Big Ten Network

[BigTimMN]

those of us E* customers dont "already have Sunday Ticket or Extra Innings". there is a sizeable # of customers (and potential customers), that will switch if no agreements are made, maybe not right away but it will accelerate churn over time in the big 10 region

The big question is if E*, Comcast or Time Warner will cave and come to an agreement, if they one does, then the others will almost surely follow, as it would mean 2 out 3 main competitors in many markets will offer it.

 

[flyingsquirrel]

NONE of the big MSOs (multiple system operators) left will cave. It's too much money and it's going to set a precedent. If they give $1.10 a month per subscriber on an extended basic tier to BTN, What are they going to have to pay for SEC-TV? or ACC TV?

The cost of BTN is going to be the starting point for some of those. SEC is going to cost what BTN does, plus a 30% to 50% premium, because those fans in the south east really are nuts. if BTN is $1.10, then SEC will be closer to $1.75.

The cost of Big 12 tv, ACC and Big East TV will likely be somewhat lower than BTN. I would guess Pac 10 would be about the same.

So for the Big MSOs, this is a HUGE issue.

They figure that they have already lost the really big sports fanatics to D*, that anyone who would leave for BTN already left for Sunday Ticket. How many more subs are they going to lose for the BTN? Not many.

How many people have left Dish over Extra Innings? Too few to matter judging by the financials.

I am a Big Ten alum who played back in the day. I like college sports. I am a college sports official. Three of my partners and four of my associates are Big Ten alums. Two have season football/baseketball tickets. None of them are switching. None are particularly concerned. All have Comcast. I have Dish. One is considering switching if Comcast does not pick up TBS HD because they have the Baseball playoffs.

My point: Comcast and TimeWarner are holding all the cards on this one. If I were in their position (and I negotiate contracts as part of my job), I would not even be returning the BTN's calls until they cut the price by AT LEAST 30%.

Dish may pick up the channel in the interim as long as their contract contains most-favored-nation language. Then it will have the best of both worlds: It would have the channel before cable, but benefit from whatever concessions cable can extract.

By the way, last I heard BTN was not even going to be on every Campus Cable system at launch.

 

[Albie2]

NONE of the big MSOs (multiple system operators) left will cave. It's too much money and it's going to set a precedent. If they give $1.10 a month per subscriber on an extended basic tier to BTN, What are they going to have to pay for SEC-TV? or ACC TV?

The cost of BTN is going to be the starting point for some of those. SEC is going to cost what BTN does, plus a 30% to 50% premium, because those fans in the south east really are nuts. if BTN is $1.10, then SEC will be closer to $1.75.

The cost of Big 12 tv, ACC and Big East TV will likely be somewhat lower than BTN. I would guess Pac 10 would be about the same.

So for the Big MSOs, this is a HUGE issue.

I don't think the SEC would get the premium you are suggesting as the SEC doesn't have the same leverage that the Big Ten does, while the SEC is a bunch of football fanatics there is not near the interest in Basketball in the SEC that there is in the Big Ten. I do however agree that this is a very big issue to the MSO's especially with the current and upcoming negotiations over digital and HD rights to the network affiliates. I also think they realize this is the most important test they will face as the Big Ten has the most negotiating leverage due to the demographics of their market.

As a disclaimer on my statements I have lived in SEC country for the last 9 years so I have witnessed it firsthand (The football fanaticism and the relative lack of interest in basketball with the exception of Kentucky).

 

[taylor2767]

Will everyone stop all the debate and vote with your wallet. I'm leaving E* by the end of the week when D* installs my HD DVR. I'm choosing not to sit around to hope and wonder if E* and others will decide to carry the BTN. It's not that big of a deal to me who is my cable/sat provider.

 

[t3rror]

I don't think the SEC would get the premium you are suggesting as the SEC doesn't have the same leverage that the Big Ten does, while the SEC is a bunch of football fanatics there is not near the interest in Basketball in the SEC that there is in the Big Ten. I do however agree that this is a very big issue to the MSO's especially with the current and upcoming negotiations over digital and HD rights to the network affiliates. I also think they realize this is the most important test they will face as the Big Ten has the most negotiating leverage due to the demographics of their market.

As a disclaimer on my statements I have lived in SEC country for the last 9 years so I have witnessed it firsthand (The football fanaticism and the relative lack of interest in basketball with the exception of Kentucky).

Thanks for the disclaimer about Kentucky.

 

[db2]

Will everyone stop all the debate and vote with your wallet. I'm leaving E* by the end of the week when D* installs my HD DVR. I'm choosing not to sit around to hope and wonder if E* and others will decide to carry the BTN. It's not that big of a deal to me who is my cable/sat provider.

I don't mean to derail the thread but how did you do this? Did you cancel E* first and then sign up for D*? How easy was it to send back your E* equipment? I am considering this myself but I am going to wait until D* gets their new satellite running. If E* doesn't have BTN by then I might leave.

 

[oswald]

I have embedded my comments inside of the quote (in bold print; hopefully not too confusing).

NONE of the big MSOs (multiple system operators) left will cave. It's too much money and it's going to set a precedent. If they give $1.10 a month per subscriber on an extended basic tier to BTN, What are they going to have to pay for SEC-TV? or ACC TV?

The cost of BTN is going to be the starting point for some of those. SEC is going to cost what BTN does, plus a 30% to 50% premium, because those fans in the south east really are nuts. if BTN is $1.10, then SEC will be closer to $1.75.

Maybe a premium per subscriber, but they would make considerably less overall if both got into basic tiers in their regions--Big Ten population is much greater than the South's.

The cost of Big 12 tv, ACC and Big East TV will likely be somewhat lower than BTN. I would guess Pac 10 would be about the same.

So for the Big MSOs, this is a HUGE issue.

They figure that they have already lost the really big sports fanatics to D*, that anyone who would leave for BTN already left for Sunday Ticket. How many more subs are they going to lose for the BTN? Not many.

How many people have left Dish over Extra Innings? Too few to matter judging by the financials.

Have to recognize that EI appeals mainly to people who now live outside of where their hometown/favorite team plays. Most baseball fans get their hometown/favorite teams via RSNs. Big Ten fans will miss games of their 'favorite' teams. Comparing apples to oranges.

I am a Big Ten alum who played back in the day. I like college sports. I am a college sports official. Three of my partners and four of my associates are Big Ten alums. Two have season football/baseketball tickets. None of them are switching. None are particularly concerned. All have Comcast. I have Dish. One is considering switching if Comcast does not pick up TBS HD because they have the Baseball playoffs.

My point: Comcast and TimeWarner are holding all the cards on this one. If I were in their position (and I negotiate contracts as part of my job), I would not even be returning the BTN's calls until they cut the price by AT LEAST 30%.
I would agree with this statement. Comcast, in particular, seems fully willing to play hardball with sports programmers (see what they did to the almighty NFL recently with the NFL network). But BTN has indicated for awhile that they are willing to negotiate on price, so I think they won't get 1.10 from anyone else who signs. But obviously the big sticking point is placement in the 'required' tier. I don't think they will give on that this year, and I don't think the other MSO's will give this year either.

Dish may pick up the channel in the interim as long as their contract contains most-favored-nation language. Then it will have the best of both worlds: It would have the channel before cable, but benefit from whatever concessions cable can extract.

By the way, last I heard BTN was not even going to be on every Campus Cable system at launch.

 

[jeffwtux]

Will everyone stop all the debate and vote with your wallet. I'm leaving E* by the end of the week when D* installs my HD DVR. I'm choosing not to sit around to hope and wonder if E* and others will decide to carry the BTN. It's not that big of a deal to me who is my cable/sat provider.

That's fine, but you are going to feel really stupid when BTN folds because they couldn't get carriage agreements with anybody but DTV.

 

[dishcomm]

I'm sure the BTN is set to go at least 2 seasons without Comcast or other large cable companies.

Their trump card are the angry fans, who will become more and more unhappy as games are missed. It's the same game that the NFL Network is playing. Many of the same cable providers who haven't picked up the BTN are also not carrying the NFL Net.

The BTN, in the form of all of the B10 schools athletic directors, is looking at the long term picture. If it takes a few years to sign everyone up, then that is what it takes. If they wanted to sign everyone up quickly at a very low rate structure, then they would have gone in that direction.

They have no reason whatsoever to back down at this point. They want to wait until Ohio State, Michigan, Wisconsin, Penn State, and other schools' fans miss some games.

Miss which games?..The ones against U. of Buffalo? PSU is facing that school in football this season...How many will watch that?..About 20 or 30 thousand tops?..So the rest of us should have to buy a channel in which we have no interest?

 

[Posty-McPOst]

Will everyone stop all the debate and vote with your wallet. I'm leaving E* by the end of the week when D* installs my HD DVR. I'm choosing not to sit around to hope and wonder if E* and others will decide to carry the BTN. It's not that big of a deal to me who is my cable/sat provider.

Some of us aren't leaving E* and would like to be informed about ongoing developments.

 

[jldhawk]

$1.10 per sub is a MINIMAL cost for another HD channel and to top it off, it is a HD SPORTS station. Big Ten Sports.
I think I agree with some of you about blaming Dish Network for this pi$$ing match. BUT E* did win their battle with OLN/Versus last year on the NHL season. E* only wanted them on the upper teir, VS wanted basic tier...Guess where VS was located the last time I checked? (TOP 250 pack) ALSO the Vs HD channel isn't even a stand alone channel, they share with Golf CHannel.
Dish will win this battle, (So that is why I am switching SOONER then later) (I'll give them two weeks, three weeks the Hawks are playing Syracuse on BTN ,This battle will take time, but still have the same outcome.

 

[taylor2767]

I don't mean to derail the thread but how did you do this? Did you cancel E* first and then sign up for D*? How easy was it to send back your E* equipment? I am considering this myself but I am going to wait until D* gets their new satellite running. If E* doesn't have BTN by then I might leave.

I havent cancelled just yet but will after the install. I basically will break even though I break a svc. commitment. I'm ok with that because I'm not willing to be a pawn in this fiasco.

 

[taylor2767]

That's fine, but you are going to feel really stupid when BTN folds because they couldn't get carriage agreements with anybody but DTV.

Not worried at all about failure, too much $$ invested for that to happen and it really boils down to timing of when the rest will jump onboard. Just , think about this thread once the remaining sat/cable see the horizon. BTW, on the local news today(Cols,OH) D* installers reported a two week install delay.

 

[taylor2767]

Some of us aren't leaving E* and would like to be informed about ongoing developments.

That's your choice as it is my choice.

 

[ArtWIS]

Miss which games?..The ones against U. of Buffalo? PSU is facing that school in football this season...How many will watch that?..About 20 or 30 thousand tops?..So the rest of us should have to buy a channel in which we have no interest?

I'm in Wisconsin and we will only have one football game this season that will be BTN exclusive. But then comes the big ten basketball season and two thirds of the Wisconsin big ten conference games will be BTN exclusive. Haven't heard anything about hockey or other sports yet.

 

[jimboeau]

Not worried at all about failure, too much $$ invested for that to happen and it really boils down to timing of when the rest will jump onboard. Just , think about this thread once the remaining sat/cable see the horizon. BTW, on the local news today(Cols,OH) D* installers reported a two week install delay.

Companies invest big $$ all the time on ventures that don't pan out.

 

[taylor2767]

Companies invest big $$ all the time on ventures that don't pan out.

That might be true but not within the next few yrs .it wont happen/

 

[oswald]

Some poster made a reference earlier in this thread about how the BTN had crossed the line of good business decorum. Wonder if that poster would like to comment on the following story: Seriously, They Can Both Buzz Off: Comcast Lowers Itself To Impersonating You - Deadspin

 

[FKy.Guy]

Thanks for the disclaimer about Kentucky.

Yeah,what he said !!!!!!!!!

 

[Hall]

Ohio State's football program could probably float the Big 10 Network for a few years themselves.... They already fund the entire athletic department and carry a profit year after year. I'd guess a number of other programs, i.e. Michigan, for example, is in a similar situation.