Where is USB External Storage for the 942/ViP622?

[ChetK]

I saw this drive at Best Buy a few weekends ago.

Dish would be stupid to make you buy a Dish Network hard drive at a higher price than the market price for a non-E* HD. In fact, this feature would be great for customer retention. Why would I leave E* if all of my external hard drive recordings are tied to E* receivers?

 

[Posty-McPOst]

Scott, thanks for the re-assurance! After I posted, I found this posting in your regular (non-HD) forum:

http://www.satelliteguys.us/showthread.php?t=76830

At least in the picture here it looks like they have some specific drive in mind, but I hope you are correct.
.

The drive in the picture below says Maxtor, not Dish. It looks like a standard external HDD enclosure.

 

[jdr01930]

" The drive in the picture below says Maxtor, not Dish. It looks like a standard external HDD enclosure."

True, but the PocketDish still says Archos on it too, but it's got different firmware and you can't by it "retail".

On a related note, a lot of people are saying they expect if Dish provides the hardware it will be more exensive. However, isn't a Dish AV700e cheaper than a Archos 700? Same hardware, different firmware.
Guess I'm being optimistic/hopefull that if Dish does provide the hardware it will be cheaper than it's retail counterpart.

That said, I'd rather be able to build/buy/choose my own USB drive/enclouse.
I just have a feeling that they're gonna implement it the same way they do Pocket Dish.

 

[datwell]

I have no problem having my external drive content locked to my account. I would gladly accept this restriction.

But please allow me to purchase the hard drive that best fits my needs off of the open market.

Yes! and Yes!

---Doug

 

[vurbano]

I have no problem having my external drive content locked to my account. I would gladly accept this restriction.

But please allow me to purchase the hard drive that best fits my needs off of the open market.

I have no problem with a couple of Tb servers locked to my account. But one silly hard drive is ridiculous, IMO. Dish needs to think bigger. Just issue some software that must be present on the server or drive that only unlocks the files when a reciever is present. They dont need to sell any hardware unless they just want to rape you on the price.

 

[Smith P.]

Thats what they want to do. At the moment its locked to the receiver.

Wanna bet for a price of Maxtor external 500 GB ? Take it out and connect to other 622 - you'll see who's right . It's to late to do that, but anyway. Accepting my bet ?

 

[Tom Bombadil]

I agree, they should allow any number of drives to be used.

As we discussed before, they aren't likely to allow a saved program to be played back from the drive. You would have to copy it back to the 622 and play it from there. So put in some code which only allows a file created from your user account to be played back from a DVR also on your user account. Why should it care what archive drive it comes from?

Of course they will be fearful that people will hack their code and be able to freely distribute any recorded program. But that same risk is there today for PocketDish files.

But we should give Dish some leeway as it is likely that the studios and channel providers are giving them a lot of greef on this.

 

[Smith P.]

You're right - there is nothing related to coding, "marry" to DVR or account.

 

[Posty-McPOst]

True, but the PocketDish still says Archos on it too, but it's got different firmware and you can't by it "retail".

On a related note, a lot of people are saying they expect if Dish provides the hardware it will be more exensive. However, isn't a Dish AV700e cheaper than a Archos 700? Same hardware, different firmware.
Guess I'm being optimistic/hopefull that if Dish does provide the hardware it will be cheaper than it's retail counterpart.
.

An archos can play video files from your PC and transfer those files to any other system. Obviously for legal reasons a pocketdish can't be able to do that. It would make no sense to buy a retail achos and then reformat it for Dish use. The HDD's we are talking about would be formatted to the E* box regardless of origin. They are unformatted when you buy them retail and the Dish box would format the HDD for its own needs. This is nothing like the pocketdish example.

 

[Ilya]

As we discussed before, they aren't likely to allow a saved program to be played back from the drive. You would have to copy it back to the 622 and play it from there.

No, it actually plays directly from the external drive: I saw it at CEDIA.
You decide which programs you want to move to the external drive (move, not copy!), and you can then play them back from the drive directly. It takes about 1/3 of the play-back time to move an HD program and it can be done as a background task while you are watching other programs.

Initially they are going to use encryption key bound to the source receiver (meaning you will only be able to use the external drive with one receiver/DVR: if you move it to another one you will have to reformat it).

Later they are planning to offer a household key (bound to your account), in which case it will be possible to record the program on one DVR and then play it back on another receiver within the same account.

 

[Ilya]

By the way, with the household key it will be possible to play programs (off the external hard drive) not just on DVRs, but on non-DVR receivers too!

 

[Ilya]

The drive in the picture below says Maxtor, not Dish. It looks like a standard external HDD enclosure.

As I mentioned in another thread, they are just using this Maxtor as a prototype. They are not saying that this is what will be offered.
Technically it doesn't make a difference which brand to use, but they are waiting for a business decision on whether to offer a proprietary drive or to allow any third-party drive.
The main concern that they have on the business side is that they don't want to troubleshoot issues with third-party drives, or so I was told.

 

[Tom Bombadil]

That would be very nice. I was going off of information provided by one of the Chats, which are always of dubious reliability.

Although just because you saw it working a certain way at CEDIA doesn't mean that will be in production. I actually saw E* using the firewire port of a 921 to stream video at a CES once.

 

[datwell]

By the way, with the household key it will be possible to play programs (off the external hard drive) not just on DVRs, but on non-DVR receivers too!

Great!

Bring it on!!

I want it now!!! :



---Doug

 

[Smith P.]

<...>The main concern that they have on the business side is that they don't want to troubleshoot issues with third-party drives, or so I was told.

That's not news for us - look for that short list of approved [by Dish] internal disks starting from old model 501,508,510 and continue on 622.

 

[Ilya]

Although just because you saw it working a certain way at CEDIA doesn't mean that will be in production.

I am just passing what I was told.
The person who did the drive demonstration seemed knowledgeable, and he was doing the drive demonstrations almost exclusively.
Of course things may change by the time they get into production. But personally, I don't see them stepping back and requiring to move the programs back to DVR.
In fact, they explained that it will be possible to play programs on receivers that don't even have internal drives (once the household key is implemented).

 

[Posty-McPOst]

As I mentioned in another thread, they are just using this Maxtor as a prototype. They are not saying that this is what will be offered.
Technically it doesn't make a difference which brand to use, but they are waiting for a business decision on whether to offer a proprietary drive or to allow any third-party drive.
The main concern that they have on the business side is that they don't want to troubleshoot issues with third-party drives, or so I was told.

Right. It's not a technical/legal limitation as in the case of pocketdish. Do you have any idea if the drives will be pre-formatted or could be formatted via USB at home as some people have mentioned?

 

[Jolard]

Thanks for the great info Ilya.

If this is truly how it ends up working, I am fine. I love the idea of being able to play back directly from the HD without having to copy it.

However, I can't see how they would do this with a non-DVR receiver, as the remote does not have the required buttons, the software would have to be heavily revamped etc. Would be interesting to see.

That all said though, I still DO NOT want to buy a Dish drive for twice the price of what I can pick up an external HD from Best Buy with a rebate. It would just be a smart business decision for Dish to be neutral as to storage, even if they must lock the content to one receiver, or one account.

As we have read above, there are people out there with Terabites of RAID storage, and immaging how "locked into Dish" they will be if they have all their shows backed up on that server!

 

[Ilya]

Do you have any idea if the drives will be pre-formatted or could be formatted via USB at home as some people have mentioned?

The first time you connect it, you will get a message, something like "A new drive has been detected, would you like to format it?"

 

[Jolard]

The first time you connect it, you will get a message, something like "A new drive has been detected, would you like to format it?"

This would be perfect. That way in a year when my 500 GB drive is now obsolete and I can buy my new Terabite drive for $200, I will be able to retire the 500GB and use it as a networked backup drive for my PC, and instantly gain the additional storage space with my new Terabite drive.

However if Dish requires me to buy their branded $300 300GB drive, (which I could get for $99 non branded) and then I cannot buy a larger one for a few more years, I will be very upset.

Some may say I am overly passionate about this, but 30 hours on the 622 is just not enough space for recording shows. The external drive support is a much needed safety valve.