Best way to combine a Channel 9 signal with other high VHF from different antenna?

[anik]

We basically just lost our CBS affiliate here - if you look at the map at http://www.fcc.gov/dtv/markets/maps_report_0609/Grand_Rapids-Kalamazoo-Battle_Creek_MI.pdf for station WWMT, we are in one of the "orange diamond" areas - so yes, we SUPPOSEDLY have service from another CBS affiliate. Well, if you look at http://www.fcc.gov/dtv/markets/maps_report_0609/Traverse_City-Cadillac_MI.pdf for WWTV, that's the other CBS affiliate. Notice it's on "real" channel 9 and in almost the complete opposite direction from the other stations, which have their digital signals on (among others) channels 7,8, and 11.

Suppose I were to put up another antenna specifically for channel 9 - how could I combine it on the internal system so it appears with the other channels? Having a switch at each TV is NOT an acceptable solution, I would not even consider that for several reasons (Really: NOT AN OPTION, so please don't push it). Running a separate wire from the channel 9 antenna down the tower IS acceptable (and something I planned on doing anyway) but once I get the cables from the "main" antenna and the Channel 9 antenna into the house, what's the best way to combine them so they don't interfere with or cancel out each other? In particular I don't want Channel 9 to attenuate Channel 8 in any way.

Converting channel 9 to a different channel (especially one in the 2-4 range) WOULD be acceptable (as a matter of fact I'd like to also do that for digital channel 19, for a different reason) but only if it's a simple frequency shift and the channel is still digital - I don't want to convert the signal to analog. I also don't want to spend a ton of money on a frequency converter (in other words, no $800 cable system grade stuff).

So is what I want to do even possible or should I just forget about Channel 9? Again, PLEASE don't even suggest using a switch at each TV, I have some very valid reasons for saying that just isn't going to work.

 

[n1wbd]

Channel Master used to make what they called a combiner that would allow you to "combine" a separate antenna into a existing antenna system with no ill effect.

check ChannelMaster.com or Solidsignals.com to see if they still make it.

We basically just lost our CBS affiliate here - if you look at the map at http://www.fcc.gov/dtv/markets/maps_report_0609/Grand_Rapids-Kalamazoo-Battle_Creek_MI.pdf for station WWMT, we are in one of the "orange diamond" areas - so yes, we SUPPOSEDLY have service from another CBS affiliate. Well, if you look at http://www.fcc.gov/dtv/markets/maps_report_0609/Traverse_City-Cadillac_MI.pdf for WWTV, that's the other CBS affiliate. Notice it's on "real" channel 9 and in almost the complete opposite direction from the other stations, which have their digital signals on (among others) channels 7,8, and 11.

Suppose I were to put up another antenna specifically for channel 9 - how could I combine it on the internal system so it appears with the other channels? Having a switch at each TV is NOT an acceptable solution, I would not even consider that for several reasons (Really: NOT AN OPTION, so please don't push it). Running a separate wire from the channel 9 antenna down the tower IS acceptable (and something I planned on doing anyway) but once I get the cables from the "main" antenna and the Channel 9 antenna into the house, what's the best way to combine them so they don't interfere with or cancel out each other? In particular I don't want Channel 9 to attenuate Channel 8 in any way.

Converting channel 9 to a different channel (especially one in the 2-4 range) WOULD be acceptable (as a matter of fact I'd like to also do that for digital channel 19, for a different reason) but only if it's a simple frequency shift and the channel is still digital - I don't want to convert the signal to analog. I also don't want to spend a ton of money on a frequency converter (in other words, no $800 cable system grade stuff).

So is what I want to do even possible or should I just forget about Channel 9? Again, PLEASE don't even suggest using a switch at each TV, I have some very valid reasons for saying that just isn't going to work.

 

[Jim5506]

If you don't have signals from the other direction on channels 8 and 10, you might be able to use a jointenna by Channel Master tuned to channel 9.

It passes channel 9 only on one side and blocks 8,9 and 10 on the other side, letting you get a cleaner union of seperate antennas.

Channel Master JoinTennas

 

[Tower Guy]

PLEASE don't even suggest using a switch at each TV.

Don't bother with a Jointenna, it'll ruin any chances of channel 8. A backwards splitter will add loss, noise, and multipath; so rule out that option.

A conveter box tuned to channel 9 and fed to a second input on the TV is an option that will work with a remote.

 

[anik]

I knew about the Jointenna, would be perfect if it didn't knock out channel 8. And I know enough not to use a backwards splitter. However I have wondered if something like this would work: The main antenna already has a preamp up close to the antenna, with power supply at the bottom. Could a second antenna also be run into an amplifier and the the output of the two amplifiers combined using a backward splitter (since both antennas are being run through a one-way amplifier, I just wonder if that would minimize any normally adverse effects).

What about if both antennas went into separate small distribution amps (say something like a couple of Channel Master CM3410's, just to pick a model out of thin air) and then the outputs of both amplifiers were immediately fed into a backward splitter using maybe 3-inch coax stubs - I don't imagine that the signals can pass backward through an amplifier, and I'd have to think that such a short length of coax from the amp outputs into the splitter would prevent multipath issues, but maybe I'm not understanding the problem fully.

I think I have said before, what's really needed (and could solve a LOT of problems) is a digital demodulator/remodulator - basically something that would take a single channel from an antenna, extract the digital stream, and remodulate it onto a different channel that could be fed into a home system (WITHOUT converting to analog). I'm sure cable companies have things like that, but even the least expensive units I've seen are running about a grand now, and I suspect someone could make a consumer-grade unit and sell it for a lot less but so far, no one has (that I'm aware of).

Actually, you know what some smart company really ought to make, now that electronics are getting so small? A multi-channel unit that could be mounted on top of a tower (like an antenna preamp) but that would convert any four channels to any other four channels before even sending them down the cable. So, for example, you could convert that somewhat weak high UHF channel down to a low VHF frequency before even sending it down the coax, reducing loss and other issues. And, if that device could also accept feeds from multiple antennas, you could do just about any combination. Remember we are talking digital streams here, heck maybe you could even send them all down the tower on weatherproof Cat 5 and then remodulate them at the bottom - lots of interesting possibilities if you really think about it!

 

[CowboyDren]

If they're nearly 180 degrees apart, have you considered swinging the antenna about to see if you can get acceptable signal from your main cluster on the back side of the antenna?

 

[gcd0865]

What about using an adjacent channel bandpass filter from TinLee? It would be more expensive, but might work better than a Jointenna. Perhaps you could call them and ask if it would work for your purpose...

Tin Lee Electronics :: Bandpass Filters
Tin Lee Electronics :: Bandpass Filters