Question about signal strength on 72.7

ScubaGuy

SatelliteGuys Family
Original poster
May 19, 2014
62
73
Warm & Southerly
Hello All - my first post here. I've been casually reading and learning for about two years now (and I've learned a LOT - thanks!), but I have a question that I can't find the answer to, and I'm hoping maybe someone can point me in the right direction.

First of all, I don't want to give too much away about my situation, because I have a valid, paid account with Dish, and I want to keep it that way. I will say that I'm not in the States, though. However, myself, a lot of my friends, and tons of other people where I'm located have Dish service (and have for a very long time), and overall, it works well.

Most of us just pick up satellite 119 on a 4 foot to 6 foot dish, many also add 110 (just takes a little fabrication to make a bracket to add an offset LNB on the same dish), and some also pick up 72.7 on another 6 foot dish. There were some that also used 61.5, but when the new satellite went up (moving almost everything over to spot beams), most people stopped using it. I've even heard of some people picking up 77. In my case, I use one 6 foot dish for 119 and 110, and another 6 foot dish for 72.7.

My setup has been working pretty good for a couple of years, but occasionally I've had issues with reception on 72.7 (119 and 110 don't give any issues - excellent signal strength on both of them). I've re-aimed the dish for 72.7 more times than I would like to admit, have swapped cables, LNBs, ports - everything that I can think of (short of buying an 8 foot dish), to no avail.

This is my problem - some transponders have good signal strength, but others don't. I've noticed that the strength will change throughout the day. For the longest time, it didn't really matter, because the strength always stayed high enough for me to watch. However, then I started noticing that at certain times of day, I would lose certain channels. As of the last couple of weeks, I've now completely lost the signal on some transponders (unfortunately, these include the ones for the channels that I like to watch).

Here are my signal strengths from earlier this evening (about 6 pm):
NOTE - an * next to the signal strength number means that the screen said "Wrong Sat - Name Not Acquired!" in the lower left corner
Transponder-Strength
1-0
2-16*
3-17
4-28
5-0
6-18*
7-17
8-28
9-0
10-18*
11-18
12-30
13-0
14-19*
15-18
16-30
17-0
18-20*
19-19
20-29
21-0
22-18*
23-18
24-30
25-0
26-19*
27-19
28-30
29-1*
30-20*
31-19
32-32

You can see that there is a pattern - one transponder with 0, then one around 18 (plus the error message), another one around 18 (without the error message), and then one around 30. Then the pattern repeats. I've been around long enough to know that patterns usually happen for a reason (but what is it?!?).

Honestly, the channel that I watch most using 72.7 is Fox Sports 1 (for their NASCAR race coverage), and of course transponder 17 is now getting a strength of 0 (I would be thrilled if Dish would just move FS1 to one of the other transponders that I never watch, like 8, 12, or 16). Being forced to watch the Sprint Cup All-Star race this past weekend in SD was the straw that broke the camels back.

Some equipment info:
As already mentioned - two 6 foot offset dishes, one with single LNB for 72.7, one with two LNBs for 119 and 110 (all LNBs Dish Pro Plus)
A Dish Pro Plus 33 Multi-Dish switch
Dish Solo Node
Hopper with two Joeys

Many of the other people where I live that also try to pick up 72.7 have told me that they have the same types of issues with reception. I had one guy tell me that there is an older version of the DPP LNB that had better gain, but that they are very rare. Unfortunately, I have no idea what to look for, and scouring eBay hasn't done me any good, nor have I seen any mention about such a thing here or on the internet. I also had a guy tell me that I'm just going to have to buy an 8 foot dish, but he said that they're a couple thousand dollars, which I'd rather not spend. I'm guessing that I'm just screwed. However, it's very frustrating when I have decent signal strength on some transponders, but not on others. When I see other people here on the forum list their strengths, they are all typically pretty equal.

Does anyone have any idea as to why I'm seeing such different signal strengths?
Any suggestions as to how to correct the problem?

Thanks for reading....
 
Two questions: one what type of coax are you using and switch ? If all is good there would you be better off on the WA ? Remember when your box scans for satellites it scans low to high so the lower sats get loading into the box first and are never over written by say 119 signals.
 
The lnb you are talking about is a legacy lnb that does not use bandstacking. You can not mix legacy and the newer lnbs and the legacy is not compatable with your switch.

Eagle Aspen has a nice legacy that ia reported to have better reception in fringe areas. You would also need a new a new switch. I think the Dish model was a 64??.
Other manufacturers sell similar switch.

You are right on the edge of reception and either a higher quality (better manufactured) or bigger - 8 foot would help. Anything above 8 ft gets really expensive for KU frequencies.

Sent using SatelliteGuys Android App
 
Thanks everyone for all of the responses. I'll see what I can do to help you help me with some answers to your questions.

Two questions: one what type of coax are you using and switch ? If all is good there would you be better off on the WA ? Remember when your box scans for satellites it scans low to high so the lower sats get loading into the box first and are never over written by say 119 signals.

RG-6, plus all questionable connectors were replaced with PPC Outdoor Compression Connectors like this one:
Coax terminals.JPG


As I mentioned above, I have a Dish Network VideoPath Multi-Dish Switch Model DPP33 (see photo)
IMG_1906.JPG

Where exactly are you located? It could be you are on the fringe of the beam from the 72 sat.

I'd be happy to tell you, except that I don't want to get in trouble and have my account turned off just because I got found out here on this forum trying to make my service better. If it helps you, I'm somewhere near Florida. If someone can guarantee me that someone from Dish won't mess with me, I'll tell you exactly where I am. :)

He's outside the US and trying not to make trouble for himself, beyond his SS issue. ScubaGuy, did you look here:

Well, that's very interesting. I hadn't looked at the maps in a long time. I had looked at them when I was first making the plans for what equipment to buy and trying to determine what I wanted to do. The map that you've linked makes it appear that I'm not within the beam. However, when you look at both this other one (I tried putting the hyperlink, but kept getting a warning message saying that I can't because I'm too new) on satelliteguys for nimiq-5-72-7w-txl-conus and this one on satbeams.com footprints beam=6113, I am well within reception range. Why are they all so different? Plus, I didn't used to have as bad of an issue as I am right now. It has gotten worse over the last few months. There was a time that I wouldn't lose any of my transponders at all. Is it possible that the satellite has been repositioned recently?

That's a pretty big area, but I was not trying to start problems. Just thought a little more info would be helpful.

No problem.

The lnb you are talking about is a legacy lnb that does not use bandstacking. You can not mix legacy and the newer lnbs and the legacy is not compatable with your switch.

Eagle Aspen has a nice legacy that ia reported to have better reception in fringe areas. You would also need a new a new switch. I think the Dish model was a 64??.
Other manufacturers sell similar switch.

You are right on the edge of reception and either a higher quality (better manufactured) or bigger - 8 foot would help. Anything above 8 ft gets really expensive for KU frequencies.

Sent using SatelliteGuys Android App

Are you sure? I bought all of my equipment (well, everything except for the dishes) from an authorized Dish dealer in the States, and I'm using what he said I should buy. Plus, I've seen others here using the same stuff as me. Here's some pictures of one of them (although this is the one that I'm using for 110 - the 72.7 dish is on a much higher pole, but it has the same LNB):
IMG_1902.JPG IMG_1903.JPG

I was really hoping that someone might see the pattern that the transponders have and immediately be able to say "oh yeah, I've seen that before, you need to do this...". However, I also realize that problems like this can sometimes be very difficult to pinpoint.

Thanks again for the help so far. Let me know if there is anything else that I can do to help you figure this out.
 
it looks like you are having more of an issue with the odd transponders
have you tried another lnb on the 72 dish or tried putting it on a different input of the switch?
 
it looks like you are having more of an issue with the odd transponders
have you tried another lnb on the 72 dish or tried putting it on a different input of the switch?

I have tried moving my LNBs around to different positions, as well as putting the cables on different inputs on the switch (although I haven't done either recently), but I didn't see any difference.

I admit that all of the transponders that have a signal strength of 0 are odd numbers, that doesn't explain why some of the evens are mediocre and others are okay.
 
Okay guys, I've been doing a lot of experimenting this morning, and now I'm really confused as to what's going on.

First of all, since several of you have pointed at the LNB as being the issue, I swapped the LNBs between the dish that I pick up 72.7 on and the one that I pick up 119 on. I then did a Check Switch, and then immediately looked at signal strengths for 72.7.

After that, I moved all of the satellite inputs (just moved them in sequence - 1 went to 3, 2 went to 1, and 3 went to 2), did another Check Switch, and again immediately looked at signal strengths for 72.7.

However, then I exited out of the menus, and the screen changed to one where it said something about "Acquiring signal, this should take no longer than 5 minutes", and then after that it had something about how it was doing a Program Guide and DVR update. During this time I was studying the results of my signal strength checks, and was really confused as to why some of the numbers were so different than before. Then I decided to do another Check Switch, and got different signal strengths on some of the transponders than I had just gotten a few minutes before! And this was without making any other changes! It doesn't make any sense. I changed channels around to see if my favorites were working, and noticed that Nat Geo HD wasn't. I figured out that it was on transponder 26, and that is one of the ones that the signal had dropped out on.

I then decided to move the satellite inputs again (moved them in sequence again, same way), did another Check Switch, but this time exited out of the menus and let it do it's whole acquire signal/update guide stuff again. I then went back and checked my signal strengths again.

I then studied my numbers and compared them to the other readings, and noticed that transponder 26 had come back to an okay number, so I exited from the menus again, and tuned to channel 186 (Nat Geo HD). However, it wasn't coming in (screen all pixellated), so I went back and checked signal strengths again, and came up with different signal strengths on some of the transponders again! All I did was change channels!?

I'm really confused now. Anybody have any ideas? Is it possible I have a bad DPP33?

Here's a chart that shows all of the readings that I've written down. I also included my readings from the other day for comparison.

LNB May 19[SUP]th[/SUP],
6 pm
May 25[SUP]th[/SUP],
10 am; LNB
swap with one
from 119
May 25[SUP]th[/SUP],
10:20 am; Swap
all 3 cables on
DPP33
May 25[SUP]th[/SUP],
10:40 am;
after guide
update
May 25[SUP]th[/SUP],
11:00 am; Swap
all 3 cables on
DPP33 again,
and guide update
May 25[SUP]th[/SUP],
11:30 am;
After
changing
channels
1
2 16* 19* 2* 2* 16* 16*
3 17 20 18 2* 15 15
4 28 31 31 29 29 29
5
6 18* 14*
7 17 14
8 28 29 29 29 28 28
9
10 18* 16* 17* 0* 16* 2*
11 18 16 17 1* 15 3*
12 30 28 29 29 28 28
13
14 19* 4* 4* 15* 4* 16*
15 18 4* 4* 15 4* 15
16 30 28 29 29 27 27
17
18 20* 18* 17 3* 15* 5*
19 19 17 16 3* 16 4*
20 29 27 27 27 27 27
21
22 18* 5* 15 14* 14* 5*
23 18 5* 16 16 14 14
24 30 28 27 27 27 27
25
26 19* 16* 17 3* 15* 4*
27 19 16 17 3* 16 4*
28 30 27 27 27 25 25
29 1*
30 20* 16* 16 16* 16* 16*
31 19 17 17 17 16 16
32 32 28 27 27 27 27


By the way, in case you're curious, I've been giving the Hopper about 30 seconds to a minute to find the transponder. I noticed that it sometimes takes that long for it to tune in on some of them.

Thanks again for looking. I'm hoping that someone has some kind of clue as to what the hell is going on.
 
Good grief that is really confusing. Do you have another Dish receiver you could use to rule out the Hopper? (It doesn't have to be sub'd to use it in this fashion.) How about another node? Another DPP33?
 

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