Weird HD Question

mdntblu

SatelliteGuys Pro
Original poster
Feb 21, 2006
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Corona, CA
I was wondering this the other day. How do they take old shows like Knight Rider, Flipper, etc. and show them in HD? Isn't HD a new technology and these shows are filmed a long time ago. Were they filmed in widescreen or are they actually cutting off the top and the bottom? Also is it because it was true film that it's so clear and when they convert it, it goes direct from film to digital high definition?

Just wondering.
 
I know that with things that were recorded on film (old movies, for example) it is certainly possible to transform them to HD quality. From my understanding, film is capable of being converted to 1080p, a quality which exceeds current HDTV standards. If they are showing the true aspect ratio of an old movie there will still likely be black bars on the top and bottom fo a 16:9 TV.

I don't know for sure about the shows you referred to, but I doubt they were recorded on film so I would be suprised to learn that they are in HD now. I am no expert, but am fairly certain that we won't ever see many relatively recent shows, like Seinfeld, in HD because they weren't recorded at the proper quality or aspect ratio.

Jim
 
How they transfer something made in a 4:3 aspect ratio is a good question; one that has always confused me. But there obviously must be a technological way of remastering content.

Look at the old shows like Hogan's Hero's shown on HDNET; or the soon-to-be HD version of Star Trek: TOS; these were made for 4:3 tv, before we ever thought of it as 4:3 tv.

And I suspect some of it must have to do with the whole "anamporphic" widescreen technology that enables a DVD to be shown in widescreen on my 16:9 HD tv, and in 4:3 on my SD tv.

But I am sure someone has a much more complete answer to this very good question, and not just my musings! :)
 
Like yesterday I was watching an episode of Knight Rider (1982) on IniHD and it looked really clear. The sound was even in 5.1 which is crazy to me. Was Knight Rider filmed on actual Film? Also Flipper on Family HD was filmed in the 60's and it looks fairly good. Not as good as a newer show but still in widescreen HD.
 
mdntblu said:
Like yesterday I was watching an episode of Knight Rider (1982) on IniHD and it looked really clear. The sound was even in 5.1 which is crazy to me. Was Knight Rider filmed on actual Film? Also Flipper on Family HD was filmed in the 60's and it looks fairly good. Not as good as a newer show but still in widescreen HD.


Its the magic of hollywood; great remastering technology!
 
mdntblu said:
I was wondering this the other day. How do they take old shows like Knight Rider, Flipper, etc. and show them in HD? Isn't HD a new technology and these shows are filmed a long time ago. Were they filmed in widescreen or are they actually cutting off the top and the bottom? Also is it because it was true film that it's so clear and when they convert it, it goes direct from film to digital high definition?

Just wondering.

computers.............lol
 
I am watching Knight Rider right now and it does have 5.1 surround as well.

I am nearly certain it was done on film because of the grain that is apparent. It looks the same as you would see in a movie theater.

Jim
 
Movie theaters originally showed movies in 4:3. Then TV came along, and to compete, movie studios began making movies in "widescreen." There are different aspect ratios, but generally they are a bit wider than 16:9. Many were produced with TV in mind, so that the edges could be clipped off (or pan and scan used) will little adverse effect on following the movie. This let them more easily sell an older movie to TV. Anyway, an original aspect film will often have black bars on the top and bottom when shown in HD on a widescreen TV.

I have read that varying types and quality of film has been used over the years to make movies and TV productions. With 35mm, the inherent resolution is 2 to 4 times the HD resolution of 1080. So these can be converted rather easily to HD. By cropping the tops and bottoms, and perhaps with a bit of stretch, they may make it to 16:9 or come close. I've seen productions in widescreen where they had columns on either side of the show. This produced a narrow screen actual image, but at high quality, and the side columns gave the effect of watching in a movie theater.

Of course, they can try to interpolate and increase the resolution and call it HD, but the result is disappointing. They do this with old taped shows.
 
Your guess is correct, a lot of these old shows (Gilligan's Island, Flipper, Hogan's Heroes etc) were all filmed on film, not on video tape, and that is why they are easy to convert to HD. A lot of other shows that were filmed on video tape will not be so lucky.

As for the surround mixes, I am sure they weren't originally recorded that way, I am sure they a virtual mixes.
 
They have been remixed to 5.1 sound and most tv shows before the mid 80's were recorded on film and not tape. Star Trek TOS will probably look much better converted to HD than The Next Generation ever will because TNG was recorded on videotape.
 
OSU,

I though the TV industry didn't switch to the electronic age of tape until the 90's. As I remember, it was just so much easier and faster to edit film based recording than video tape based recordings. Plus the investment in equipment, plus the mentality of sticking with the tried and true.

Seeing the TNG characters on the movie screen is so much more rich than on the TV. Data's reflective skin, Diana's nose, Picard's bald head! Yeah baby! Hopefully the series, which started in the late 80s is all on film.
 
osu1991 said:
I honestly don't remember but I am pretty sure TNG was all done on tape.

I am not certain either, but I suspect it is on tape.

I do recall thinking when the first TNG Film came out that they barely showed shots of the Enterprise exterior - probably because the older model they had did not transfer well to the film they were using. I thought it was no coincidence that they destroyed the NCC1701D in the film; all the future films have far more close-ups of the 1701E.
 
Per a couple of DVD review websites, TNG was shot on film then transfered to video for the special effects. Hopefully the conversion to HD video would include using the original film when possible and upconverting the special effects.
 
Virtually every primetime TV show is shot on film. This was certainly the case for all the old shows mentioned in this thread. These older shows were also posted/edited in film, so making a Hi-Def master is not difficult. Yes, the process has to account for differences in aspect ratios. Obviously, there will be cropping required if the original film ratio was 4:3 and the final desired ratio is 16:9.

Some more recent shows, even though shot on film, may have been posted/edited on videotape. Some of these could theoretically be remasted in HD, but it would require going back to original film stock and perfoming the editing all over again. Not likely to happen without some serious monetary incentive! Then there are some shows that were shot on film and posted on videotape, but which also included special effects editing in the latter. These would be virtually impossible to master in HD without recreating all the special effects in HD also. That would be heroic, if not impossible to do.
 
I picked up a copy of the 5th season of Star Trek:TNG at Sam's club for $46 (yes, it has finally dropped to a reasonable price! For under another $100 I can complete my collection). Anyway, I digress... I am watching my favorite episode of all times, "Inner Light," and to be honest, the DVD transfer is really not very good at all.

Part of it is that it was done in full screen, and no effort was made to make it anamorphic. I suspect that a HD transfer would look much better, but compared with a lot of the other tv I have seen on DVD, this one is not that good.

But the episode still is awesome. I love that flute music.