Dish roof install - winter?
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winter is not the problem, snow is. i will not step foot on a roof that is covered with snow. it is also not wise to screw anything into a surface that is wet. i dont care what anyone says but there is no sealing agent that i can readily buy that i would feel confident is not going to be comprimised by being applied to a wet surface.
im not aiming this at you at all, but over my course of installs i am absoutly amazed at how much people are willing to comprimise what they really want or even the structural integrity of thier home just to get thier dish in right now. i literally tell people to stop and think, and also that not having tv untill they have made a rational decision is not going to be the end of thier world as they know it.
im not aiming this at you at all, but over my course of installs i am absoutly amazed at how much people are willing to comprimise what they really want or even the structural integrity of thier home just to get thier dish in right now. i literally tell people to stop and think, and also that not having tv untill they have made a rational decision is not going to be the end of thier world as they know it.
Bishop tape is fine on a wet roof. The next time it is sunny it will heat it up and seal itself.
However, I will not put the new KAKU on the roof of any house. they have 2 much surface area for wind to catch, and houses are just not built that well anymore, I think over time they can shake loose on the roof. and if they do shake, that would make them prone to leaks.
i lucked out about a month ago and did a slimline at a house that had an existing superdish in place (same size mast). guy said it had been there for quite some time. well whoever did it sealed it real good and hit nothing but truss on his monopoles and mast foot. that thing was solid as a rock.
i could have given it a chuck norris caliber roundhouse and i think it would have bent the reflector before it ripped the mast out.
i dont know if you've ever done any framing but i have before i started doing electrical work years ago and i can feel where the truss's are in most roofs. its the only way i'll put one up. if someone has a solid roof i cant feel a truss in i wont do it. once you find one truss its easy to find the others, finding the first one is the problem.
as far as roof sealant, this is what i use. i mush prefer this style because i can coat the threads of the lags and make a much better seal then traditional roof repair tape. http://www.dap.com/product_details.aspx?product_id=14
btw any product i have seen meant for roof repair is always suggested to be applied to a completely dry surface.
For the life of me I NEVER understood why anyone wants the dish on their roof north of Tennessee, or anywhere else.
The satellites are about 22,300 miles above the equater, what the heck difference does 30 feet make? I've had customers insist that "you get better reception when it's mounted on the roof.", that's when I asked them for a calculater and did the math for them. When they insisted I made them sign off on the work order that we were not responsible for service calls due to snow and Ice.
I'd ask them if they had a helicopter, they would always say "of course not, why?", my reply was always, "Because when we get an ice or snowstorm and you have no signal the only way to clean the dish is to hang upside down from a helicopter because nobody on this earth is going up there with snow and ice.
96% of customers saw the light, 4% were just too stupid to live.
I mean no disrespect to the OP, but every time there was a snow or Ice storm my phone would ring off the hook. For those who had their dish on the corner of a first floor roof I would take a super soaker loaded with 97% Isopropel alcohol and soak the dish from the ground. The 4% I would just laugh at them, (they would be peeved of course) but I would pull their contract and remind them of their signing off on the snow/ice thing.
It was part of job satisfaction back when I was a tech!
The satellites are about 22,300 miles above the equater, what the heck difference does 30 feet make? I've had customers insist that "you get better reception when it's mounted on the roof.", that's when I asked them for a calculater and did the math for them. When they insisted I made them sign off on the work order that we were not responsible for service calls due to snow and Ice.
I'd ask them if they had a helicopter, they would always say "of course not, why?", my reply was always, "Because when we get an ice or snowstorm and you have no signal the only way to clean the dish is to hang upside down from a helicopter because nobody on this earth is going up there with snow and ice.
96% of customers saw the light, 4% were just too stupid to live.
I mean no disrespect to the OP, but every time there was a snow or Ice storm my phone would ring off the hook. For those who had their dish on the corner of a first floor roof I would take a super soaker loaded with 97% Isopropel alcohol and soak the dish from the ground. The 4% I would just laugh at them, (they would be peeved of course) but I would pull their contract and remind them of their signing off on the snow/ice thing.
It was part of job satisfaction back when I was a tech!
Great post!!!... I have a question for our installers in snow prone areas. How do you get your roof mount jobs done when roofs are snow covered..Do you take a chance and install the dish anyway?..Do you use an alternative location?..What is the procedure if the only possible Line of sight is from a roof that is snow covered?
What's "bishop tape"?
What do you do if the only line of sight is with a roof mount?...The people I owrk for would not allow a "no roof mount policy " ....These dishes are designed to be roof mounted...
I would prefer not to roof mount such a large dish , myslef..But I HATE losing jobs over NLOS...What I do is inform the customer of the additional risk of a roof mount and let them make the decision ..If they go with the roof mount, the customer MUST sign off on the mount and that they cannot hold me responsible for any damage,leaks or if the dish is blown off the roof etc.......That usually takes care of any customer trepidation
I was in the res. construction industry..So I know it is prudent to hit rafters..Unfortunately with truss system roofs, the rafters are 24" on center..It would help if the struts were of adjustable length..To find rafters is easy..Tapping on the roof with hammer is the easiest way to find them..
That's funny..I get the same inquiry..I tell them the altitude of the satellites and then ask "do you think the signal is going to travel 22,000 miles to the peak of your roof AND STOP"?..That usually gets the point across..Those that do not understand are left to find someone else to listen to their nonsensical ramblings..I go on to the next job..
Sorry but there are plenty of things that can be applied to roofs while wet that work great. Roofers do that all the time.
I just took care of a small leak that I found last week, after the storm ended.
btw, my AT-9 held up great and never lost a signal. (pole mount, 16 ft up)
Jimbo
for one i am not a roofer. two, i am in business to make money, not loose it via lawsuit. everything i have found at home depot etc and i stress "that i have found" always recommends being applied to a dry surface. now to someone doing thier own roof repair that may be negligable but to me i follow the directions. reason being is everyone now a days is lawsuit crazy. its at a point where it doesnt matter if you advise someone of the consequences or not. some overeager lawyer will pick it apart and your done.
im not saying by any means i would never stick one (a dish) on a wet roof if i knew of something that stated it could be applied to a wet surface. im just saying i have not seen anything that says it. if anyone knows of anything then feasible by all means tell. by feasible i mean something that isnt going to put me out of business or force me to alternate days i eat.
my philosophy is doing it by the book. if people dont like they can get another installer, somple as that.
I recently had a slimline installed on my roof. Second guy to come out said that Directv never puts a dish on the roof (even though I showed him the phase III already on the roof). First and third guys never showed. Thanks to the fourth guy (but who only ran one line to the HR20 so I'm still waiting another month for another appointment).
I need it on the roof, cause I live in a townhouse and the house blocks it if I would put it on my back fense. Also, I like having it out of sight, unlike my neighbors. Its not because I think that extra 30 ft gets me a better picture.
I need it on the roof, cause I live in a townhouse and the house blocks it if I would put it on my back fense. Also, I like having it out of sight, unlike my neighbors. Its not because I think that extra 30 ft gets me a better picture.
16ft?!!!!!!!! What type of material did you use for the pole?...Anything that tall and I have always gone to a 6x6 pressure treated timber...Tallest I will go with a meatl pole is 10ft..That's on "black pipe"....Standard galvinzed fence post would sway too much...So what is your secret. Do you charge extra for a non standard pole? We do..
Oh yeah, can you name some of those products to use when the roof is wet..Also, can you recommend anything to use when it is actually raining..
Will do a roof mount if it is just wet.I take a rag and a propane torch up and use the heat (very gently) to dry the area where the mast foot will go..I use the rag to dry up any moisture that may be flowing down the shingles towards my work area..Right now, roof mounts in the rain are a no go...
Thanks
Esthetics are a big issue..I try to be as cooperative with the customer's wishes about how the job looks..Especially in the arena of dish placement..However, there are certain items that will prevent a roof mount and the isue then boils down to "Sir/Ma'am due to (obstruction or other factor) I have but one mounting option"...
16' Galvinized schedule 40 pipe from the local fence company.
I have 3ft in concrete, with a bolt in the bottom so it cannot turn once the concrete sets. I mounted the pole in a corner of my house so I made supports that attach to the house and welded the other end to the pipe. (I realize you won't have a welder on your job's, but you asked how I did it).
It goes approx 4 ft above the roof line, had I known ahead of time, I could have dropped it a few feet, but I wanted to be safe, I have a tall pine tree in the neighbors yard that it looks over, thats why I went that much higher over the roof.
The dish sits on the NE corner of the house, house faces west therefore you cannot see the dish unless your looking for it.
btw, it will still sway a little, but I can go up there and push it around (pipe to make it sway) and I never loose a signal.
Also, seeing it's next to the house, I can get up on the house to set it up or remove snow or ice if needed. (flat roof, see I was thinking ahead). !!!
We had pretty bad weather over the w/e and I never lost signal, so I am pretty happy with it so far (AT-9) more bad weather coming in the morning, sleet and ice, should be fun to work in
Jimbo
Thanks..I did one on a 12 footer(schedule 80 galv line post)..Three feet into the ground at Myrtle Beach..Yer from Ohio. Everybody from the Buckeye State knows where That is..Anyway, I was under a bit of pressure because I had no idea where to get sched 40 pipe and had driven a long way(3hrs) to get there..I was being paid lots of dough by my employer to get this job done...So I used what I could get my hands on....Winds were about 15-20 kts that day and the dish was moving pretty good..But no siganl loss that day...But later that week, the cust called to complain of signal loss when it got real windy...If I had sched 40 I could have made it a beeter situation...16' Galvinized schedule 40 pipe from the local fence company.
I have 3ft in concrete, with a bolt in the bottom so it cannot turn once the concrete sets. I mounted the pole in a corner of my house so I made supports that attach to the house and welded the other end to the pipe. (I realize you won't have a welder on your job's, but you asked how I did it).
It goes approx 4 ft above the roof line, had I known ahead of time, I could have dropped it a few feet, but I wanted to be safe, I have a tall pine tree in the neighbors yard that it looks over, thats why I went that much higher over the roof.
The dish sits on the NE corner of the house, house faces west therefore you cannot see the dish unless your looking for it.
btw, it will still sway a little, but I can go up there and push it around (pipe to make it sway) and I never loose a signal.
Also, seeing it's next to the house, I can get up on the house to set it up or remove snow or ice if needed. (flat roof, see I was thinking ahead). !!!
We had pretty bad weather over the w/e and I never lost signal, so I am pretty happy with it so far (AT-9) more bad weather coming in the morning, sleet and ice, should be fun to work in
Jimbo
Yes NW OH will get some winter wx for sure....Working in the rain is bad enough.I hate it, but I do it..But winter precip ?..Forget it.TV just ain't that important..They can wait...
I believe the larger the number the thicker it is, your schedule 80 is twice as thick as the 40 I used.
I did not know they made galvinized pipe that thick, or I would have hunted it down.
Well at least you knew the pole was not going to bend.
Did you put a bolt in the bottom before the concrete so the pole would not be able to move ?
From the sounds of it, the dish moved on the pole, not the pole itself.
btw, I did my pole mount myself, I doubt that the D* installers would have dealt with my set up, and they liked it very much that I had it taken care of.
I would have done the whole job, but D* insisted that the installer needed to place the dish, and they would put it up for free.
otherwise I would have been up and running that week that the HR20-700's came out, I was ready
Jimbo
I gotta check on that..I was always under the impression that the lower number was thicker..Oh well...This pipe was the standard 1/4" in thickness....The normal lines posts are I believe are 1/8"..oh well...Anyway, yes they do make it like that..althoiugh this pipe I found in electrical..It's really conduit I suppose..BUt I have seen simialr pipe used in fence applications.I believe the larger the number the thicker it is, your schedule 80 is twice as thick as the 40 I used.
I did not know they made galvinized pipe that thick, or I would have hunted it down.
Well at least you knew the pole was not going to bend.
Did you put a bolt in the bottom before the concrete so the pole would not be able to move ?
From the sounds of it, the dish moved on the pole, not the pole itself.
btw, I did my pole mount myself, I doubt that the D* installers would have dealt with my set up, and they liked it very much that I had it taken care of.
I would have done the whole job, but D* insisted that the installer needed to place the dish, and they would put it up for free.
otherwise I would have been up and running that week that the HR20-700's came out, I was ready
Jimbo
Onm normal fence posts ,I just take a 2lb sledge and flair the last 8-10" to keep the post from turning...In this case I had to drill a hole thru the pipe and insert a short piece of rebar that I also purchased..That's an old Primestar install trick.
Anyway, the wind a[[arently was blowing off the water(beachfront house) at quite a clip..I went on the web at the office to check and the wind gusts were 30+mph....We told the guy that that was his only option unless he wanted to pay us trip and labor to install somethuing more styrdy..
Well, I guess I'm part of the 4% too stupid to live...
Mine is mounted to my roof along with an additional tripod that supports my OTA Antenna and a 2m ground plane. No leaks in 10 years. and that includes after a re-roof 2 years ago.
The name of a product that can be used on ANY wet surface and ensure 100% watertight integrity?
Eternabond,
I've installed this stuff under ponded water on a low slope roof with no problems. Sticks to anything and will provide a leak free installation.
Never leave the shop without it. Available at roofing supply houses and many retail outlets.
Mine is mounted to my roof along with an additional tripod that supports my OTA Antenna and a 2m ground plane. No leaks in 10 years. and that includes after a re-roof 2 years ago.
The name of a product that can be used on ANY wet surface and ensure 100% watertight integrity?
Eternabond,
I've installed this stuff under ponded water on a low slope roof with no problems. Sticks to anything and will provide a leak free installation.
Never leave the shop without it. Available at roofing supply houses and many retail outlets.
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