FTA HD Receiver and PVR timed recordings

[taxial]

Hey people. First off I'm new, from NS Canada, I consider myself a pretty advanced tech person and I'm about to enter into the world of FTA. These forums, and other sites are packed full of info, and I've done a couple days of research but can't seem to find any topic that touches on what I'd like to know. My main concern when buying a FTA receiver is how the PVR is going to function with HD channels. I'm currently debating getting the trusted SV8000HD (seems to have the most support) or I'm considering waiting for the CW4000HD to come out (also the NFusionHD looks good too) your opinion on that is welcome but here is the issue I'd like to know about. The receivers I've listed have dual tuners. So I can record something and watch something else. Great. I can set up a future recording too. Great. But I'm aware of the issues that hard drives have with trying to keep with the amount of data that is getting passed to them from a HD signal. So first question

How easy is it to set up future recording with the SV8000HD? Is it like a normal PVR where you can have a bunch of series recordings (I have 20 or more already on my current HD PVR so that will be my minimum need).

In order for me to be able to use an FTA ReceiverI need to be able to just set it up once and have them tape all the future episodes of that show at that recording time. Otherwise my wife won't let me keep it in our living room. HAHAHAHA..... seriously..... ^_^ So is that doable with the SV8000HD? Doable with the CW4000HD? (I'm guessing it's probably doable with any FTA PVR Receiver? but I'd like the people who have these already to chime in as I haven't been able to track down any evidence).

Most importantly though, HD. How well does HD record? This is crucial. Will it be choppy? I can handle an occasional flicker / audio drop / shutter. But only if it's like once every hour of recording and last less than a couple seconds. If HD recording isn't smooth then there is little hope for me to get a FTA PVR.

Also, a side question - Is the speed of the Hard Drive crucial to how HD works with an FTA receiver PVR (obviously if I get a receiver I'd get a drive with at least 7200.... but is that too slow... or does the hard drive speed even matter for a PVR?)

Thanks for taking the time to read through all that and send any input you want. (and if you have any suggestions for my choice in receiver I'm open to your input ^_^).

 

[turbosat]

You won't find much 24/7 HD on true free-to-air just yet, PBS I think, and some sports and news feeds you may find. As far as "support", if you are talking about supporting hacking, or stealing pay television, you're at the wrong forum. We don't condone or talk about the illegal interception of scrambled signals here.

 

[taxial]

Thanks for responding. But no I'm not talking about support in hacking or stealing pay TV. I didn't mention anything of the sort, I would hope that your not that rude to all new members trying to start out with FTA receivers. ??? S'allright though, I'm sure you get tons of people trolling just looking for some one off comments.

So, by support I'm referencing the fact that it has been out long enough that any bugs have been worked out, and updates have already been released. (which is the case for the SV8000 but not the NFusion or the CW4000). The receiver type isn't my main concern though, I just wanted opinions. The information I'm trying to gather is from people who own a HD FTA PVR receiver so I can understand what the problems are (if any) with timed and future recordings. Is the interface easy? Can you set up multiple future recordings of a show? Does it record reliably?


And more importantly..... how well do the HD FTA Receivers record? Are the able to record HD signals smoothly? Do I need to consider the RPM speed of my hard drive? What are the pitfalls of HD recording - is the SV8000 reliable? Or is the technology for recording HD signals only ok ..... ?

Again, I ask because I don't have a receiver yet, the PVR and HD are the most important parts to helping decided on my purchase. I'd appreciate any insight ...

 

[empiretc]

sounds like you would be way better off with a tivo. every receiver has one quirk or another.

i.e. the sonic view is more of a vcr than a dvr according to all the reviews.


i have been very happy with my diamond 9000hd so far. I will see how well all the timed recordings work in the following weeks.

 

[Anole]

Yes, we do get a lot of folks trolling through, looking to receive Dish Network programming.
Your post wasn't very clear on the subject, so...
Also, if you'd done some homework on the HD programming, it'd be obvious that there isn't a whole lot to go around.

I hate to see anyone get into FTA with high expectations, and be disappointed.
I'd recommend you get a standard def system and learn the ropes.
We're here to help with that. - :up

The HD-capable receivers satisfy the needs of their users... who aren't necessarily the end-user (appliance operator) type.
Many take a bit of coddling (the receivers, not the users) -

Check out the threads in our Equipment Review department, for all the HD receivers.
I think you'll get quite an education.
Don't know how you came to the decision to get a SonicView 8000.
Must've read reviews somewhere.
Tell us and we'll all go read 'em , too.

I don't have an HD receiver for a number of reasons.
But most will let you record on timers like a VCR.
That is to say, no "guide-based" recording... because there is no guide to use.

 

[taxial]

Thanks for the insight. I have done a fair amount of research. I have gone through each major receiver (Diamond, SV, PanSat, NFusion, and CW) reading the reviews and comments from this forum (and many others). I guess my interest is in keeping my signal as crispy clean as possible no matter what I'm watching. I don't enjoy watching SD anything anymore. So snobish I know..... but really using Stand Definition isn't an option for me. Funny how once you move forward with that tech it's hard to move backward. I spoke at length with some other people last night ad The SV 8000 seemed like a good choice to me because it can record a HD program. I was unsure of it's capabilities though as a full fledged PVR. What I found out is that it is an excelent PVR, but cannot record TWO HD signals at the same time (which would allow me to watch one show, while recording another in the background). They told me what I'm looking for will be in the SV360 HD box. This should be coming onto the market sometime over the next couple months and has the PVR functionality to record two HD signals at once. Also, as for HDD speed, it is helpful to capture HD signals, using a 10000 RPM drive is the wisest, and the latest 7200.10 drives would be the next lowest for record HD signals. The other spindal speeds will all work, however as the RPM decreases the data transfer can become fragmented easier causing audio / video chop


Back to recievers - Another option may be the CW4000HD but since that box isn't out yet I'm not %100 on that - I need to do some more research, possibly call CW and see if that box offers that option. I'll be back to this forum soon with any information I can provide in case anybody else here is interested in what I'm trying to find out. And if any of you have any insight on my situation (for all I know I'm way off on this stuff .....) please feel free to post back with your input.

Thanks! ^_^

 

[empiretc]

i guess i am still confused, as there really isn't much full time HD on fta. Unless you are looking for one of these boxes for OTA - like I was.

But if you are, you have made it clear of all the features you want and none of these boxes are going to accomplish them completely. I'll say it again-

sound like you want a tee-vo.

 

[turbosat]

pardons

I'm sorry if I misread your intentions, there is a lot of that "support" related stuff posted here. Usually meaning 'illegal software support' lol.
FWIW, I don't have any HD equipment, but I can understand your desiring it. As others have said, I'd hate to say I preferred this one or that, while knowing there is very little variety in HD fta just yet, and have you feeling "I paid THIS for THAT?"
I'm going to wait awhile until there is more programming, and better receivers to watch it on, before investing.

 

[delta_charlie]

Thanks for the insight. I have done a fair amount of research. I have gone through each major receiver (Diamond, SV, PanSat, NFusion, and CW) reading the reviews and comments from this forum (and many others). I guess my interest is in keeping my signal as crispy clean as possible no matter what I'm watching. I don't enjoy watching SD anything anymore. So snobish I know..... but really using Stand Definition isn't an option for me. Funny how once you move forward with that tech it's hard to move backward.
---cut---

Hi Taxial, I'm sorry but I do not understand your obsession with HD. As others have mentioned there is not much HD on true FTA. I also have a HD tv and enjoy SD FTA for the unique content, stations and feeds.

Can I ask what are you interested in watching and recording in HD?

I can understand wanting to purchase a receiver that you would not out grow quickly; however, because there is not much HD on FTA it might make more sense to buy a low cost receiver to start with and get your feet wet.

If you really feel you can not enjoy SD then perhaps FTA is not for you.

BTW - Retro Jams on G18 is in HD (Horrible definition)

Later, DC

 

[taxial]

Haha Horrible Definition !!!! Nice. My interest is with the tech side of things. I recently met somebody who told me about FTA and I had honestly never heard of it.
I've already got the Canadian version of a TiVo (a Motorolla PVR) so I can already record HD and watch HD.... I don't plan on loosing it. For me.... it's the idea that there is a plethora of signals out there that I haven't even thought about. TV from Arabia!!! Holy Moly!!!

I understand the fet wet thing, but I don't see the point of paying even a discounted rate to get something that I will want to upgrade in a year to something that is in HD. Even if the shows from Arabia aren't in HD I know that there are some local ones that are and I want to enjoy them in that format. And really, eventually most shows will be HD.... some are there already, some will be there soon, some will be there in like 5 years. I don't feel like blowing a bit of money just to get a taste of what FTA provides .... me likey HD .... I'm a signal / picture quality snob ...(too bad for me eh.... 0_o). From what I'm finding out I think I just have to wait to future proof my purchase ...... I'll wait as long as I can ......

 

[Tron]

There's not much full-time (non-feed) HD on Ku-Band, but there's more on C-Band. For C-Band, you'd need at least a 6-foot dish though... In addition to more HD, there is more English-language programming on C-Band as well.

 

[taxial]

Thanks Tron - I really haven't done much dish research yet, so I"m not really sure how that all works. I have heard of Ku and C-Band - I was not sure how big or small of a dish I needed to have to see either of these. Six foot dish for C-band eh.... wow..... that's probably not cheap eh.

 

[taxial]

Wow, it's hard to get a straight answer on the internet I'll tell ya'll that. I've got conflicting information from operators that are telling me otherwise. I think the multiple satellite thing has made my question more complicated than I orignially thought. I'm going to dumb it down.

So I've got another question for anybody who has a HD receiver. I'll try and spell this one out a bit more clearly.

Can you record two HD signals at the same time as long as they are coming from the same transponder? If you can what receiver can do this (can the SV8000 do this?)

 

[schlever]

Taxial, most of the SD stuff you will find on true FTA is much better than anything you are going to find on cable or pay satellite, as it is mostly uncompressed. The HD stuff you will find is similar in that it is uncompressed for the most part as well. Like the others have said, there really isn't a whole lot of regularly scheduled programming out there, but most of us are in this for the feeds anyway.

As for a dish, start with at least a 36-39" KU dish, with or without a motor, and see if you like it. Anyone of our gold sponsors has them, as does ebay if you can find one with good shipping rates. A full KU package with a SD blind scan reciever (a must to find feeds) will set you back between $200-$400 bucks. A new C-band dish is probably in the $1000 range, but go for a drive in the country side and look around. Most people aren't using thier big dishes anymore and are willing to part with them for next to nothing or free if you ask. With BUDs, its the bigger the better

 

[empiretc]

Wow, it's hard to get a straight answer on the internet I'll tell ya'll that.

i'll say, you haven't answered any of the questions we have asked you.

 

[taxial]

Not that I want to start an argument with you empiretc - but I have tried to answer each question that has been asked of me. (Actually, reading back through the thread there really hasn't been that many) - Nor really sure what's up with the snarky comment. Is this typical of this forums senior members to new posters? Is something not clear to you about what I'm asking? I don't mind explaining it other terms - I might work with computers for a living but I've only been looking for information on FTA receivers for 2 weeks now. You may need to excuse my absolute newbie' like style in these forums. I am completely green.

 

[taxial]

As for a dish, start with at least a 36-39" KU dish, with or without a motor, and see if you like it. Anyone of our gold sponsors has them, as does ebay if you can find one with good shipping rates. A full KU package with a SD blind scan reciever (a must to find feeds) will set you back between $200-$400 bucks. A new C-band dish is probably in the $1000 range, but go for a drive in the country side and look around. Most people aren't using thier big dishes anymore and are willing to part with them for next to nothing or free if you ask. With BUDs, its the bigger the better

Thats awesome - thanks for the heads up. I started looking at dishes and was thinking I just could get away with something like a 31" or smaller. I will look into making sure I go no smaller than 36 when I start. Thanks!!! ^_^

 

[schlever]

Thats awesome - thanks for the heads up. I started looking at dishes and was thinking I just could get away with something like a 31" or smaller. I will look into making sure I go no smaller than 36 when I start. Thanks!!! ^_^

No problem. In Canada a 36" is probably the minimum. I have a 36" here in Regina and can pull in all but the weakest signals, so you may want to go a little bigger if possible. Keep in mind, as the size goes up, the motor requirements do as well.

 

[schlever]

Can you record two HD signals at the same time as long as they are coming from the same transponder? If you can what receiver can do this (can the SV8000 do this?)

Given the nature of feeds, the chances of two unique HD feeds "worth" recording being on the same transponder are minimal. FTA programming can best be summed up as the 'normal' networks like the RTN's on G18 and the stuff on G25, then the feeds. Feeds are usually backhauls from a specific event, i.e. a hockey or football game or a news truck on location. They are been sent back to the studio, unencrypted, to be edited and aired and do not include such things as commercials. During commercials, its a black screen or a camera feed of the announcer chatting with his camera man or even better on his/her cell phone.

You say you like HD programming, well you will be blown away by the quality of the HD signal on FTA. What your going to get is a feed of say a hockey game, in full uncompressed 1080i HD that is being sent back to the studio. Its not going to have commercials and may or may not have all the camera angles the 'polished' show has on regular network programming.

I hope that helps in your decision.

 

[rv1pop]

If you do not want to start with a starter receiver, would you really want to start with a starter dish? For KU band, for top level HD you will need at least a 1.2 meter (4 foot) molded or heavy steel dish (NOT A TIN ONE)! A GOOD 6 foot perferated dish should give very good results on KU HD. Make sure the mount is solid.
For C-band HD an excellent quallity 10 foot perferated is the minimum.

My training was in commercial broadcasting, so if you are talking QUALITY look at commercial equipment. The quality you are asking for points to individual components. Separate receivers and separate recorders. NO PACKAGED cheap consummer units. Maybe even separate dishes so no switches...

I and others are not sure what you are asking for. It sounds like you are looking for a Rolls-Royce at Yugo prices. Extreme quality is not inexpensive.