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Last reply Feb 25, 2008 · posted in DISH Network Support Forum

Likelihood of failure of non-burial grade coax?

My dish was installed on a long run to the house nearly three years ago. I've now determined that the coax used in the install was not direct burial. I don't know what exactly it was, but Dish installer and supervisor at the house over the weekend said it was the wrong stuff (done by a contractor) that they would never have used.

My question is how given to failure might the wrong coax be after three years in the ground? I realize that more info on exactly what was in the ground would help, but for now I don't have that info. If it matters, we're not in a particularly cold part of the country (VA).

Thanks.

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Liquidforce88

Feb 23, 2008

Bob_Loblaw said:
So who should pay for it? Ultimately the customer pays for it all in subscriber fees. But up front, if the customer is promised a free installation with no caveats they should get it regardless of the installer's cost.

First problem with your argument - No customer is promised a FREEE installation. There is a free BASIC installation included with the service. The BASIC installation does not cover everything.

Bob_Loblaw said:
If there are certain things that cost extra, those need to be dealt with up front so the customer is an informed consumer. But the installer should have everything they need to do a good install including wire, connectors, clamps, PVC pipe, fittings, glue, etc. The customer should never have to supply anything.

The problem here is people are unwilling to pay the extra fee. So they tell the tech they will do it. You expect the tech to do work for free? If the customer says they will do it because they don't want to pay that is their right. It's noted on the work order and in notes with the service provider.

Bob_Loblaw said:
Plus, I don't ever hear about someone getting money back from the installer company because their install was exceptionally easy. By the logic that extra costs should be borne solely by the customer, shouldn't the customer get a rebate if their install goes really quick? Let's say all their cable and connections are already installed and all the installer has to do is throw on the dish and hook up the box. Takes all of a half an hour. What kind of rebate does the customer deserve in that situation?

First this almost never happens. No job can be completed in 1/2 an hour. Even if a customer was replacing an existing system with an identicle system. The time to drive to the job, inspect the existing system to make sure it is ok, installing the reciever, waiting for the download, doing paperwork, and waiting for activation will take longer than this.

The customer should get something back for something that was FREE. Think about your statement here...come on

Bob_Loblaw said:
And wouldn't all you 'techs' ridicule them for asking for one? The truth is you should make money on most jobs but not necessarily all. Unless you go to a structure where all jobs are bid individually (a very expensive way of doing business which would be very costly to the consumer), you aren't going to make as much money on some jobs as others, and on some you should expect to lose money. As long as you make a decent profit overall you shouldn't complain about the ones that cost more.

This just shows you know nothing about being in business. No bussiness is going to do work and lose money, not for long anyway. You show me any business school that teaches this. This is not how the real world works, and I think you know this.

Bob_Loblaw said:
Otherwise, in the end no one is really happy. The customer is mad because he got a poor install or got charged for a 'free' install, the installer is mad because his pay is lower when he does bigger or better job, the company is mad because the installer didn't do as many jobs so they don't make as much money. The only winner is the satellite company because they negotiated a good deal for themselves.

Again there is what is included in the FREE basic install, then there is what is not covered. No customer should get charged for a free install, nor should a customer allow an installer to do poor work. It is always best that the customer knows what they are buying when they order a service such as a satellite system, as you stated being an informed consumer. No customer should expect to get more than what is included in the basic install free either. The problem is that people only here the word free, and you are one of them.

Bob_Loblaw said:
Now personally, I think if you have to dig a trench to install a cable you've done 90% of the work and incurred most of the costs already. If digging the trench was included in the price of the install then so should the pvc. A couple bucks for pvc and a few minutes to put it together is really nothing after paying for a trench.

Steve

Again you don't know what is included in the free BASIC install. It does not say that we will did a trench 12" deep or anything else. All that is included is a slit trench you push a shovel in the ground and spilt the sod and push the cable in. Digging a trench large enough for conduit is alot more work. Also you make it sound like PVC is only a couple of dollors, it's not that cheap just a 50' setup would cost over $20.00.

Steve why don't you go out and get an install job. Then tell me how you feel about your post after 6 months on the job.

haertig

Feb 23, 2008

Dave nye said:
First problem with your argument - No customer is promised a FREEE installation. There is a free BASIC installation included with the service. The BASIC installation does not cover everything.

But it should include everything to meet local codes or things mandated by the company paying the installer.

If local codes say underground stuff has to be in conduit, or if Dish/DirectTV says that in their agreement, then the basic install should include that. If no code or Dish/DirectTV instructions require conduit, then that should be an extra charge to the customer. Optional at customers expense, if agreed upon by the installer. Even if the customer is willing to pay for optional work, I don't think the installer would have to agree to do that work unless they wanted to.

But if something was done contrary to local code, I think the municipality would have good reason to go after the installer. Even if the installer claims "that's not part of a basic install". Meeting code is not something you can just blow off because you don't think you're getting paid enough, is it?

Liquidforce88

Feb 24, 2008

haertig said:
But it should include everything to meet local codes or things mandated by the company paying the installer.

If local codes say underground stuff has to be in conduit, or if Dish/DirectTV says that in their agreement, then the basic install should include that. If no code or Dish/DirectTV instructions require conduit, then that should be an extra charge to the customer. Optional at customers expense, if agreed upon by the installer. Even if the customer is willing to pay for optional work, I don't think the installer would have to agree to do that work unless they wanted to.

But if something was done contrary to local code, I think the municipality would have good reason to go after the installer. Even if the installer claims "that's not part of a basic install". Meeting code is not something you can just blow off because you don't think you're getting paid enough, is it?

Look do you feel that it is fair that you get something for free when another customer has to pay for it? Every provider has things that are not included in an install. If you are to far away from the road your local phone company or cable company will charge you extra for the install. If your local area requires the cable be put in conduit, and it is not part of the install from a service, then the customer is going to have to pay for it.

Sears installs water softners, it only includes 10' of copper plumbing to install it. After that the installer charges $5.00 a foot for install. It's the same in every industry that does installations. When you see an install that says it includes everything, I will bet you it was not FREE.

An informed consumer would know that my area requires that conduit be used if cable has to be out in the ground. They would also know that the provider does not include that in the BASIC install. Thus an informed consumer would know that they are going to have to pay additional fees if the cable needs to be put in the ground.

There is no rational argument for this. It is clearly stated what is included and what is not included. No where in the service agreement does it state that unless local codes require the installer does it for free. THe consumer is responsible to know what they are getting when they order or buy something. It would be no different then buying an HD tv and then saying well Sony should provide me with HD programing for free.

haertig

Feb 24, 2008

Dave nye said:
Look do you feel that it is fair that you get something for free when another customer has to pay for it?

Yeah, I hate it when I go to the hospital and have to pay $20k because I can afford it, and some other guy goes in there and gets treated for free. Free, because that $20k I had to pay was a massive overcharge for what I actually received. And also because I pay taxes that help support others. You're right - it's not fair.

It's called spreading the cost around. It works the same way with many things. I might pay every insurance premium on time and never get a penny out of it if I file no claims. Those premiums are based on average/expected claims. Some customers get more payout in the end, some get less.

An informed consumer would know that my area requires that conduit be used if cable has to be out in the ground. They would also know that the provider does not include that in the BASIC install. Thus an informed consumer would know that they are going to have to pay additional fees if the cable needs to be put in the ground.

So by that logic, a home buyer would need to know every code that governs the building of their house? And therefore expect to pay more than the contracted sale price of their home when some sub-contractor whines that a two story house requires more exhaust ducting for the furnace than single story home?

THe consumer is responsible to know what they are getting when they order or buy something.

You're saying that a customer is supposed to know every piece and part of a satellite installation and the various codes that govern it? If Dish tells me that the "basic installation" or whatever you want to call it is free, any reasonable person would assume that means (1) after installation, things would work, and (2) they would work safely. Cosmetic and other optional stuff, sure, they'd have to pay extra for. But the basic installation should include (1) and (2).

Municipal codes are written to spell out what is considered safe in that locality. When I hire a heating contractor to replace my furnace, I do not need to research all the codes that relate to this piece of hardware and the safe way to install it. That's why I'm hiring someone to do it and not doing it myself.

Some people just shouldn't be installers IMHO. You have to be knowledgeable and responsible enough to complete your work so it's done properly and will function in a safe manner. If you negotiate a price for you work with some company like Dish and you underbid yourself not considering that some jobs will be cheaper or more expensive than others, that's your problem not the poor customers.

dishcomm

Feb 25, 2008

haertig said:
Yeah, I hate it when I go to the hospital and have to pay $20k because I can afford it, and some other guy goes in there and gets treated for free. Free, because that $20k I had to pay was a massive overcharge for what I actually received. And also because I pay taxes that help support others. You're right - it's not fair.

It's called spreading the cost around. It works the same way with many things. I might pay every insurance premium on time and never get a penny out of it if I file no claims. Those premiums are based on average/expected claims. Some customers get more payout in the end, some get less.

So by that logic, a home buyer would need to know every code that governs the building of their house? And therefore expect to pay more than the contracted sale price of their home when some sub-contractor whines that a two story house requires more exhaust ducting for the furnace than single story home?

You're saying that a customer is supposed to know every piece and part of a satellite installation and the various codes that govern it? If Dish tells me that the "basic installation" or whatever you want to call it is free, any reasonable person would assume that means (1) after installation, things would work, and (2) they would work safely. Cosmetic and other optional stuff, sure, they'd have to pay extra for. But the basic installation should include (1) and (2).

Municipal codes are written to spell out what is considered safe in that locality. When I hire a heating contractor to replace my furnace, I do not need to research all the codes that relate to this piece of hardware and the safe way to install it. That's why I'm hiring someone to do it and not doing it myself.

Some people just shouldn't be installers IMHO. You have to be knowledgeable and responsible enough to complete your work so it's done properly and will function in a safe manner. If you negotiate a price for you work with some company like Dish and you underbid yourself not considering that some jobs will be cheaper or more expensive than others, that's your problem not the poor customers.

I se you are still trying to rationalize your way out of the concept of a free basic install.
It isn't going to work. Both satellite compn aies have websites which explain in detail what is included in a free basic install. This covers the entire country. his information is also readily available on the respectuve websites of each satco. Any retailer who sells these systems has the duty ot pass along any information regarding what is included in a basic install. it is the customer who is spending their money. It is therefore up to the customer to practice due dilligence in finding out as much about their pruchase as possible. So yes, it is the customer's responsibilty to find out anythign they can before the make a purchase..
The satellite companies are NOT going to make special considerations for the tiny number of towns that require conduit for burial. If they did, those costs would be passed along to ALL subscribers in the form of higher programming costs. Should customers all customers have to pay more because a few hundred towns scattered across the country require something EXTRA?....No. Of course not. Those unfortunate enough to live in one of these nanny state towns will have to bear that cost alone.
We aren't eating the cost for the regulations of a few and that's that. You'll pay r you won't get it done.

Hemi 6.1

Feb 25, 2008

dishcomm said:
I se you are still trying to rationalize your way out of the concept of a free basic install.
It isn't going to work. Both satellite compn aies have websites which explain in detail what is included in a free basic install. This covers the entire country. his information is also readily available on the respectuve websites of each satco. Any retailer who sells these systems has the duty ot pass along any information regarding what is included in a basic install. it is the customer who is spending their money. It is therefore up to the customer to practice due dilligence in finding out as much about their pruchase as possible. So yes, it is the customer's responsibilty to find out anythign they can before the make a purchase..
The satellite companies are NOT going to make special considerations for the tiny number of towns that require conduit for burial. If they did, those costs would be passed along to ALL subscribers in the form of higher programming costs. Should customers all customers have to pay more because a few hundred towns scattered across the country require something EXTRA?....No. Of course not. Those unfortunate enough to live in one of these nanny state towns will have to bear that cost alone.
We aren't eating the cost for the regulations of a few and that's that. You'll pay r you won't get it done.

I think we really talked this out about as much as possible. I For one are not mad at all. But I think we can agree,That Satellite companys ,are most likly not to fair with their installers. And alot of Installers aren't doing the job as good as they used too. And its a direct reflection on D* and E*. Installers aren't happy with what they get paid,and D* and E* don't want to pay. The customer pays more now then ever,IMO. Fee's after Fee's,Lease after Lease, Comitment after Comitment. After all this ,we still have to pay for a Protection plan ,on equipment,we never own.And when you add Shotty work,who pays for that ? Is that part of the free install? I think I speak for majority, Its time to give the customer a break! Theres enough to worry about ,without adding problems with the Techs job on installing equipment. The customer pays well above and beyond!

dishcomm

Feb 25, 2008

Hemi 6.1 said:
I think we really talked this out about as much as possible. I For one are not mad at all. But I think we can agree,That Satellite companys ,are most likly not to fair with their installers. And alot of Installers aren't doing the job as good as they used too. And its a direct reflection on D* and E*. Installers aren't happy with what they get paid,and D* and E* don't want to pay. The customer pays more now then ever,IMO. Fee's after Fee's,Lease after Lease, Comitment after Comitment. After all this ,we still have to pay for a Protection plan ,on equipment,we never own.And when you add Shotty work,who pays for that ? Is that part of the free install? I think I speak for majority, Its time to give the customer a break! Theres enough to worry about ,without adding problems with the Techs job on installing equipment. The customer pays well above and beyond!

well that's where you are wrong...The customers are in this WITH us..Actually the payment for services over the last ten years has tumbled 75% or more..Here's an example...In 1998 A friend of mine bought a single recever Directv system. It was an out of the box buy frm Circuit City. The system cost about $300.....He arranged for installation with the store. Cost$250. That was the fee for a standard one tuner install.
Let's look at today..while I will not divulge to you or anyone else outside the business what my payment is for a standard install I can tell you it is far less than half of that. So you see in that last ten years or so, the satellite companies in thir interest in keeping prices down to allowed for more affordable prices ot the customers have essentially gone into the pockets of the very people they trust to serve their customers.
So if you think you haven't gotten a break, think again.
Our costs have never gone down. Yet the pay rates have receded substatially
The customers(me included) are paying more. But not nearly what they could be paying.
You are speaking for yourself. Not others. Let's get that straight. CUstiomers are not paying nearly what they could be...Both satcos have negotiated strongly in the customer's favor with producers to keep per subscriber costs down....HD programming could be far more expensive. But subscribers are paying less than 50 cents per channel if each HD channel is counted as one channel and the fee based on the $20 per month wextra Dish charges (pre Feb 1, 2008)
Look, you have other options. If you or anyone else isn't happy with having to fairly compensate a satellite installer just payment for services rendered then I suggest you choose another prgramming provider.

Hemi 6.1

Feb 25, 2008

dishcomm said:
well that's where you are wrong...The customers are in this WITH us..Actually the payment for services over the last ten years has tumbled 75% or more..Here's an example...In 1998 A friend of mine bought a single recever Directv system. It was an out of the box buy frm Circuit City. The system cost about $300.....He arranged for installation with the store. Cost$250. That was the fee for a standard one tuner install.
Let's look at today..while I will not divulge to you or anyone else outside the business what my payment is for a standard install I can tell you it is far less than half of that. So you see in that last ten years or so, the satellite companies in thir interest in keeping prices down to allowed for more affordable prices ot the customers have essentially gone into the pockets of the very people they trust to serve their customers.
So if you think you haven't gotten a break, think again.
Our costs have never gone down. Yet the pay rates have receded substatially
The customers(me included) are paying more. But not nearly what they could be paying.
You are speaking for yourself. Not others. Let's get that straight. CUstiomers are not paying nearly what they could be...Both satcos have negotiated strongly in the customer's favor with producers to keep per subscriber costs down....HD programming could be far more expensive. But subscribers are paying less than 50 cents per channel if each HD channel is counted as one channel and the fee based on the $20 per month wextra Dish charges (pre Feb 1, 2008)
Look, you have other options. If you or anyone else isn't happy with having to fairly compensate a satellite installer just payment for services rendered then I suggest you choose another prgramming provider.

This entire statement makes no sence. Sorry ! Tell me what do you think we should be paying then? Your the only one here thats defending shotty workmanship. If your not happy ,Get a new Job. And back in 1995 I paid $800 for a reciever and installed it myself! DBS was an entirely New service back then. Thats why it was so expensive. There was no customers yet. Now there almost 30 million. With compitition around how can you expect people to still pay $800 for 1 receiver ,when cable was a fraction of that price. Of course the price went down,You would be out of a job if it didn't, But you also have massive amount of new customers every day. Not 1 a week! COM'ON ! A PS2 was $299 when I bought one back in 1999,now its half price, I can tell already your workmanship,looks nothing like DAVE NYE's pictures. Your to busy crying about what you don't get. Take some pride man,It never hurts to better yourself!

daro

Feb 25, 2008

DISH Network -- Installation

Not technical? Looking for an easy way to ger your new DISH Network TV system up and running? Standard Professional Installation is FREE! (Savings of $199 - Limited time offer.) Let our experts bring satellite television into your home for FREE!

Standard Professional Installation Includes

Site survey (at time of installation)
Assembly of dishes and mount(s)
Grounding of system components
System peaking for optimum performance
Installation of up to 120' RG-6 cable
One wall cable penetration
Testing of equipment for proper operation
Orientation to DISH Network programming and equipment

Materials Provided At No Charge:

Up to 120' RG-6 cable
Coaxial cable connectors
Grounding equipment
Weather sealant for connections
and structure penetration

dishcomm

Feb 25, 2008

Hemi 6.1 said:
This entire statement makes no sence. Sorry ! Tell me what do you think we should be paying then? Your the only one here thats defending shotty workmanship. If your not happy ,Get a new Job. And back in 1995 I paid $800 for a reciever and installed it myself! DBS was an entirely New service back then. Thats why it was so expensive. There was no customers yet. Now there almost 30 million. With compitition around how can you expect people to still pay $800 for 1 receiver ,when cable was a fraction of that price. Of course the price went down,You would be out of a job if it didn't, But you also have massive amount of new customers every day. Not 1 a week! COM'ON ! A PS2 was $299 when I bought one back in 1999,now its half price, I can tell already your workmanship,looks nothing like DAVE NYE's pictures. Your to busy crying about what you don't get. Take some pride man,It never hurts to better yourself!

PLease indicate where I implied or confirmed that I was in favor of shoddy(not shotty) workmanship..It was you who rendered the opinion that any cable not buried in conduit was poor work. An opinion shared by....no one else.....Direct burial is SOP with cable,phone, electric and satellite.
I expect nothing. The fatc is that while prices have gone down to the consumer the costs for materials to provide the consumer with service have continued ot rise. All this while pay rates have tumbled.
You have no idea what you are talking about. My work is impeccable.
You sit there an criticize me from afar, knowing nothing of my work or work ethic. All because I choose to work within the parameters of what Dish considers to be a standard install.
You are the one who flip flopped all through this issue. First you protested about having to pay at all. Then you wrote you'd be willing to pay for the conduit. Now you are trying ( unsuccesfully ) to start sh*t with me by calling my work substandard.
Here's the deal....Customers will pay for non standard work and that's that.. Protests al you like, Speculate as to the quality of my work until your ass falls off. You'll get nowhere with anyone in this business on this issue.
By the way..Based soley on your posts and in the absence ony evidence proving your accusations of my alleged substandard work ,I believe I am a Galaxy better than you...Discussion terminated. Have a nice life.
Don't make this personal..You have been so advised.

dishcomm

Feb 25, 2008

daro said:
DISH Network -- Installation

Not technical? Looking for an easy way to ger your new DISH Network TV system up and running? Standard Professional Installation is FREE! (Savings of $199 - Limited time offer.) Let our experts bring satellite television into your home for FREE!

Standard Professional Installation Includes

Site survey (at time of installation)

Assembly of dishes and mount(s)

Grounding of system components

System peaking for optimum performance

Installation of up to 120' RG-6 cable

One wall cable penetration

Testing of equipment for proper operation

Orientation to DISH Network programming and equipment

Materials Provided At No Charge:

Up to 120' RG-6 cable

Coaxial cable connectors

Grounding equipment

Weather sealant for connections
and structure penetration

well that just about sums it up....Notwithstanding the opinion of the OP....Who seems to think what ever he demands to be free ,should be.

Hemi 6.1

Feb 25, 2008

Your the one talking about free! We are talking about doing your job! Grounding systems! You can take it all personal. You just think your worth way more then you get paid . Like we should be lucky we get what we get. Just remember when ,you or another Tech,put splicing underground,in the dirt and it fails. The customer pays for this when it fails ,NOT YOU!

dishcomm

Feb 25, 2008

Hemi 6.1 said:
Your the one talking about free! We are talking about doing your job! Grounding systems! You can take it all personal. You just think your worth way more then you get paid . Like we should be lucky we get what we get. Just remember when ,you or another Tech,put splicing underground,in the dirt and it fails. The customer pays for this when it fails ,NOT YOU!

Who is talking about not grounding?..Your inability to stay on point (conduit for burial) indicates your argument has grown so weak that you are now trying to save yourself by deflecting the discussion from the issue at hand. We're done ..Get it? Good.
Condiut is non standard. Customer pays. That's that..

Hemi 6.1

Feb 25, 2008

dishcomm said:
Who is talking about not grounding?..Your inability to stay on point (conduit for burial) indicates your argument has grown so weak that you are now trying to save yourself by deflecting the discussion from the issue at hand. We're done ..Get it? Good.
Condiut is non standard. Customer pays. That's that..

Good Done then! Atleast from me ,But wait untill others get started. I'm sure they aren't all done yet! Keep up the good work!

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dishstaller

Pub Member / Supporter Lifetime Supporter

Last reply 9 minutes ago · posted in The Chit Chat Club

Country singer John Anderson died today

He was 71 yrs old. One of my favorite songs is Seminole Wind....the violin is killer.

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W8sh9P3X33w

4 Replies · 12 views

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Reactions: navychop and comfortably_numb

FTA4PA

21 minutes ago

Rest In Peace

mikew

13 minutes ago

I Wish I Could Have Been There is an amazing song. Rest in peace Mr Anderson.

Bobby

11 minutes ago

Rest in peace.

comfortably_numb

9 minutes ago

Hope you're out there Swingin', John.

SuperDish_Fan23

Last reply 12 minutes ago · posted in DISH Network Support Forum

Its crazy how the ViP922 is so rare for no reason.

Why are ViP922s So rare? like its crazy how ebay has none, i checked everywhere, also, i got a ViP222k now, which is actually activated!

19 Replies · 447 views

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Strega

Today at 2:34 PM

That's not really unusual. Cable companies like to the provide the box too. The phone company provided the phones in until the government forced them to allow third-party phones.

Reactions: charlesrshell

Almighty1

Today at 7:02 PM

Strega said:
That's not really unusual. Cable companies like to the provide the box too. The phone company provided the phones in until the government forced them to allow third-party phones.

Yes, the Western Electric phones that says "Bell System Property, NOT FOR SALE, Western Electric".

Reactions: AZ., Bobby and charlesrshell

Bobby

Today at 8:30 PM

Almighty1 said:
Yes, the Western Electric phones that says "Bell System Property, NOT FOR SALE, Western Electric".

In my very early work life I installed and repaired those phones.

Reactions: charlesrshell, Almighty1, Foxbat and 1 other person

AZ.

Today at 9:10 PM

Almighty1 said:
Yes, the Western Electric phones that says "Bell System Property, NOT FOR SALE, Western Electric".

someone is showing their age

Reactions: Almighty1 and charlesrshell

Almighty1

Today at 9:38 PM

AZ. said:
someone is showing their age

LOL. It depends if the person saw it during the years when they were actually still available which is 1968 to 1983 meaning the person could be 43-58 years old or they can even be a few years old if they learned to read and write at a young age and actually saw a telephone with that label somewhere recently just like even here in San Francisco, payphone still exist physically in public places but whether they can be used or not is a different issue. It still looks like this even today:

Reactions: charlesrshell

dishstaller

Today at 10:03 PM

I opened my Radio Shack in Sept 1984 and right about that time they did the whole deregulation thing with the phone companies. I bought TONS of those phones that had been refurbished with a new outer shell. You could throw one of those out of a 3 story high window and it would still work.
That was an interesting time in history. I would have older customers come in and ask about phones.....they were terrified that they were going to get into trouble hooking up a second phone without the phone company knowing about it. One of the funniest episodes of WKRP was the one where Johnny thought the cops were showing up because they had an unregistered phone. I guess younger folks can't conceive of a time when you were limited to the number of phones you could have in your house....and limited to the length of the cord

Reactions: navychop and charlesrshell

navychop

12 minutes ago

AZ. said:
someone is showing their age

You should hear his stories about when rocks were soft and pterodactyls were the new kid on the block!

Reactions: Bobby

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MartyDe

Last reply 36 minutes ago · posted in Over the Air Television By RabbitEars.Info

ATSC 3 converter boxes

Interesting article about the work being done to develope an ATSC 3 converter box. Yes it does mention affordable.

Pearl TV Issues Progress Report on Low-Cost 3.0 Converters in Advance of NAB Show New York

Group has secured lower pricing from key tech players to make less costly boxes available

www.tvtechnology.com

6 Replies · 192 views

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navychop

Yesterday at 12:03 PM

DEATH TO NEXGEN!

Reactions: primestar31, RaVo68, gms49ers and 1 other person

TRG

Yesterday at 12:12 PM

17 years ago the US turned off analog OTA signals in favor of digital broadcasting. Now the push is ATSC 3 "Nextgen TV". But nobody seems to be able to agree on DRM implementation protocols. People don't want to hook their TV up to the internet in order to watch over the air TV. At least I don't. With all the data they collect about your viewing habits the box should be given away at no cost.

Reactions: N5XZS, osu1991, slow_poke_pete and 1 other person

navychop

Yesterday at 12:27 PM

Comb your hair.

primestar31

Today at 7:29 PM

navychop said:
DEATH TO NEXGEN!

It's dead, they just don't know it yet. They killed it by forcing DRM on it, and that TOTALLY botched implementing it.

There is absolutely NO compelling reason for anybody to switch to ATSC3.0. They only want it as a total and complete money grab.

Reactions: FTA4PA and navychop

navychop

36 minutes ago

I truly hope you are right.

Reactions: FTA4PA

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TWiT Tech Podcast Network

42 minutes ago · posted in TWiT Tech Podcast Network

Club TWiT: Mikah's Crafting Corner

Time for another AWESOME video from the TWIT Network!

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1bRMaZHVPGg

Direct YouTube Link - Club TWiT: Mikah's Crafting Corner
TWIT's Website
TWIT Live Feed

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TWiT Tech Podcast Network

42 minutes ago · posted in TWiT Tech Podcast Network

Security vs. Features: The Windows Update Problem

Time for another AWESOME video from the TWIT Network!

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OHxdmb3SE2E

Direct YouTube Link - Security vs. Features: The Windows Update Problem
TWIT's Website
TWIT Live Feed

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reubenray

Last reply Today at 10:13 PM · posted in DISH Network Support Forum

Dish vs Streaming Apps?

Every time my Dish contract comes up I weigh the options of keeping Dish or switch to streaming. Right now I can watch/record the OTA channels vis my HDHomerun. I also can stream CBS and NBC via the Paramount+ and Peacock apps. What I would need to find is how to watch the Food Network, HGTV, Syfy, USA, Hallmark channels, Great American Family, Lifetime channels plus a few more with an app or two. My current Dish bill is $118, so I should be able to get a few apps for a lot less.

Any suggestions? I would want the best picture quality and audio quality I could get.

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Bruce

Today at 1:17 PM

reubenray said:
Every time my Dish contract comes up I weigh the options of keeping Dish or switch to streaming. Right now I can watch/record the OTA channels vis my HDHomerun. I also can stream CBS and NBC via the Paramount+ and Peacock apps. What I would need to find is how to watch the Food Network, HGTV, Syfy, USA, Hallmark channels, Great American Family, Lifetime channels plus a few more with an app or two. My current Dish bill is $118, so I should be able to get a few apps for a lot less.

Any suggestions? I would want the best picture quality and audio quality I could get.

USA and SyFy content is on Peacock, you can receive the rest of those channels via Philo, only $25 a month.

Philo - Stream Live and On-Demand TV

Why pay more for TV? Start your Philo free trial and enjoy live TV plus on-demand content starting at just $25/month. Stream hit shows, movies, and more.

www.philo.com

Reactions: Bobby, osu1991, reubenray and 1 other person

Almighty1

Today at 6:55 PM

reubenray said:
Every time my Dish contract comes up I weigh the options of keeping Dish or switch to streaming. Right now I can watch/record the OTA channels vis my HDHomerun. I also can stream CBS and NBC via the Paramount+ and Peacock apps. What I would need to find is how to watch the Food Network, HGTV, Syfy, USA, Hallmark channels, Great American Family, Lifetime channels plus a few more with an app or two. My current Dish bill is $118, so I should be able to get a few apps for a lot less.

Any suggestions? I would want the best picture quality and audio quality I could get.

This is what Google Search AI says, let's see how good AI can really solve problems.

To perfectly cover your specific channel checklist while saving significantly on your $118 Dish Network bill, you can leverage your existing HDHomerun setup alongside a live TV streaming service or app combination.
Since you require USA and Syfy, budget entertainment-only streaming apps like Philo ($28/mo) or Frndly TV ($7–$11/mo) will not work as standalone solutions because they exclude NBCUniversal networks. [1, 2]
Here are the best ways to get all your channels, optimized for high picture and audio quality:

Option 1: Hulu + Live TV (The All-In-One Match)
Hulu + Live TV ($89.99–$99.99/mo) is the most seamless replacement because its base tier natively carries every single channel on your list: [1, 2, 3]

Channel Checklist: Food Network, HGTV, Syfy, USA, Hallmark Channel, Hallmark Mystery, Great American Family, Lifetime, and Lifetime Movies. [1]
Quality & Audio: Hulu + Live TV is widely praised by cord-cutters for its excellent high-bitrate 1080p video quality at 60 frames per second (fps) on compatible streaming hardware. It supports 5.1 Dolby Digital surround sound on most live channels and compatible home theater systems.
Bonus Value: The price automatically bundles the entire on-demand libraries of Hulu, Disney+, and ESPN+, which gives you a massive amount of additional content. [1, 2]

Option 2: YouTube TV (The Premium Interface Alternative)
YouTube TV ($82.99/mo) is highly regarded for its robust streaming stability, unlimited DVR, and highly polished user interface. [1, 2, 3]

Channel Checklist: It includes Food Network, HGTV, Syfy, USA, Hallmark channels, and Lifetime.
The Catch: Great American Family is not in the base lineup and requires the Sports Plus or Entertainment Plus add-on package, which increases the monthly cost.
Quality & Audio: It streams in 1080p/60fps with an advanced compression codec that minimizes buffering. It features native 5.1 surround sound audio across major streaming hardware platforms.

Option 3: The Maximum Savings "App Stack" Combination
If you want to maximize your financial savings by skipping a massive live TV guide, you can split your checklist across a few dedicated streaming apps. Because you already pay for Peacock, you can cross USA and Syfy content off your list, as Peacock hosts most of those networks' premium shows next-day or live.
By adding the following, you can build a highly customized tier:

Frndly TV ($6.99–$10.99/mo): This affordable live app brings you all 3 Hallmark channels, Great American Family, and the Lifetime networks with a classic cloud DVR.
Discovery+ ($4.99–$8.99/mo): This gives you the full, deep on-demand libraries and live feeds for Food Network and HGTV. [1]

Total Estimated Stack Cost: Around $12 to $20/mo combined on top of what you already pay.

Quality Note: Frndly TV maxes out at 720p/1080p high-definition with stereo audio, while Discovery+ supports highly optimized crisp 1080p and selective 4K video playback with strong digital audio depth on high-end streaming sticks. [1]

Cord-Cutting Tips for Peak Quality

Streaming Hardware Matters: To get the best possible image processing and audio passthrough, use dedicated streaming hardware like an Apple TV 4K or a high-end Roku Ultra rather than relying on the built-in smart TV operating systems.
Check Your Bandwidth: Ensure your home network has a stable downstream speed of at least 25–50 Mbps dedicated to your main television device to ensure the streaming apps auto-negotiate to their highest available bitrate and frame rates without dropping down to lower resolutions.

Reactions: dishstaller and charlesrshell

reubenray

Today at 7:54 PM

Almighty1 said:
This is what Google Search AI says, let's see how good AI can really solve problems.

To perfectly cover your specific channel checklist while saving significantly on your $118 Dish Network bill, you can leverage your existing HDHomerun setup alongside a live TV streaming service or app combination.
Since you require USA and Syfy, budget entertainment-only streaming apps like Philo ($28/mo) or Frndly TV ($7–$11/mo) will not work as standalone solutions because they exclude NBCUniversal networks. [1, 2]
Here are the best ways to get all your channels, optimized for high picture and audio quality:

Option 1: Hulu + Live TV (The All-In-One Match)
Hulu + Live TV ($89.99–$99.99/mo) is the most seamless replacement because its base tier natively carries every single channel on your list: [1, 2, 3]

Channel Checklist: Food Network, HGTV, Syfy, USA, Hallmark Channel, Hallmark Mystery, Great American Family, Lifetime, and Lifetime Movies. [1]

Quality & Audio: Hulu + Live TV is widely praised by cord-cutters for its excellent high-bitrate 1080p video quality at 60 frames per second (fps) on compatible streaming hardware. It supports 5.1 Dolby Digital surround sound on most live channels and compatible home theater systems.

Bonus Value: The price automatically bundles the entire on-demand libraries of Hulu, Disney+, and ESPN+, which gives you a massive amount of additional content. [1, 2]

Option 2: YouTube TV (The Premium Interface Alternative)
YouTube TV ($82.99/mo) is highly regarded for its robust streaming stability, unlimited DVR, and highly polished user interface. [1, 2, 3]

Channel Checklist: It includes Food Network, HGTV, Syfy, USA, Hallmark channels, and Lifetime.

The Catch: Great American Family is not in the base lineup and requires the Sports Plus or Entertainment Plus add-on package, which increases the monthly cost.

Quality & Audio: It streams in 1080p/60fps with an advanced compression codec that minimizes buffering. It features native 5.1 surround sound audio across major streaming hardware platforms.

Option 3: The Maximum Savings "App Stack" Combination
If you want to maximize your financial savings by skipping a massive live TV guide, you can split your checklist across a few dedicated streaming apps. Because you already pay for Peacock, you can cross USA and Syfy content off your list, as Peacock hosts most of those networks' premium shows next-day or live.
By adding the following, you can build a highly customized tier:

Frndly TV ($6.99–$10.99/mo): This affordable live app brings you all 3 Hallmark channels, Great American Family, and the Lifetime networks with a classic cloud DVR.

Discovery+ ($4.99–$8.99/mo): This gives you the full, deep on-demand libraries and live feeds for Food Network and HGTV. [1]

Total Estimated Stack Cost: Around $12 to $20/mo combined on top of what you already pay.

Quality Note: Frndly TV maxes out at 720p/1080p high-definition with stereo audio, while Discovery+ supports highly optimized crisp 1080p and selective 4K video playback with strong digital audio depth on high-end streaming sticks. [1]

Cord-Cutting Tips for Peak Quality

Streaming Hardware Matters: To get the best possible image processing and audio passthrough, use dedicated streaming hardware like an Apple TV 4K or a high-end Roku Ultra rather than relying on the built-in smart TV operating systems.

Check Your Bandwidth: Ensure your home network has a stable downstream speed of at least 25–50 Mbps dedicated to your main television device to ensure the streaming apps auto-negotiate to their highest available bitrate and frame rates without dropping down to lower resolutions.

WOW! Thanks for this info. I have Roku Ultra and I have a 300mbps internet plan.

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dishstaller

Today at 10:13 PM

reubenray said:
WOW! Thanks for this info. I have Roku Ultra and I have a 300mbps internet plan.

You'll see the Friendly TV app on your Roku....it's preloaded. If you pay by the year it is under $100 for the entire year. Nice mix of channels.

Reactions: charlesrshell

dishstaller

Pub Member / Supporter Lifetime Supporter

Last reply Today at 10:09 PM · posted in The Chit Chat Club

You can't even trust the cost per ounce info in grocery stores anymore

I'm surprised Walmart hasn't banned this guy from all of their stores. He has been on their CASE the past few months.

View: https://www.youtube.com/shorts/f3zr37ekgKM?feature=share

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Juan

Today at 11:17 AM

dishstaller said:
I'm surprised Walmart hasn't banned this guy from all of their stores. He has been on their CASE the past few months.

View: https://www.youtube.com/shorts/f3zr37ekgKM?feature=share

When walmart set a price...they weigh the container and the product...the product label only shows the weight of the product...I am sure if you brought your own plastic baggies to bring the product home you could get the cheaper price

dishstaller

Today at 11:47 AM

Juan said:
When walmart set a price...they weigh the container and the product...

Then they are stupid. Everyone knows that the price per ounce should be the price per ounce of actual product.

Reactions: Jimbo

Juan

Today at 1:38 PM

dishstaller said:
Then they are stupid. Everyone knows that the price per ounce should be the price per ounce of actual product.

You are paying for the whole thing

telstar_1

Today at 2:22 PM

Juan said:
You are paying for the whole thing

Well, the bag can't weigh that much, right? But by law food product packaging must display the actual net weight of the product, i.e., the contents of the container, so by any logic, if not law, a store's stated per-ounce cost should reflect that figure. But since there's not any law regulating shelf statements, a store can say whatever it wants without violating any rules. So I guess the answer is more consumer legislation. Or simply caveat emptor.

Jimbo

Today at 6:26 PM

telstar_1 said:
Well, the bag can't weigh that much, right? But by law food product packaging must display the actual net weight of the product, i.e., the contents of the container, so by any logic, if not law, a store's stated per-ounce cost should reflect that figure. But since there's not any law regulating shelf statements, a store can say whatever it wants without violating any rules. So I guess the answer is more consumer legislation. Or simply caveat emptor.

I would think that the Vendor/Maker of the product would have a say in it, showing the Correct weight ...
You would think it would be in the contract.

I do look at the ounces of items, but unless its way off, I don't check the math, may have to start now.

Remember when you use to get a 13.5 oz bag of Chips .... Thats a PARTY Size now.

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TRG

Today at 6:41 PM

Jimbo said:
I would think that the Vendor/Maker of the product would have a say in it, showing the Correct weight ...
You would think it would be in the contract.

I do look at the ounces of items, but unless its way off, I don't check the math, may have to start now.

Remember when you use to get a 13.5 oz bag of Chips .... Thats a PARTY Size now.

I remember when a pound of coffee was 16oz. Now its 12oz, they don't call it a pound anymore and its three times the cost of the 16oz pound.

Reactions: dishstaller, slow_poke_pete and Bobby

Jimbo

Today at 7:05 PM

TRG said:
I remember when a pound of coffee was 16oz. Now its 12oz, they don't call it a pound anymore and its three times the cost of the 16oz pound.

Well, they don't call it a pound anymore ....

Ice cream is that way too, use to be a half gallon, now its 1.5 quart or some say 48 oz

Reactions: Bobby

NYDutch

Today at 7:39 PM

Jimbo said:
Well, they don't call it a pound anymore ....

Ice cream is that way too, use to be a half gallon, now its 1.5 quart or some say 48 oz

We have a regional ice cream company here that advertises that their ice cream containers are still a full half gallon.

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Jimbo

Today at 8:54 PM

NYDutch said:
We have a regional ice cream company here that advertises that their ice cream containers are still a full half gallon.

Now check and see if any of them (probably a few) are actual Ice Cream ...

Most Ice Creams are Not actual Ice Cream.
Bryers for example, call Most of thiers "Frozen Dairy Dessert"

NYDutch

Today at 9:05 PM

Jimbo said:
Now check and see if any of them (probably a few) are actual Ice Cream ...

Most Ice Creams are Not actual Ice Cream.
Bryers for example, call Most of thiers "Frozen Dairy Dessert"

All of their traditional flavors are ice cream, only some of the specialty mixes are are labeled frozen dairy. They also have frozen yogurt flavors that are labeled as such.

Reactions: Jimbo, Bobby and Foxbat

dishstaller

Today at 10:09 PM

TRG said:
I remember when a pound of coffee was 16oz. Now its 12oz, they don't call it a pound anymore and its three times the cost of the 16oz pound.

All through high school I worked at the local home-owned grocery store. I never cease to be amazed at how packing has shrunk through the years. I worked 1978-end of school 1982 so I worked right through all the inflation that was taking place then. Taught me life-lessons that still are with me. My primary job on Saturdays was doing all the price changes....back then you used a price gun, so I had a front row seat. Sugar REALLY went through the roof which is why we now have high fructose corn syrup in just about everything we eat nowadays .

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niembre

Last reply Today at 9:57 PM · posted in DISH Network Support Forum

OTA no working after Update

My OTA is not working anymore. This started after the latest update. I have the OTA dongle with a OTA antenna that I've been using for years. My hopper does not recognize the dongle anymore and when I go to the OTA setting, it has a screen that says to plug a dongle into the USB. I tried unplugging and plugging back, in the same usb port and other ports. The Hopper does not recognize it. Anyone have same issue?

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Scott Greczkowski

Sep 24, 2026

Did you people having this issue contact Brittany yet? Shes trying to keep track of things and it would be good for you to contact her as maybe she can get this somewhere and get fixed.

Now while unofficial, I am hearing this issue wasn't caused by DISH's software team, but was caused by a chipset driver update that seemes to have hosed some older USB devices. If this is indeed the case I can see why DISH didn't know and why they are slow in fixing it as they need the chipset company to fix its drivers and release them to DISH so they can be pushed out to all.

DISH does not hate you guys nor do they want you to buy new USB dongles. I am rather sure they didn't even know this was an issue until they saw it posted.

Again contact Brittany if you are having this issue, so she has your info and hopefully she can do something for you to keep you happy.

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bookworm370

Sep 25, 2026

Scott Greczkowski said:
Did you people having this issue contact Brittany yet? Shes trying to keep track of things and it would be good for you to contact her as maybe she can get this somewhere and get fixed.

Now while unofficial, I am hearing this issue wasn't caused by DISH's software team, but was caused by a chipset driver update that seemes to have hosed some older USB devices. If this is indeed the case I can see why DISH didn't know and why they are slow in fixing it as they need the chipset company to fix its drivers and release them to DISH so they can be pushed out to all.

DISH does not hate you guys nor do they want you to buy new USB dongles. I am rather sure they didn't even know this was an issue until they saw it posted.

Again contact Brittany if you are having this issue, so she has your info and hopefully she can do something for you to keep you happy.

Thanks, but until they do, can't Dish just revert to the old driver that worked? Then test the new driver when delivered,d before pushing it again.

But then what does an old CIO know! I've only reamed quite a few buttholes from my people that didn't do that!

Reactions: ppappas, Almighty1 and charlesrshell

slow_poke_pete

Sep 27, 2026

bookworm370 said:
Thanks, but until they do, can't Dish just revert to the old driver that worked? Then test the new driver when delivered,d before pushing it again.

But then what does an old CIO know! I've only reamed quite a few buttholes from my people that didn't do that!

dish can't revert back to older drivers or updates. although just one reason not to buy the ota dongle!!!

Reactions: charlesrshell

ppappas

Sep 30, 2026

slow_poke_pete said:
dish can't revert back to older drivers or updates. although just one reason not to buy the ota dongle!!!

They can absolutely put the old driver back if they wanted. This is an embedded software environment in which they have total control. All they have to do if build a new version of firmware with the old OTA driver and test it of course. They just don't want to spend the resources doing so. If they are not going to continue supporting the single tuner adapter, then they have to say so.

Reactions: slow_poke_pete and charlesrshell

navychop

Sep 30, 2026

This Chipset s/w is not controlled by Dish.

Reactions: gms49ers and charlesrshell

Almighty1

Oct 1, 2026

ppappas said:
They can absolutely put the old driver back if they wanted. This is an embedded software environment in which they have total control. All they have to do if build a new version of firmware with the old OTA driver and test it of course. They just don't want to spend the resources doing so. If they are not going to continue supporting the single tuner adapter, then they have to say so.

Unless of course they didn't keep a copy of the old drivers and can no longer get it. Then there is always the their support for the product is EOL after a x amount of time so it will make the consumer have to buy the current product offering.

Reactions: slow_poke_pete and charlesrshell

Briant73

Today at 9:19 PM

Anyone heard any updates on this, I'm still having the issue so thought I'd check in.

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Almighty1

Today at 9:48 PM

Briant73 said:
Anyone heard any updates on this, I'm still having the issue so thought I'd check in.

No updates but if you can get DISH Technical Operations to roll you back to H710 or earlier even though H708 would be best because it also eliminates another problem like in this comment, you will also no longer have the problem as long as you don't update manually or forced to any new version until the problem is fixed as the problem started in H711 and still exist in H712 and H713.

https://www.satelliteguys.us/xen/th...ftware-version-713-is-out.423921/post-5108817

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dishstaller

Today at 9:57 PM

Installed an off-air antenna a couple days ago for a customer who had just cancelled his Dish service. He had a dual off-air adapter and gave it to me. Cool. I'll keep it on the truck....might come in handy. Got to admit I don't watch anything as far as live tv goes anymore. Even if we have severe weather, our local channels will have a live feed on Youtube.

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Gary Toma

Staff member Pub Member / Supporter Cutting Edge

Last reply Today at 9:33 PM · posted in DIRECTV Technical Resources Forum

DIRECTV Transponder Map ~ Data 10/21/2026

The TPN Map Excel Presents all DIRECTV Channels:

National (50-States or wide/NAT+PR beams)
Local (Local-Into-Local or narrow/Spot beams)

Additional tabs provide:

OTA the (Over-The-Air) Database
VOD (Video On_Demand) Records
Offline Records
Engr Records
Net Decoder a graphic presentation of all satellites and transponders

Domestic Satellites
@99W...... D11, D14
@101W.... D16
@103W.... D12, D15
@110W.... D5
@119W.... D8

Understanding the TPN Map

Making Sense of the TPN Map Display Conventions

DIRECTV_TPN_Map_261021.xlsx 1,876 KB

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KyL416

Today at 7:25 AM

HAWKS, HORNETS, GRZZLIES, HEAT, MAGIC, CAVLIERS, TWOLVES, BUCKS, PACERS and SPURS channels have also been added, however they are pointing to a TV Promise slate, which says they are working with DAZN and others to strike a deal for those teams.

Some more TPN swaps

coolman302003

Today at 5:44 PM

KyL416 said:
HAWKS, HORNETS, GRZZLIES, HEAT, MAGIC, CAVLIERS, TWOLVES, BUCKS, PACERS and SPURS channels have also been added, however they are pointing to a TV Promise slate, which says they are working with DAZN and others to strike a deal for those teams.

Some more TPN swaps

It appears we are not getting both home & away feeds out of market on League Pass for these teams either…

I've been watching the Spurs home feed on channel 676-1 (was part time San Antonio specific feed) out of market with NBALP for YEARS on satellite (through the multiple iterations of Fox Sports SW, Bally Sports SW, FanDuel Sports SW) Looks like that will not happen unless a deal is reached with DAZN. I do see the placeholder channel on 680 if it happens.

Reactions: Nate.O’Brien

KyL416

Today at 5:58 PM

coolman302003 said:
It appears we are not getting both home & away feeds out of market on League Pass for these teams either…

Center Ice does have the non-carried feeds, including the Hurricanes, Wild, Blues and Blue Jackets and spotbeam local only teams like the Panthers, Mammoth and Golden Knights. So it probably depends on the available part time bandwidth each night as things they are able to provide to in market viewers in the 600s, PPV Events in the 100s and commercial events in the 9000s get priority first, along with games where neither team has a remappable feed.

Reactions: Mr Tony and coolman302003

coolman302003

Today at 6:51 PM

League Pass tonight for example (it is almost a full slate tonight):
Hawks @ Magic (only Hawks feed which is easy to insert since its OTA this season and simulcast across multiple Gray Television markets, Magic signed a non- exclusive streaming deal with DAZN and also OTA)
Bucks @ Wizards (only Wizards feed easy to remap, Bucks are OTA & there own streaming service Bucks+)
Hornets @ Nets (only Nets feed which DirecTV already carries so simply YES remap, Hornets signed non-exclusive streaming deal with DAZN, also OTA)
Bulls @ Raptors (Bulls only feed via CHSN remap, its common that we don't get Raptors feeds that often)
Jazz @ Grizzlies (Jazz only feed OTA easy to insert, Grizzlies signed streaming deal with DAZN)
Pacers @ Pelicans (Pelicans only feed which is OTA easy to insert, Pacers signed streaming deal with DAZN)

Maybe it will change but it looks like DirecTV may only carry DAZN feeds on NBA LP when there is no other option, such as when two teams (either Cavaliers, Pacers, Grizzlies, Timberwolves, Spurs) that are both DAZN exclusive are playing each other, we shall see as the season goes on I guess.

This NBA season will be the first in a long time where many League Pass games are carried on feeds DirecTV doesn't normally carry or are only available through OTA spot beams. It'll be interesting to see how it plays out, especially whether we eventually get both home and away feeds for these teams out of market again.

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jamieh1

Today at 8:24 PM

Now in the Hornets and Hurricanes markets we just get the TV promise screen. But Directv still charges sports fee I am assuming.
Luckily my DTV stream package doesn't have a rsn fee. Figure DTV that always says is the leader in sports would have come to an agreement by now.

Reactions: Mr Tony

KyL416

Today at 9:33 PM

jamieh1 said:
Now in the Hornets and Hurricanes markets we just get the TV promise screen. But Directv still charges sports fee I am assuming.

Greenville-New Bern is $11.99 for MASN (Orioles) and Nationals
Raleigh is $11.99 for MASN and Nationals
Charlotte is $12.99 for BravesVision, MASN, Nationals and Reds

The fee in NC also includes the higher in state rate they have to pay for ACCN. Down in SC the fee is $15.99 as they are also a SEC state.
I'm not sure if they're doing it with those teams, but in some markets they also use the fee to cover the additional cost they have to pay for independents and MyNet stations that picked up full season NHL and NBA rights.

If you go to the TVPromise site, you'll likely be able to get a credit for not getting the Hurricanes and additional Hornets games that air on WITN-D2

jamieh1 said:
Figure DTV that always says is the leader in sports would have come to an agreement by now.

Part of the hold out might be the packaging and price for outer areas like how the Thunder needs sports pack for other states. Hopefully they are also pushing for a guarantee from the teams that they would require whoever wins their local broadcasting rights in 2028 to negotiate with MVPDs as most of the DAZN, Prime and NBA.tv streaming deals are just for the current season. Commercial distribution rights are probably a factor too.

I'm guessing they got a deep discount for ClipperVision based on how long it took them to announce their TV deal after they were basically handed a multi-year draft death sentence.

The Predators and Pistons channels are using feeds supplied by Scripps Sports

The Heat likely depends on whoever they sign for the Fort Myers DMA, as there's no point in paying a high price for the Heat just for that DMA when WPLG is streaming it for free on their app and website for viewers in the Miami DMA, and they already carry the West Palm Beach station.

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Foxbat

Supporting Founder Pub Member / Supporter Lifetime Supporter

Last reply Today at 9:18 PM · posted in Computers and Gadgets

LFP Power Supplies for UPS

I've been using APC UPS units to protect my computer and Home Theater equipment for many years, but now there are a number of companies producing "Glamping" power accessories that can provide hours of 120 VAC power for off-grid use at a camp site or a few hours of power when severe weather knock out the power. I had mentioned elsewhere that I picked up a Jackery HomePower 3000 to use instead of a gasoline generator to provide emergency power for our refrigerator. The 3.0 kWh of Lithium Iron Phosphate battery cells can supply power for over 24 hours and is "light" enough that I can move it into the kitchen to allow it to power the fridge. However, it's not an automatic operation, as I need to move it from its home in the closet to the kitchen, in addition to rolling the refrigerator out from its alcove so I can plug it in.

The Jackery wasn't my first LFP Power Bank; I had purchased an EcoFlow River 2 unit with 512 Wh of capacity. I had purchased this to use on our Home LAN to give it a longer run time than the three hours that I had with the APC UPS I had been using. This isn't an odd use case, EcoFlow advertises this capability on its website and a transfer time of 16 mS. I used this River 2 to supply power to a 16-port Cisco gigabit switch, the AT&T router, Printer Server, MoCA adapter, and surveillance camera NAS. All told, about 35 W of load. With the EcoFlow River 2, it reported approximately 12-13 hours of run time. So far, so good.

After it had been in use for a month or so, I was down in the basement and heard a whirling sound. Turns out the State of Charge was 24% and it appeared the River 2 was off-grid even though it was still plugged in. Well, turns out that the firmware had a big bug in it for people that were using it like I was. I communicated with EcoFlow and eventually they sent a newer firmware that fixed this problem. But before they fixed it, I decided that I had such a good experience with the Jackery, that I bought their Explorer 1000 (1,070 Wh capacity) which should run our home network for over a day. It worked great right out of the box, and even when it was charging, the cooling fan was practically silent.

After the River 2 was patched, I put it to work, replacing the APC UPS powering the bedroom TV with Dish 4K Joey and Apple TV. The LG OLED uses quite a lot more power than I expected, depending on the scene, it can have a 120 Watt power draw. With the River 2, that might limit power-out watching to 4-5 hours. Also, the River 2 still had the issue with its cooling fan, I find it disturbing the quiet bedroom environment.

EcoFlow had one of the Spring sales and have a new EcoFlow Delta 3 1000 Air which was on sale for $299. That's a 960 Wh capacity power bank with a 10 ms power switching, so this seemed like a perfect solution. Well, except for two things: 1) It has one grounded NEMA 5-15 receptacle; 2) even though EcoFlow claims "35 dB @ 1m" quietness, it was even louder that the River 2 was. Not optimal!

So, I ended up swapping the Jackery Explorer 1000 with the EcoFlow Delta 3 1000 Air since the power demands for the Home LAN are less, and the loud fan noise won't bother anyone. The bedroom TV setup says it should be good for approximately 7 hours:

I realize that at some point the amount of money spent on these individual long-term Power Backup solutions will be more expensive than if we just bought a whole-house power solution. Those are coming down in price, but we're still looking at $16,000 at a minimum for a LFP solution, and $10,000 or so for a home LP generator solution. (With the LP generator solution, we would need to also pay the Gas utility to increase the size of our gas line, so that tilts me towards a the battery solution.)

Finally, I tried an Amazon 12 VDC LFP battery that replaces the Lead Acid Gel Cell in a normal UPS with an equivalent set of LFP cells. The price was roughly the same as a 12 VDC battery from Batteries+, and it's been running for about a year now with no difficulty. But these APC UPS units won't run for long, and are really intended to allow the powered equipment to be shut down in an orderly manner.

So, am I weird to use these Camping power banks for Home emergency power solutions? I haven't even touched the idea of Solar panels to supplement the run time in an Outage.

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navychop

May 14, 2026

I would not trust a UPS designed for lead acid to properly charge, discharge and maintain a LFP battery.

Sounds like it'd be cheaper to move where the power is more dependable. Like near me. Quite a few houses in this neighborhood go for less than $1M.

Are you weird? If you seriously consider moving for this - YES!

Foxbat

May 14, 2026

navychop said:
I would not trust a UPS designed for lead acid to properly charge, discharge and maintain a LFP battery.

As I understand the LFP replacement, it has its own BMS that is designed to mimic the Lead Acid battery characteristics. The UPS thinks it's a Lead Acid battery, and provides the appropriate voltage when charging.

Like I said, it was a one-off to test the product, but I prefer to look at the Jackery power products at this point. I'm unhappy with the EcoFlow misrepresenting their noise level. The Jackery is a much better choice for co-existing with people. The EcoFlow works (once the firmware is debugged) in uninhabited areas like garages or basements. I have used Anker cables and small battery packs, but they also have larger capacity power banks and whole-house solutions.

Moving to a different state to solve a power issue? I think you're more prone to hurricanes in Virginia than we are here in Indiana. Sure, you don't get the blizzards and snowfall like we do, but when you do, it's a much bigger deal than it is here.

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Foxbat

Today at 9:18 PM

Added an Anker Solix S2000 for the Internet / Home LAN power which should provide well over a day with the current load. Since I'm looking at replacing the AT&T 2Wire DSL setup with Starlink, the power requirements might increase, so I wanted something that would work for an extended power outage.

Picked it up from Amazon during the October Prime Days for $649. Slightly better $/kWh than the Jackery Home 3000 I got for the refrigerator.

The EcoFlow Air 1000 is now providing uninterrupted power to the Family Room TV and entertainment center (Hopper 3, Denon AVR, Apple TV, etc.) In use, it's reporting about 300 Watts, so it should be able to run for three hours in an outage. Anything longer and we won't be watching movies.

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