Another Question for Scott

Scott Greczkowski

Scott Greczkowski

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Sep 7, 2003
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Sorry, I have heard nothing. And no new beta has been rolled out to us testers yet.

I am still on the pre release beta.
 
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WeeJavaDude

SatelliteGuys Pro
Sep 25, 2003
766
0
SoCal
I doubt you will get an answer that is meaningful. Unless I missed an earlier discussion, the question is like asking when will your software be bug free or when will you take all the bugs out that you introduced with your last release.

This question is very complex and not easily answered when stated so broadly. Even stated concisely it is not easily answered.
 
A

aperry

SatelliteGuys Pro
Sep 26, 2003
700
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Yeah, being the recipient of many problem reports that say basically "it doesn't work", including some details are the best.

However, the details are called out on the site here (and other sites), so it wouldn't be too hard for them to figure it out...
 
G

Guest

Guest
What ? This is the first time we have heard of any problems with the software. If you will pull your smart card out and reinsert..........
 
D

DmitriA

Active SatelliteGuys Member
Sep 11, 2003
24
0
Of course, if they had open-sourced the GUI user-level application that is responsible for the guide and PVR functions (but not encrypted storage of recordings), many of these bugs would be worked out by now by volunteers submitting patches with bugfixes and new features
 
Big Bob

Big Bob

SatelliteGuys Pro
Oct 4, 2003
220
4
DmitriA said:
Of course, if they had open-sourced the GUI user-level application that is responsible for the guide and PVR functions (but not encrypted storage of recordings), many of these bugs would be worked out by now by volunteers submitting patches with bugfixes and new features

Yeah, just look how well it worked for Navigator. Oh wait, that took 2 years longer than they hoped to get the first almost-working version out.

Maybe Linux is a better example. No, wait, they slipped the latest version by over 6 months.

<sarcasm off>

Open-source is great for some things, but it comes at a cost. Frankly, I don't see a long line of volunteers waiting to write code for this. If you have the talent and ambition to write something like this, you most likely be working on a project that has a much wider impact. And remember, there must be a long line of people willing to test the code after it has been submitted.

Again, I am an open source supporter. It just is not the answer in all cases, and I believe that this is a case where it would not work.
 
A

Allamand

SatelliteGuys Family
Oct 5, 2003
87
0
2nd ? for Scott,

How can I become a Beta Tester so i can get the same Ver. you have :)
 
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DmitriA

Active SatelliteGuys Member
Sep 11, 2003
24
0
Big Bob said:
Again, I am an open source supporter. It just is not the answer in all cases, and I believe that this is a case where it would not work.

The point is not that these open-source guys would write everything for Dish for free and Charlie would sit back and relax and just make money. You still need a core group of dedicated (and paid) developers working full-time on the product, no question about it. But with open-source, you get a lot of drive-by coders who see a bug or a feature they really want, get annoyed that it's not yet done and just spend an evening digging deep into the code to fix it. I've done it on a number of projects myself for things I use on a daily basis and I'm sure there are many people like me in that regard...
 
davhol

davhol

SatelliteGuys Family
Supporting Founder
Sep 8, 2003
74
0
Utah
One of the "problems" with "Open Source" development of a satellite TV product is that the "family jewels" would be there for ALL to see and hack! If you recall, the base OS for the 721 is Open Source (a version of Linux) but the code that does the actual satellite receiver work is FAR from being open! This code is QUITE proprietary and will always be that way! One: to prevent piracy (in case some bright-eyed person sees a flaw in the code) and Two: to keep the prying eyes of the competition blinded. If we lived in a world where the next guy didn't try to get something for nothing, maybe this idea would work, but in our current world, this is just a (nice) dream. Sorry!
 
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DmitriA

Active SatelliteGuys Member
Sep 11, 2003
24
0
That's why I said - GUI application only. There is no hacking value in seeing the way their timer code works, for example. The stream decryption is done at a much lower hardware level, as is the harddrive storage encryption. To be fast enough for real-time operations, it probably has to be done all in hardware.

As for competition getting their look at the code, I wouldn't worry too much about it - I seriously doubt that Tivo or any other competitior would want ANY part of the 721 code in their product (nor would their customers)...
 
davhol

davhol

SatelliteGuys Family
Supporting Founder
Sep 8, 2003
74
0
Utah
DmitriA said:
...As for competition getting their look at the code, I wouldn't worry too much about it - I seriously doubt that Tivo or any other competitior would want ANY part of the 721 code in their product (nor would their customers)...

Well, that's for today's code. If the GUI were to become opensource (and, presumably from what you're advocating, "better"), what would prevent/restrain them (Tivo, competition) from "borrowing" this so-called wonder-code and removing any competitive edge (or vice versa, if Dish used some competitor's "open source" GUI code)?
 

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