New Install: how long can the ground wire be

ScottChez

ScottChez

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There is a perfect place on the roof to put my new Dish install. It will make the dish more hidden and protected from wind. I do not want it on the side where there House ground is (I think it will look bad).

The trouble is the House Service ground is way on the other side.

How long can thr ground wire be? Would it be better for the the installer to put in a new Ground rod and then bound it to the main ground (still a long ground run).

What are my options.
Here is a picture to give you an idea of how far the run would be:

-----------------------------------------------
|----------------------------------------------|
|----------------------------------------------|
|----------------------------------------------|House Ground
|Dish------------------------------------------|Electric entrance
------------------------------------------------
 
VOOMER

VOOMER

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Ground

ScottChez said:
There is a perfect place on the roof to put my new Dish install.

The trouble is the House Service ground is way on the other side.

How long can thr ground wire be? Would it be better for the the installer to put in a new Ground rod and then bound it to the main ground (still a long ground run).


-----------------------------------------------
| |
| |
| |House Ground
|Dish |Electric entrance
------------------------------------------------

If at all possible run your drops from the dish to an area close to the ground source ,place your ground blocks there and Ground with a short gnd. wire ,then enter to your receiver locations.

Within 20 ft. is reccomended.
 
ScottChez

ScottChez

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Update:

Im looking at about 75'
from the Dish to Main Gound Entrance. All the Coax Drops are on the side of the house where I want to put the Dish.

If they used a Ground pole. Do they have to bound it to the main ground since were talking about a long run 75' (with the idea being there would be little chance of an arch at 75').

Ive read so many threads on this. Seems complicated. Im confused. Just want to make sure the installer does it right, and I know what to expect.
 
VOOMER

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ground?

ScottChez said:
Update:

Im looking at about 75'
from the Dish to Main Gound Entrance. All the Coax Drops are on the side of the house where I want to put the Dish.

If they used a Ground pole. Do they have to bound it to the main ground since were talking about a long run 75' (with the idea being there would be little chance of an arch at 75').

Ive read so many threads on this. Seems complicated. Im confused. Just want to make sure the installer does it right, and I know what to expect.

If you ran a dual RG6 with ground (#17 awg copper coated wire attached) that is all that needs to be grounded at dish mast.
This is for static discharge,and attaches to the ground block to complete grounding the dish itself.
Your coax drops need to be grounded (preferably) before they enter the structure ,and within 20 feet of the ground source.
This is where youre ground blocks come into play.Locating as close to ground source as possible you are able to ground without a lot of complicated grounding issues.
 
mudder1310

mudder1310

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You dish installer won't put in a ground rod. I'm pretty sure they aren't allowed by code. You'll have to have an electrician put one in.
Other options exist though. The tech can ground to cold water pipe so if you have a hose bib nearby that would suffice.
 
VOOMER

VOOMER

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ground

mudder1310 said:
You dish installer won't put in a ground rod. I'm pretty sure they aren't allowed by code. You'll have to have an electrician put one in.
Other options exist though. The tech can ground to cold water pipe so if you have a hose bib nearby that would suffice.[/QUOTE]

That is a For Sure a NO NO by code.
 
Foxbat

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If you end up with a separate ground rod for your satellite installation (like I did) you definetely need to bound them together by running a large-guage copper wire between the new ground rod and the service ground. This is a common source of a ground loop, which will show up as a persistant hum in your speakers, or possibly as a darkening of the screen that rolls down the screen every few seconds.
 
T

Tony S

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Foxbat is right. In your situation you are supposed to install a separate ground rod near the dish, and then bind the 2 ground rods together with a large gauge ground wire. I have a similar installation except that my two ground rods are only 25 feet apart.

Electrically, you would be much better off if you install the dish closer to your existing ground. At a distance of 75' the chances of ground loop problems increases.
 
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dalos2004

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Yes you can ground to a Metal water pipe. As long as the water pipe is entirely metal (not just the valve but the entire pipe.) That is an acceptable ground. You can also ground to your central ac unit electric cut-off box to if that helps
 
bcshields

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dalos2004 said:
Yes you can ground to a Metal water pipe. As long as the water pipe is entirely metal (not just the valve but the entire pipe.) That is an acceptable ground. You can also ground to your central ac unit electric cut-off box to if that helps

If there's one piece of PVC pipe in the line that'll nix your ground.

General rule: If the line from ground to dish is longer that ground to receiver.. then a second ground rod needs to be added closer to the dish, and bonded to the other one.

Your typical installer won't install a ground rod... at least not for free. Not part of your professional installation.
 
Mike500

Mike500

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UL and NEC 2002 requires that both ground rods be bonded with a #6 copper conductor. Use UL direct burial rated clamps.
 
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redhawk

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Mike500 said:
UL and NEC 2002 requires that both ground rods be bonded with a #6 copper conductor. Use UL direct burial rated clamps.

Thanks - I was just about to ask what consitutes a large cable - I have separate ground rods, but haven't had any of the problems above. But it's very wet along the Gulf coast, so that may be helping out - both rods probably close to if not actually touching water. Will correct as soon as I can get cable & parts.

Funny thing is, just had wireless internet service installed (Motorola Canopy, not Sat.). Installer insisted I put in a separate ground rod for antenna and network connection surge surpressor. I asked him to tie into electrical ground system already in house - he said that wouldn't meet code. Guess I might as well tie all three rods together?
 
ScottChez

ScottChez

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The Installer came out to check things out (install is delayed as the 942 is not in yet).

I do have a 220 volt service out side with a GFI for the Hot Tub.

Would it be aceptable to ground to that? It is near where the Dish would be. There are no water pipes near by so that is not an option.
 
ScottChez

ScottChez

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I forgot, he was also going to run the Twin Coax down to the 220 box, ground it there and run it back up where it would then go into the atic where all the drops are.

Would you not just use a heavy gage ground wire and run it to the Dish?
Or is it you cant do this becuase the 220 box is about 25' away?

It would be a DPP Twin LNB with a 2nd Sat for 148.
 
goaliebob99

goaliebob99

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-.-. .... .. -.-. .- --. ---
This is what were taught ( I work for DNS) for the dish to the ground blocks the messanger grounding wire is suffice. not sure on that distance.. but from the ground block to the grounding sorce (electric meter or entrance IE: the thick conduant that comes from the weather head to the meter box can be ran up to 15 feet.) Grouning to electrical conduant is a no no. unless its is the conduant described above. as far as grounding to water lines it must be 5 feet or less from where the water source enters the buliding in the basement or craw space. anything else is not concidered a proper ground according to DNS standards. Thats what were taught.
 
ScottChez

ScottChez

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Would this be acetable?

Run a new 8' ground rod right where the Dish is installed. Then run a heay ground wire to the 220 volt service where it has a GFI and its own heavy ground line back to the main house ground- so it would be correctly Bound.

Got two electricians looking at it also and a regional Dish installer, seems to get different ideas on what to do.
 
SimpleSimon

SimpleSimon

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You can NOT use a ground wire attached to a GFCI breaker as a primary ground.

Of course, the copper rod does the trick anyway. Everything else is just window dressing - unless you run into a very rare ground loop issue.
 
J

jtravel

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Jan 17, 2005
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All this talk about grounding had me interested to see what the Installer did when dish was installed here in Jan.
The Dish is on my roof near the over-hang and they Ran Twin cable under the over-hang then down the side of the house and thru the wall where its connected to the 522. I can't see any type of ground connection that was used at all.
 
R

R-U-Q-R-U

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jtravel said:
All this talk about grounding had me interested to see what the Installer did when dish was installed here in Jan.
The Dish is on my roof near the over-hang and they Ran Twin cable under the over-hang then down the side of the house and thru the wall where its connected to the 522. I can't see any type of ground connection that was used at all.

Same at my house. I called DISH and they are sending another "professional" installer out to do the grounding work. My dish is on the opposite side of the house from my electric meter so I am sure the original installer just did not want to bother.

My dish is near my A/C compressor. Can they ground to the breaker box for the A/C? I am concerned that they will just pound a grounding rod in and then I will have an unbound ground that will create ground loop interference.

Also, is correct that if I do NOT have a lightning arrest (rod) system they should NOT ground the dish, just the coax?

Thanks.
 

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