TV1 vs TV2 output to 16:9 TV2

[kskimmel]

I have had a 722 since September using an old 4:3 aspect ratio television for TV2. No problems and I have been very satisfied overall. I bought a new Samsung 16:9 aspect HD LCD a couple of weeks ago to replace the TV2 in the bedroom. This TV has basically been in stretch-o-vision mode since it was installed as my wife prefers a full screen display to the 4:3 mode with sidebars (she also does not like to have everything zoomed).

Normally the 722 is kept in dual mode. Yesterday while playing around with single mode and PIP, I went upstairs to see how things looked on TV2. Needless to say I was surprised to see an exact replica of my TV1 HD display with no distortion.

Apparently, while in single mode an anamorphic signal is sent to TV2 which when stretched via the 16:9 TV2 mode converts to the proper full screen display aspect. I have also verfied that if I change the TV2 to the TV1 modulated channel while in dual mode, the same occurs.

It would be very nice if Dish could update the software to allow an option to output an anamorphic TV2 signal.

 

[oljim]

I can never understand why anyone would would use the dual mode, if you get a second HD TV, go online to Dish depot get a second 622 for $390 or a 722 for$ 430.

 

[PopcornNMore]

I can never understand why anyone would would use the dual mode, if you get a second HD TV, go online to Dish depot get a second 622 for $390 or a 722 for$ 430.

Probably because many people can't afford an additional 622 or 722 plus pay the additional monthly receiver fees.

 

[primetimeguy]

Probably because many people can't afford an additional 622 or 722 plus pay the additional monthly receiver fees.

But it does beg the question, why buy an HDTV if you are going to feed it an SD signal.

 

[oljim]

Some just miss spend money, I see you paid $90 for a terk 32 that is a copy of a Wingard 4400 that cost $18

 

[haertig]

But it does beg the question, why buy an HDTV if you are going to feed it an SD signal.

(1) Can you still buy SD TVs? Maybe in the smaller screen sizes, but the pickin's are slim as you move up in size.

(2) For the future. Maybe no HD fed to it now, but later you might be planning on that.

(3) There are other, cheaper ways to get HD to that set than via Dish. An OTA antenna. A $98 Toshiba A2 HDDVD player. Etc. I certainly wouldn't cough up the cash for a second 722 and it's monthly fees for our bedroom TV (we watch very little TV in the bedroom).

 

[primetimeguy]

(1) Can you still buy SD TVs? Maybe in the smaller screen sizes, but the pickin's are slim as you move up in size.

(2) For the future. Maybe no HD fed to it now, but later you might be planning on that.

(3) There are other, cheaper ways to get HD to that set than via Dish. An OTA antenna. A $98 Toshiba A2 HDDVD player. Etc. I certainly wouldn't cough up the cash for a second 722 and it's monthly fees for our bedroom TV (we watch very little TV in the bedroom).

1) Yes, there are many SD Digital TVs but you are right that not many at all once you get above 29" or so.

2) The same TV will be cheaper 6 months down the road, so to be buying an HDTV for "later" is wasting money IMO.

3) Agree there are other sources, but OP is connecting it to SD dish.

 

[kskimmel]

I can never understand why anyone would would use the dual mode, if you get a second HD TV, go online to Dish depot get a second 622 for $390 or a 722 for$ 430.

Biggest advantage to dual mode for me is that my wife likes to watch her recorded programs on either TV. It is to my advantage to send her upstairs so that I can watch whatever I want downstairs. Also the second HDTV was acquired after my Dish install in September. At this time I do not have the 18 month commitment that would be required to upgrade through dish-it-up and I do not want to spend full price to purchase another dual tuner HD DVR. I already have two additional SD tuners in the other bedrooms.

The Samsung LCD is an LT325AH with both NTSC and digital tuners. I bought it with plans for future HD upgrades whenever costs come down either due to new technology or a pricing war between Dish and DirectTV.

 

[PopcornNMore]

Some just miss spend money, I see you paid $90 for a terk 32 that is a copy of a Wingard 4400 that cost $18

I bought my Terk 32 brand new on EBay for only 99 cents.

 

[PopcornNMore]

But it does beg the question, why buy an HDTV if you are going to feed it an SD signal.

Because you can until prices of HD programming comes down. The only reason a small package of HD programming currently costs $20 a month is because people are willing to pay it.

I like to refer to new flat TV's as "digital" TV's that can receive both SD and HD signals.

 

[TNGTony]

Back to the subject, this has been a bone of contention for me since the day I got my 622. I always knew that the TV2 output was SD only, but I expected Dish to realize that some people would have more than 1 16x9 TV in their house! What a surprise to find out that TV2 did not have anamorphic mode as one of the options. It doesn't have to be HD, just anamorphic SD!

See ya
Tony

 

[steve4810]

I can never understand why anyone would would use the dual mode, if you get a second HD TV, go online to Dish depot get a second 622 for $390 or a 722 for$ 430.

Because two folks may want to watch two different DVR recordings at the same time.

Because two folks may want to watch two different a satellite channels at the same time.

Because of a combination of the above cases.

But I do have to admit I also switch to single user myself (for the PIP) when ever I'm home alone .

Despite this I'll order a second 622 as soon as you send the $390. My snail mail address:

Steve Morrison
1309 Dixon CT
Chula Vista, CA 91911

A personal check is fine or you could save me a step and order it and pay Dish Depot. Have it sent to the same address.

 

[steve4810]

It would be very nice if Dish could update the software to allow an option to output an anamorphic TV2 signal.

I'll second that!

It should be added to the list of desired improvements.

Although there may be a hardware limit in that the second analog video chipset can't do anamorphic. The analog chipset in the TV1 signal path might just be jumpered to TV2 in single user mode. This would let them save two bucks per unit on the TV2 analog video by buying a cheaper less featured chipset.

 

[EricBskiVT]

I don't understand what you guys are talking about. My TV2 is a 16x9 HDTV connected via the composite output and it displays the HD channels in 16x9 but at 480i. Apparently the TV upconverts it somewhat because, although not HD, it looks pretty good. My DVD recorder has an ASTC tuner and records HD stations at 16x9 even though the signal is downverted to SD.
Oops, took a second look and it is definitely 4x3, so I was wrong about TV2. Since I can record HD stations OTA in 16x9 with a DVD recorder, you would think that Dish could do the same with TV2.

 

[TNGTony]

Eric,

Are you using your receiver in SINGLE mode or dual mode?

In single mode, anamorphic works to TV2 no problem.

In dual mode, there is no anamorphic on TV2. It is still available on TV1. You have two options on the HD channels on TV 2.
--1) 4x3 full screen with the sides cut off which on a 16x9 TV translates to pillarbox. (bars on the sides)

--2) 4x3 letterboxed which on a 16x9 TV translates to a window boxed picture. (bars all around the picture). You can then use the Zoom feature on the TV to fill the screen with no distortion. However on the standard SD channels the zoom cuts off the top and bottom of the 4x3 picture.

In dual mode TV2 cannot do anamorphic. Which is IMHO the stupidest thing Dish has done EVER!

BTW, for those unaware, 16x9 anamorphic picture looks like this:

A 16x9 TV will stretch it out to make it look right.

Like this

The difference between zooming a windowboxed image and stretching out an anamorpic image has to do with the amount of information you have to start with. A windowboxed image has much less information leading to a "fuzzier" picture. An anamorphic picture has the most amount of information on the frame a standard definition signal can send.

See ya
Tony

 

[MikeD-C05]

Single mode on my 622/722 is how I make recordings on my dvd recorder for any hd movies or any video on demand movies( Yes I used it once for Norbit to see how it looked). I found out that when you watch a vdeo on demand movie on the hard drive they give it to you with black bars on the sides and you can not zoom it to fix this on tv1 output. . Using tv 2 output it fills the screen so my dvds have no black bars and look in porportion. Been doing this for close to year now.

 

[EricBskiVT]

Tony,
Great response with photos to back it up. I edited my original statement to say I was wrong. My wife watches the bedroom TV and the only thing I watch is OTA recordings on our DVD recorder that we use when there are too many conflicts for the 622 DVR. Those show up in 16x9 and 480i so you'd think Dish could do it too. Just add a setup function for TV2 on the receiver and alter the tuner to pass 16x9 if that is how TV2 is defined.

 

[JohnR]

(1) Can you still buy SD TVs? Maybe in the smaller screen sizes, but the pickin's are slim as you move up in size.

(2) For the future. Maybe no HD fed to it now, but later you might be planning on that.

(3) There are other, cheaper ways to get HD to that set than via Dish. An OTA antenna. A $98 Toshiba A2 HDDVD player. Etc. I certainly wouldn't cough up the cash for a second 722 and it's monthly fees for our bedroom TV (we watch very little TV in the bedroom).

I'd like to know where you bought the Toshiba HD-DVD for $98.

I run two HD TV's on my 622 and noticed the same thing...looked pretty good even if it was downres'd. I have now, however run an HDMI cable to TV2 and run TV1 on the component cables.

 

[waltinvt]

Eric,

Are you using your receiver in SINGLE mode or dual mode?

In single mode, anamorphic works to TV2 no problem.

In dual mode, there is no anamorphic on TV2. It is still available on TV1. You have two options on the HD channels on TV 2.
--1) 4x3 full screen with the sides cut off which on a 16x9 TV translates to pillarbox. (bars on the sides)

--2) 4x3 letterboxed which on a 16x9 TV translates to a window boxed picture. (bars all around the picture). You can then use the Zoom feature on the TV to fill the screen with no distortion. However on the standard SD channels the zoom cuts off the top and bottom of the 4x3 picture.

In dual mode TV2 cannot do anamorphic. Which is IMHO the stupidest thing Dish has done EVER!

BTW, for those unaware, 16x9 anamorphic picture looks like this:

A 16x9 TV will stretch it out to make it look right.

Like this

The difference between zooming a windowboxed image and stretching out an anamorpic image has to do with the amount of information you have to start with. A windowboxed image has much less information leading to a "fuzzier" picture. An anamorphic picture has the most amount of information on the frame a standard definition signal can send.

See ya
Tony

Great explanation Tony.

 

[stone phillips420]

I'd like to know where you bought the Toshiba HD-DVD for $98.

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