What you should know about the quality of your satellite equipment!

[WSInternational]

You think all satellite products are the same quality? You may think different after reading this article. Read on, you may be surprised at what you'll find out!​

As you know the economy is not at its best right now, and the satellite industry is no different than any other industry. Material suppliers, manufacturers, distributors, & dealers have seen a drop in business. Competition is at its peak on all channels. As business owners, we always have to come up with ways to stimulate business and increase sales in order to remain in business and keep our customers from going to the competition. We have a few choices when it comes to lowering prices to our customers without lowering our profit margins in hopes that we continue selling more products and keep our customers. Any company & business person knows that you can't drop your profit margin past a certain level by wanting to offer lower prices if you want to remain in business. So when we decide to lower our prices we also have to lower our cost on our products to still keep a comfortable profit margin. At this point we have a few options. Most common options to lower our cost is:

1. Lowering cost by using tier "B" material & supplies in products we manufacture. If you don't know what tier "B" materials are, read below for an explanation.

or

2. Continue using tier "A" material & try to negotiate with material suppliers to lower cost on the same material and not take away from the integrity and quality of our products.

Tier "A" materials are materials that have passed quality control and have been tested to perform to higher standard and are of a higher quality. Tier "B" materials are materials that have failed the quality control testing process of performing to a higher standard required for continuous and reliable performance, but still perform for a short period of time after use.

Unfortunately, in addition to selling tier A material, suppliers, specially overseas suppliers, also sell tier B material in order to minimize loss. Tier "B" material is usually sold at a reduced price of +/- 50% to the factories & manufacturers.

The most common & easiest option to a manufacturer or distributor is option #1 above. It does not take much work. Unfortunately when this happens, the consumer and dealer alike, have to be stuck with inferior product that they need to support for their customers.

When you see a dramatic drop in prices from a distributor, you have to ask yourself how is the distributor able to all of the sudden drop their prices, permanently cut their profit margin and still be able to offer a quality product. Something just does not add up.

We have recently received many complaints from new customers who have switched to us for better quality products stating that they were glad to see prices drop from their previous distributors, but the quality of the products and performance is not what it used to be. They have issues with their customers who demand good quality. They say that they are not able to get warranty service on the product, and having to hassle with their own distributor over the quality of product the distributor offers.

WS International only uses tier A material in our WS International line of satellite products.

I'm sure you have seen reviews of WS International products done by actual customers and hobbyists on many knowledgeable and honest discussion forums like SatelliteGuys.us and LegalFreeToAir.com. You have seen time after time that our products outperform and smoke the competition. Unlike some of our competitors, we don't ask our dealers and resellers to do bias product reviews because the fact that they sell our products would make them obviously bias. This would be very unfair to the end-user and provide one-sided information. We ask end-users who use the products on a daily basis to review our products and give us their most honest opinion. You can see these honest opinions and reviews on many trusted & largest online discussion forums like the ones named above.

Now you know why WS International products offer a 2-year warranty. We take pride in providing customers with quality products and only use tier A material and negotiate with our material suppliers for lower cost based on our buying power. We don't believe in cutting corners & sacrificing quality in order to offer lower prices. We offer low prices based on our ability to purchase in larger quantities. WS International manufactures the highest quality satellite receivers, Ku band and C band LNB and LNBFs while offering unbeatable prices for the quality of products we manufacture.

If you want cheap & inferior products and don't care about quality and performance, I suggest you continue purchasing equipment from other distributors that offering this. However, if you want reliability, quality, and performance, with less headaches, rely on genuine WS International brand of products.

While others try to compete based on price alone, we compete based on price, reliable quality, and reliable service. This is why WS International is the only company in North America that offers an entire 2-year warranty on our WS International brand of LNB, LNBFs, and LEXIUM line of satellite receivers and meters.

Thanks for taking the time to read this article & becoming more aware of the satellite equipment you purchase. I hope this helps you become more aware of the quality of products offered by us.

Robby Dosetareh
CEO, WS International


For those of you who have not seen our behind the scenes video of our LNB / LNBF, Signal Finder, and Switch factory, I have included a couple of them below also. Enjoy and for more videos, please visit our YouTube page


YouTube - WS International LNBF Factory - Final Inspection step

YouTube - LNB LNBF Testing At WS International Factory

 

[PopcornNMore]

I just wish these products would be manufactured here in the United States to create jobs for Americans.

 

[zamar23]

Hi Robby,

Speaking of quality, are there many "no name" products on the market copied from some brand names? Do you find it necessary to patent your products for protection, or given fast model update its just wasting of time and money?

Speaking of LNBs, do you think that Invacom traditional models no longer stay ahead of more resent LNB brands including yours, while being a lot more expensive? What consumer LNB brands you consider the best - apart from yours of course?

Also, I happen to have a couple of WSI 4-12 brackets that you don't make anymore. Why did you stop making them? The plastic is quite strong: what was the plastic brand you used for them?

 

[chadg2]

Amen on jobs for Americans!

 

[WSInternational]

I feel the same way....

I'm there with you and I wish the same also. But as we all know, the price would be through the roof, and unfortunately with the economy and the competitive market the way it is now, it makes it close to impossible, which is another reason why the US economy is not doing so well. I wish we could make them here in the States and keep the monies we spend here, and create more jobs for the American population, but unfortunately most customers are very cost sensitive.

Take Winegard as an example: The Winegard DS2076 76cm satellite dish costs distributors over 100% more. When we import our WS International WS7630 75cm dish antennas, all costs including transportation, taxes, and duties, we are still over well over 100% lower in cost than the price we pay for the Winegard DS2076. Obviously, the quality of material is also much higher and Winegard uses a much thicker gauge of steel. Fortunately enough for us, based on the formula for the WS International WS7630, it actually outperforms most 75cm/76cm antennas including the Winegard DS2076

 

[LocutusOfBorg]

I'm there with you and I wish the same also. But as we all know, the price would be through the roof, and unfortunately with the economy and the competitive market the way it is now, it makes it close to impossible, which is another reason why the US economy is not doing so well. I wish we could make them here in the States and keep the monies we spend here, and create more jobs for the American population, but unfortunately most customers are very cost sensitive.

Take Winegard as an example: The Winegard DS2076 76cm satellite dish costs distributors over 100% more. When we import our WS International WS7630 75cm dish antennas, all costs including transportation, taxes, and duties, we are still over well over 100% lower in cost than the price we pay for the Winegard DS2076. Obviously, the quality of material is also much higher and Winegard uses a much thicker gauge of steel. Fortunately enough for us, based on the formula for the WS International WS7630, it actually outperforms most 75cm/76cm antennas including the Winegard DS2076

I may be out of touch but I wonder if American made products are really that more expensive than foreign made products. The labor is cheaper in foreign countries but I find it hard to believe that with shipping costs, especially from Asia, and import duties that the products are substantially cheaper. I'd be willing to spend an extra 5% to have a 100% American made product.

 

[dougruss]

If it were made in a American Shop, it would probably wind up being Unionized...there goes the Huge Cost factor right there. The Unions have priced themselves out of most markets.
And yes...I worked in a Union Shop for 40 years before Retiring.

 

[SatelliteAV]

Robby,

I thank you for taking a stand to call out on an issue that you and I have spoken about many times!

Customers remember quality products and great customer support!

KUDOS my Friend!

 

[Pixl]

I may be out of touch but I'd be willing to spend an extra 5% to have a 100% American made product.

That is generous of you.
It won't even pay the sales tax in the state it gets mfg. in.

 

[Bob2011]

Watch the first video and remember each person there is $1 per hour and that same person in America is $10 per hour. Watch the second video and realize that to get an American to work that fast would require $20 per hour.

It is frustrating on this end to know that the wholesale on these LNBs are $1 to $2 yet we pay $10 to $20 or the wholesale for a dish is $5 to $10 yet we pay $80 or $100.

 

[SatelliteAV]

wholesale on these LNBs are $1 to $2 yet we pay $10 to $20 or the wholesale for a dish is $5 to $10 yet we pay $80 or $100.

Please..... Tell me where we can buy quality products at these prices. Do you want a job as our company buyer? I'll pay you the difference between your quote and our price and you can be a rich man! LOL!!!!!

 

[zamar23]

It is frustrating on this end to know that the wholesale on these LNBs are $1 to $2 yet we pay $10 to $20 or the wholesale for a dish is $5 to $10 yet we pay $80 or $100.

Another side of the story is that apart from claims of high quality there is no objective independent (or even internal) performance comparison data presented to support such claims. And no definition of Quality is given. For example, I'd like to see a list of commonly known desirable to receive locally weak signals reception comparison data presented for the equipment advertised as measured against the leading competitor's products. Possibly including some products although not expensive but of high quality available in Europe like Inverto brand LNBs, GT-Sat and such.

Yet another thing is that keeping LNB prices rock bottom down is important mostly for dealers and installers, but not end users. Given total new system price at $500+, LNB price variations at +/- $10 are irrelevant, while difference in performance and durability, as well as possibly poor matching with dish specs will drastically affect weak signal reception for years, and may lead to frequent LNB replacement, adding service and shipping costs. So I doubt that price is the only factor to account for, when offering new products. For direct sales to users educating customers is an important factor too.

 

[AcWxRadar]

The idealistic product would be one "MADE IN THE USA", with the absolute highest quality, durability and performance. Designed and fabricated and assembled by an "immigrant" or a "native" who considers themselves to be an American and who will fight you if you don't respect them as such. And, who is paid well for their services and takes pride in their craftmanship and expertise. One who is committed to the quality of the product and has great loyalty and devotion and pride in the company they work for. And, that product is sold to the final consumer at the lowest possible cost with a lifetime warranty to make a statement about the company's overall pride in the product.

Now, we have to build our manufacturing plant in the most ideal location. Someplace with a park full of trees and green grass and swingsets for the children to play on in the courtyard surrounding the factory, with daycare facilities and a gymnasium and think tanks and meditation centers.

In the 1986 comedy "Back to School", Rodney Dangerfield suggests that we build this factory in "Fantasy Land".

What we all must realize is that the laws and the unions of today are hindering us as a manufacturing superpower because they have outlived their original intent and purpose.
Unions and labor laws were absolutely necessary when they were first devised, but now they are no longer protecting jobs, they are sabotaging them. We, as a people, have become spoiled in our jobs and careers.

The overseas workforces eagerly work for cheap wages (by our standards) because to them their wages are fabulous.

My opinion is, that they need unions and we should reduce them. Over time, it will eventually balance out so that wages and benefits are the same everywhere, but that does not happen with a click of a switch. But, just think about it. What if the wages overseas were the same as here and the benefits were the same? And the tax benefits for the companies were the same in all countries? And the environmental laws were the same and the liabilities were the same... That is the only way to balance everything - everything but transportation costs. Then, barring transportation costs, the world could really become a true free enterprise market system where quality and price compete based upon the ingenuity of the the dreamers, inventers and entrepreneurs and savvy business minds alone (and not through the advantage of less expensive labor).

This situation reveals the truth of a global economy. You can do nothing to change it other than to work harder for less and be more frugal until the pendulum swings.

The preceding has been my personal lecture on economics and pricing. Now I want to state that I admire all the sponsors of our forum and that I have bought products from nearly all of you (98%). I continue to do business with you and will so in the future as my need arises because of one major fact that is in existence... Regardless of the product, it is your personal and your company's dedication as a whole towards service to me as "The Customer" that makes me feel as though I am the center of your attention when I am researching, browsing, buying or servicing any of your products or any of the products that you sell. It is your committment to me as the consumer that really sets you apart from most all other companies that I may deal with. Wether they be related to this hobby or other avenues.

From myself and for as many members that agree with me, I just want to say "THANKS" to all of the sponsors, equipment retailers and wholesalers here who have done such a grand job of supporting us in our hobbies, namely FTA and subscription satellite TV, as well as supporting us in other related ventures. I know that I am often long winded, but that is simply because I believe that what I say is important.

RADAR (Gordy)

 

[turbosat]

Thanks to our dealers who brought a little insight into the realities they face daily. The frustration they must deal with in providing manufactured goods must be tenfold to what we as consumers face, yet they still hang in there. All of us who look for parts and pieces should continue to support them.

 

[Beano_face]

I like the WS lnbf's... I have 2..

is there any adavtege to the new KU esx522 lnbf? I have the dmx522 and the specs are identical...

 

[rv1pop]

The value to most people is not in a "built in USA" STB. Cheaper is usually better. Are airplanes different to you?

Every wing for a Boeing 737, 747, 757, 767, and 777 was built in the USA and fits together and fits on the airplane and works. The wings for the Dreamliner aka 787, as I have been told by the mechanics who assemble the aircraft, are made overseas and so far the wings can not even be assembled without complete rebuild.

My life will never depend on a STB. It has depended on the integrity of the 777 and the 767. I was a passenger on a 777 flying out of a typhoon in Japan. The flight controllers only let the Boeing planes (a 737, a 747 and 2 777's) take off. Airbus sat on the ground for 2 days.

I have a very old C-Band STB that says Made in USA. My current STB came from our Gold Sponsors. I believe they will always stand by their products. But again,my time is worth money, but my life will never depend on the STB (unless it is so unsafe it can not be UL listed).

 

[T4Runner]

Another side of the story is that apart from claims of high quality there is no objective independent (or even internal) performance comparison data presented to support such claims. And no definition of Quality is given. For example, I'd like to see a list of commonly known desirable to receive locally weak signals reception comparison data presented for the equipment advertised as measured against the leading competitor's products. Possibly including some products although not expensive but of high quality available in Europe like Inverto brand LNBs, GT-Sat and such. .....

One of the sponsers (Tele-Satellite) does indeed do comparisons and analysis of LNB's and satellite receivers. Whether they are truly independant or not I'm not sure, as the companies are also advertising in their magazine. It is a great magazine, but became too expensive to me for 6 issues a year; so I read the free copy on-line only now...

 

[zamar23]

Thanks for the reminder. Tele-Satellite now becomes mostly a presentation portal for sat industry "faces", but very little comparison analytics lately. Still it's better than nothing at all, just "cheap and good" motto. IMHO, more comparison data if objective would do a lot better job in promoting good products than small CN production video. Could you point to a resent in-depth performance comparison of LNBs and dishes on US market done by that magazine or anyone? I couldn't find one, but may be didn't try hard enough. Yet found dated but still interesting issue with Sadoun's ad on p.60 there. Also remains unclear, in what aspects new models are better compare to older ones and currently being sold, I mean looking beyond their stickers and strait to reception data.

 

[WSInternational]

Hi Robby,

Speaking of quality, are there many "no name" products on the market copied from some brand names? Do you find it necessary to patent your products for protection, or given fast model update its just wasting of time and money?

Speaking of LNBs, do you think that Invacom traditional models no longer stay ahead of more resent LNB brands including yours, while being a lot more expensive? What consumer LNB brands you consider the best - apart from yours of course?

Also, I happen to have a couple of WSI 4-12 brackets that you don't make anymore. Why did you stop making them? The plastic is quite strong: what was the plastic brand you used for them?

Hi Zamar,

Those are very good questions and I'm glad you've asked.

Yes & No. There are some products that you see on the market that are developed by a specific manufacturer, and are copied by other factories because of its popularity. You see less of that with LNBFs, unless it's a unique one similar to the Invacom QPH031. As I'm sure many know, the QPH031 was copied by a factory and is readily available from a distributor in Canada. Note, I said copied and NOT knocked off.

While I'm on the subject, let me clarify one thing: You may have noticed some companies say a particular product with a different model number is a knock-off of another product. This is solely a marketing practice used to fool customers into buying their products and here is why. A knock-off is a product that is copied and uses the same model number and brand in order to take advantage of the name and model numbers popularity to sell it and make a profit. When a factory makes the same product for two companies and under two different brand names and model numbers, this would not be considered a knock-off because 1. It's the same factory that makes the product, and 2. Even if it's not the same factory, the product uses two totally different brands and part numbers. But, say the words knock-off to a couple of gullible customers, and they will fall for this elementary marketing practice. For example, take Luis Vuitton. When their products are knocked off, they are trying to take advantage of the brand name. Now take this example: This marketing practice is like Ford saying that the Chevy Silverado is a knock off of the Ford F250 !sadroll Another example is that back in the hack era, you would actually see Pansat receivers being knocked off by another factory using the same name and model number.

I think in our industry, you would patent a technology rather than a product like a LNB/LNBF. I'm actually working on a new product whose technology I'm patenting. This is to keep it from being distributed by others here in the USA. Doing the patent this way is a lot more effective than let's say if you were to patent a particular design or model number of a product. For example when blind scan first came out, if it was patented, it would keep other factories from legally being able to use the technology without permission. Now you see this technology being used as a standard on almost every set top box.

I think Invacom created great performing LNBF at the time they came out. I was never a fan of the quality, but in that time and era, they were the best performing LNBF on market. There is a difference between a high quality product and a good performing product. A product can be made of high quality parts, but may not perform as good as a product that is made of lower quality parts. Now you see higher quality LNBFs that also outperform the Invacom.

Apart from our WS International brand of C band LNB & LNBFs, and Ku band LNB & LNBF I would have to say the Satellite AV line of Geosat Pro LNBFs are upon some of the higher quality LNBFs. I know Brian has spent literally years in developing them and he prides himself in using top quality products as I'm sure many will agree.


As for the WS24 bracket, we purchased those from a factory that was making them already. Honestly, since it was such a long time ago, I do not remember exactly the type of plastic they used. But you are absolutely right. It's very strong and durable. We started to carry those brackets because we had many customers who wanted to get AMC 4 (SES1) and Galaxy 19 at the same time. This was the only bracket we found at the time that you would not need to bend or modify in order to get 4-degree spacing. Now that we have the ESX5421U 4-degree monoblock, we stopped carrying the bracket.

 

[WSInternational]

Robby,

I thank you for taking a stand to call out on an issue that you and I have spoken about many times!

Customers remember quality products and great customer support!

KUDOS my Friend!

Absolutely Brian. As you and I have discussed before, I think satellite installers & hobbyists who can spend literally thousands of dollars on satellite equipment should know the truth behind what goes in to making a product. From our discussions, I think you and I see eye to eye as far as offering customers good reliable products that will not cause them headaches in the future.