DVR crashes 38 times in one month, 5 units replaced so far

[Astrovel]

I need advice from somebody who knows Dish Network equipment. I have the model that is used to run one TV only. From the day they installed it, I have had nothing but trouble. Their answer to the problem is to replace the unit. It has been replaced 5 times.

What happens is: Screen goes blank, unit turns itself off, window stating "no signal" comes up, then after about one minute, it turns itself back on and goes through the satellite search, window comes up says "searching for satellite" and then it searches for the TV guide. After all the searching, picture comes back. This happens sometimes once per night, sometimes 5 times one after the other in one night. It has crashed 38 times in one month. It screws up the DVR recordings and makes me miss part of the program I was watching.

There have been 3 techs out who physically checked the outlet (it's within tolerance) the setup inside (cableing). They can't find anything wrong. Their answer is that the unit is defective and needs to be replaced. One tech said they don't have as much trouble with the units that run more than one TV as they do with the model I have. But they won't upgrade the equipment unless I pay $200 or sign a new 2 year contract.

I got as far as the Vice President level and that is the best they can offer. They said they have thousands of this model out in the field and have not had any problems like this from any one else. They said they would replace the unit one more time (5th) and if this one turned out to have the same problem, it is something with the wiring in my house. I would have to have an electrician come out and check the circuits and the wiring because it has to be something in my house that is causing the problem, not their unit. But nothing else on that outlet fails to operate, the TV, the DVD player, the VCR player. They said "But those items don't have a hard drive". (What difference does that make???)

They said once I receive the new unit, plug it into a surge protector. Now, I had it plugged into a surge protector before and somewhere around the 3rd unit, they said, take it out of the surge protector and plug it directly into the wall because Dish's equipment is sensitive and needs to have a constant flow of electricity. And now the VP is saying plug it into a surge protector. They ran an ethernet cable from my computer to the unit which was supposed to tell them if the unit began malfunctioning. But nobody monitors that signal.

To test if it is the wiring in my house, I ran an extension cord from my art studio which is on an entirely different electrical service (with separate billing each month) and plugged the unit into that electrical source. It ran for about 4 days without an issue. Then bam! The unit crashes again. I have continued to leave it plugged into this source to see if it would crash again and so far it hasn't, 2 days. But my life doesn't revolve around the TV so some days/nights the TV isn't even on, so I don't know if it might have crashed those nights of inactivity or not. I don't want to sign another 2 year contract (I am 76 yrs old, I may be dead in another year....who knows?.....I don't want my husband saddled with a 2 year contract if something happened to me) and I don't feel I should have to pay for an upgrade when I pay for a warranty each month and pay my bill on time and pay for the service of a constant source of TV.

I would like to know if the LNB would have anything to do with it crashing. They say that wouldn't have anything to do with it crashing. FYI, I have a Hi Def antenna on a pole which I can receive good pictures and the LNB is supposed to be a Hi Def.

Does ANYBODY have any idea what is going on with this unit? All I want is a unit that will stay on instead of crashing.

 

[Chimera]

Is the unit in an enclosed space (tv cabinet or something)? Overheating is one thing that receivers hate....

 

[Mr Tony]

unless I missed it, which model DVR is it?

 

[TBoneit]

All it takes is a momentary blip in the power to cause the problem you are seeing. Forget the surge protector go get a uninterruptible power supplies (UPS). I wouldn't run my DVRs without one.

 

[KAB]

All it takes is a momentary blip in the power to cause the problem you are seeing. Forget the surge protector go get a uninterruptible power supplies (UPS). I wouldn't run my DVRs without one.

Agreed. There would appear to be problem in the house (perhaps grounding) if the power from studio seems more reliable. It is also possible that there is a problem in the power grid in which you live. Earlier this summer, we were having two to three power blips a day for about a month. All is well now. Get the UPS. My bet is the problem is other than the receiver itself, whatever it may be. The odds are against five bad receivers in a row.

Do you have a computer that runs constantly? If so, has it ever gone off? Blips would make that happen.

 

[papalittle]

check you outlets polarity, I found some receivers are more sensitive to reverse polarity at the outlet.

 

[Hall]

Does ANYBODY have any idea what is going on with this unit?

There's no realistic way you've gotten (5) 'bad' receivers in a row. Based on your description, I agree with the others that it's a power issue. You are losing power or it's dropping below the threshold that the receiver can handle and it's turning "off". Because it's a "blip" in the power, it immediately turns back on (until the next "blip").

As suggested, get a "UPS". You might be able to get one at Walmart, for example. If not, office-supply stores like Office Depot or Staples sells them. Get the smallest (and lowest-cost) one they sell. You do NOT need "30-minute backup", for instance. You need seconds, hence why the smallest unit will work.

Something that looks like this, Tripp Lite UPS, is fine.

 

[hyperguy]

Do not use a power strip or a UPS plug it directly into the wall with adapter on the plug that goes from 3 prongs to 2 prongs (most dollar stores have them) and cut our ground wire or unhook it from the ground block . I install Dish and the receivers sometimes have issues with the grounding eliminated the ground works 95% of the time. Of course the current one may already be gone also make sure they replace the separator on the back and don't keep using the same one by swapping cables. I have seen this problem before and the solution works.

 

[Barry Erick]

Dirty power. That is the common thread. A voltage check won't tell you. It can be from poor wiring to the outlet (which a no load meter would not show, but a resulting fire would.) A UPS can get around that but I would make sure the outlet is perfect before protecting your equipment and not the house.

 

[whatchel1]

Is the dish grounded outside? And the receiver inside uses a ground. If this is the case then you have different potential between the 2 grounds and that is really possible that is the problem. Anyway it is most likely you are getting power coming back thru to receiver thru the ground and frying the units. It is probably time to call the electrician.

 

[gdarwin]

Do lights in the house flicker when the receiver reboots? I had a problem where the whole house lighting would flicker at random times causing the UPS's on the receivers and computer to kick in. Turned out to be a bad neutral connection at the transformer at the pole. You need to call your electric company to check this type of problem out. Mine attached a voltage recorder on the house meter and let it collect data for a whole week before they found the problem. They kept pointing fingers at the house neutrals. I hired an electrician to eliminate the interior wiring.

 

[Astrovel]

Sorry for the delay in responding. I thought they would email me if someone posted an answer.
Iceberg: the model is VIP612 SOLO DVR (At least I think that is what it is).
KAB: My computer is way across the room and doesn't pull a lot of juice, the only thing that is going on when we are watching TV is my virus scan and it has never had a crash.
Papalittle: The tech checked the plug polarity and said it was fine and should not be the problem.
Hyperguy: Thanks for the tip. I will try that and see if there is a difference.
Watchel1: I am pretty sure it is grounded outside. I couldn't get the tech to climb up on the roof and check the connections up there. He said he would have to drill holes every 6" in my roof because he didn't have a harness. He said a contractor would have to go up there. They are not allowed to climb on the roof. This doesn't make sense to me. You climb on the roofs of houses all the time when you do a new install. I don't have a 2 story house. I could climb up there myself except at my age, it doesn't make good sense to do that. If I lost my balance and fell off, a couple of broken hips would fix me up good.
What I don't understand is that everything else works on that outlet, I have tried other electrical appliances to test it, vacumn cleaners, lamps, toasters, drills, etc. they all work fine on that outlet. So
why wouldn't the blip show up when testing these items out?

Nobody answered my question about the LNB? Could a faulty LNB create this kind of problem?

Thanks all, for your great input. I will check all your suggestions out. ASAP

 

[hyperguy]

I doubt its a LNB usually if the receiver is re-booting its a power issue.

 

[Hall]

KAB: My computer is way across the room...

Reason for the question about the PC was, I presume, does it also reboot randomly ? The DVR is nothing more than a PC too...

What I don't understand is that everything else works on that outlet, I have tried other electrical appliances to test it, vacumn cleaners, lamps, toasters, drills, etc. they all work fine on that outlet. So
why wouldn't the blip show up when testing these items out?

Did you leave the vacuum or lamp or toaster or drill running for hours or just a plug-in-and-check-if-it-turns-on test ? Is the DVR working right now ? I'm sure it is actually. Here's an idea: Plug a lamp into the same outlet. I presume it's got (2) plugs. Have the DVR in one and the lamp in the other. Turn the lamp on. If you're watching TV when the DVR "crashes", see if the lamp dims or flickers at the same time.

 

[chicagonettech]

Does ANYBODY have any idea what is going on with this unit? All I want is a unit that will stay on instead of crashing.

Sounds like you have some electrical line voltage swings and / or noise issues. Modern electronic equipment hates voltage fluctuations of any kind.

Even running the extension cord to your art studio, you were, more than likely, receiving electrical power from the same feed on the power grid - they tend to cover large areas.

Unfortunately, the demands now placed on the power grids, along with the fact that the power grids in this country have not been significantly upgraded in more than 50 years, causes noise and power fluctuations to be rampant. They are death to electronics. In Chicago, we live about 1/2 mile from several book binderies which have huge power demands. Instead of keeping their power within 5% of the rated voltage, as required by Federal regulations, ComEd allows the power to bounces as high as 135, and as low of 98 volts. When you put a scope on the line, the garbage and noise would wake the dead.

We now run Tripp-Lite SMART 1000 LCD backup battery / surge protectors / voltage regulators on ALL of our electronic equipment - including our computers, Dish Network receivers, televisions, and surround sound systems. The unique thing about this particular Tripp-Lite is that it will actually clamp the power DOWN to a safe voltage if it goes up too high. It will also boost the voltage level if it goes too low, and give us between 20 and 30 minutes to properly power down equipment in the event of a total power failure. [We're lucky from that respect and have had only one total power failure which lasted more than 20 minutes during the last 15 years.]

UPS units will not power extremely high loads or loads which require anything except an electronic load. When we run the projectors to show 16 and 35 mm prints for our local film society group, the bulbs on our projectors were burning out every 20 minutes - because of high power line voltages. At more than $35.00 per bulb, that gets old quickly. The issue was too high a line voltage. We solved that by purchasing a boost and buck transformer, for about $85.00, on eBay, and haven't burned a bulb out since then. The model we purchased holds the voltage steady at 120 volts, but provides no standby power in the event of a power failure. The high wattage of the bulbs in the projectors negate the ability to use a standard UPS.

Since adding these Tripp-Lite SMART 1000s to our home entertainment systems, we have had ZERO problems with any equipment. They cost about $100.00 each, carry a $250,000 connected equipment insurance provision, and are manufactured by an AMERICAN company - Tripp-Lite - based in Chicago. Incredible tech support!

Clean, reliable, regulated power will make all equipment run better and last a lot longer.

NOTE: Running the DN receivers on any kind of surge protector or UPS will disable the ability to use DISHCOMM. In our case, that is not a problem because we pre-wired with multiple phone and data connections in all of the rooms when we rehabbed the house.

 

[Tyralak]

Watchel1: I am pretty sure it is grounded outside. I couldn't get the tech to climb up on the roof and check the connections up there. He said he would have to drill holes every 6" in my roof because he didn't have a harness. He said a contractor would have to go up there. They are not allowed to climb on the roof. This doesn't make sense to me. You climb on the roofs of houses all the time when you do a new install. I don't have a 2 story house. I could climb up there myself except at my age, it doesn't make good sense to do that. If I lost my balance and fell off, a couple of broken hips would fix me up good.

He's trying to keep his job. What he said was absolutely correct about policy for in house technicians. When on a roof, we are to wear fall protection at all times. You get caught on a roof during a safety check without your harness, you can get suspended or fired. Simply because someone else got up there at some time to install the dish, doesn't mean this tech is going to. It doesn't matter if it's a low, safe roof. If he goes up there without a harness, he's taking his job in his hands.

 

[upsss]

Astrovel,
You definitely have a power line problem and not an equipment problem. You don't have to believe me I am ONLY a Power Supply Electrical Engineer. Plugging lamps, toasters and electrical drills in the outlet doesn't NOT proof anything. Your satellite receiver and most computer power supply will reset (receiver/computer will reboot) if the power line drops below 90V for more than one line cycle which is 16 ms (16 thousands of a second). Just for reference, your eye blink lasts 300 ms! Your eye cannot see 16 ms of power interruption!

Any time there is a high power interruption due to contact discontinuity it will cause a spark (ark) which could be a fire HAZARD. You need to call your power company and they should install a power monitor for a week at the power entrance to your house. Any power interruption at that point is their responsibility. If the power entry is "clean" then you have to hire a qualified electrician and they should check and monitor all your house wiring including your fuse box. I would do that ASAP!

As some suggested, UPS (Uninterrupted Power Supply) will solve most problems due to power line fluctuation (beyond your and the power company control). However, if you have faulty wiring in your house it is a fire hazard and a UPS will just mask your problem.

 

[upsss]

One more thing to point out. A main reason for power line problem in older homes is Aluminum wiring. If your house was built in the late 60's and early 70's (in the US) it is almost certain that it was built with Aluminum wiring (several years later Aluminum wiring was outlawed). If you have Aluminum wiring in your home and the problem was never addressed by a qualified electrician that would be my first thing to check and fix.

 

[Lord_Vader]

As mentioned previously, heat might also be an issue. Is the DVR in a cabinet? They need as much air as they can get.

 

[upsss]

I would hope that Dish would rule out a heat problem after the second or third receiver and not replace 5 receivers and still NOT fixed the problem!