with their service providers, AND with their customers.

Dish has taken advantage of me with the 921 fiasco, with the 942 to 622 upgrade, and now with their fees being 160% more than the cost of programming ($20 programming, $32 in fees) for HD Only customers. And all of this because of a lie - that is FAKE MPEG-4! I know that I am not the only one who is upset with them!

 

[nuts4scuba]

Come on Scott.

Technically nobody's "forced" into anything but I think it's pretty obvious that Dish has been making it harder to use OTA without subing to their locals.

Their OTA tuners have never been as good as STB type digital tuners or those built into HDTVs.

Per most posts here over the last year, each suscessive Dish HD receiver with OTA has been weaker in terms of pulling in signals.

Dish restricts the EPG part of the PSIP data stream for signals received by the 942's OTA tuner and won't pass on their own epg info unless you sub their locals.

And now apparently there will be a $6 surcharge if subs want to use the OTA tuner without subing to certain Dish programming packages.

How much more obvious does it need to get to realize that Dish DOES NOT WANT subs using OTA, they want us to buy their locals instead. This is going to get even more obvious now that Dish is getting into HD locals.

I think you are reading too much into what Dish's is doing.

My tuner in my 921 is better than the one in my 6000.

If I had to use my local channels' PSIP to setup my 921 I wouldn't be able to record CBS or Fox since their PSIP info is all messed up.

And why should Dish subsidize your tuner purchase when all you want is ota?

 

[drdr]

Per most posts here over the last year, each suscessive Dish HD receiver with OTA has been weaker in terms of pulling in signals.

Actually, the 942 has better OTA reception than the 6000 at my house. Do you have any technical data to back up your statement?

If E* didn't want us to see OTA HD, then they wouldn't put OTA tuners in their receivers.

 

[jsanders]

I think you are reading too much into what Dish's is doing.
My tuner in my 921 is better than the one in my 6000.
If I had to use my local channels' PSIP to setup my 921 I wouldn't be able to record CBS or Fox since their PSIP info is all messed up.
And why should Dish subsidize your tuner purchase when all you want is ota?

I don't think you should call a $1000 921 subsidized! It doesn't accept PSIP data streams, you have to subscribe to locals to get the guide data. The 811 gets a 2 day programming guide data for free, yet they charge for it on the 921/942/622. We all pay for that $6/mo "access fee", I'm guessing that is how 811 owners end up paying for their data. If the 921 owner wants it, he pays the $6 access fee, which is hidden in his SD package, he pays the $6/mo DVR fee, and he also has to pay $5/mo for locals. Add them up, he is paying $17 per month for the privlige! Dish could tier it and charge for locals if they wanted a 9 day guide data and say the 2-day guide data is free, like on the 811s. They could also say that the user gets his free PSIP data for free, but he can have the 9-day data if he subscribes to locals. They don't do that, they don't let you have access to the free program data, they just charge you the cost of locals for it.

 

[Paradox-SJ]

The point is to force you to subscribe to their locals. The new DirecTV HD DVR that is supposed to come out soon has the OTA tuners removed completely from it.
With the tactics of dish with their HD Only Pack and DirecTV getting rid of the ATSC tuners, the Sony HD OTA DVR or the series 3 HD TiVo are looking very attractive. Those companies need to understand that they also need to market to those that want to augment their free, local programming with free guide data! They need to learn it soon, or they will loose business!

This is soooo true. The majority of all the HD we watch is from OTA. Now we have (in a month) HD-DVD so their stangle hold on HD weakens again.